On another thread I saw this topic starting and thought it was worth following up on.

Why don't African PH's like muzzle Brakes? I made a comment that I won't spot for a client who has one fitted and my tracker won't hold his shooting sticks. Nor will I back up a client who has a brake fitted - reason - I will be standing well back from him when he shoots. Some PH's have taken to wandering arround the bush with a pair of electronic ear muffs on. When the client sets up to shoot they pull their muffs on and step back.

I don't go with that. Even with ear protection the blast from most brakes is enough to put one off so as to make a back up shot impossible anyway. Also if something then goes wrong you are still trying to find yourself. Much better to be standing well backwere you are unaffected by the side blast.

Hearing is a very important sence especially when hunting in the jess. The charge that gets somebody is not the one that comes from infront where you can see it. It comes from the side or behind where you can hear it. Both I and my tracker need to be listening out for the hit/danger etc not trying to cover our faces and block our ears.

Wear ear plugs- takes too long- most clients take far too long to shoot anyway. Depaending on where you are hunting I recon on arround 2 to 3 seconds from when the right oportunity arrises to when it passes. There isn't time to be speaking to the client, putting in plugs and watching the quarry through your bino's. Had a very unfortunate incident earlier this season with a client who had wounded a buff and we were following up on it- finally after a couple of days of circling round in very thick jesse the bull stopped and looked at me. 10 yards- easy. Client couldn't see it from where he was so I told him to step in front of me and fire as soon as he had a good sight picture. He stepped forward (rifle with brake!) I stepped back trying to block my ears and at the same time keep my rifle ready, The bull stepped sideways and a cow stepped forward to have a look! Cow went down.

With that I throw it open to the forum!

Ganyana, have you or your hunters ever used the electronic hearing protector/enhancers? You put them on and they allow you to speak to others without taking them off; they even let you hear way beyond the capabilities of your human ear - all the while blocking gunshot-level sounds. And they're very tiny, and cost about US$150-200.

Would you spot/PH for me if I gave you one for free to keep?

Fine and reasonable if that policy is laid out PRIOR to booking.

George

I once owned a lightweight mountain rifle in .300 weatherby. The kick was so severe I finally installed a break. I was developing a flinch and was afraid of the very real accident of cutting open my head at the most inopertune time. After installation, the rifle kicked like a .243 but the blast was horrendus. Not only from the side, but from the top and bottom also. At the range it would knock the crap off of the overhang and down on my head. It would also kick up dust from the ground.

I figured that this was a worse case than having the kick because at the moment of truth, all my senses are concentrated on the shot, not the rifle. If I was too close to the ground, or a bush, or somebody was standing too close to the side, or whatever, well, you get the picture. I sold the gun. Lesson learned=heavy kickers require a heavier gun and a good designed stock....

Brakes have no place in the field. They are way too loud, and the blast is disconcerting to say the least.

I have them on four of my rifles, but never use them except on the bench.

I don't blame you one bit for the position you have taken.

Ganyana,

Do you find the Magna Port system as obnoxious as the add on brakes?

Rich Elliott

Many of our hunters use muzzle brakes and we hunt them never the less as we certainly cannot afford to pick and choose our clientele..It does not seem to bother the PHs that I use, its a non issue, so please send me your clients that have them on their guns

Many of the deer and antelope hunters that I guide each year, use muzzle brakes...I just stick my fingers in my ears when they shoot. Almost everyone that shoots the 500s or big Weatherbys have muzzle brades..

I will allow that you will loose a certain amount of hearing with or without muzzle brakes if you do not wear hearing protection every time a gun goes off...I lost my hearing before anyone used muzzle brakes..Its called cordite ear and everyone my age that has hunted any amount at all has suffered hearing loss, it goes with the territory, like it or not.... I suspect that Ganyana has had some hearing damage also?

Anyway, I can barely hear a blast these days, and as a matter of fact I like my quite world! When I put on my hearing aid, it drives me nuts, and the docs tell me that is what all of you hear every day, wow!, glad I have lost some of that hearing!

I had to laugh when I saw that Weatherby tape of Wby. Jr. and Boddington wearing ear plugs when they were buff hunting in Botswana. I think they were using brakes on the then new 416 Wby.



There are a lot of calibers/guns around that don't need brakes, so why bother with ones that do? A 30-06 will do most anything a 300 Wby will do. And to go buff hunting with ear plugs is just asking for trouble. I wonder what the sound ear muffs make when a buff steps on them.



I figure that if you need ear plugs and brakes, or hearing aids, stay out of the kitchen.

Will, what bullshit. If a person needs hearing aids they are not to hunt? I use electronic shooters protection (ESP) which can also be turned up for amplification of sound also, I sure wish I would have found them years ago.

... besides wearing earmuffs or even electronic earplugs is probably going to get a bit old after a couple of hours in 100+ degrees heat....

If you need a brake to shoot your rifle, get the job done with a smaller caliber that won't hurt you or cause you to flinch as badly.
- mike

Out of courtesy to my PH and hios staff, I had a gunsmith remove my brake and make a collar to cover the threads. I didn't even ask for the brake back.

As our friend Kyler says, "Muzzle brakes do not reduce recoil, they simply spread it amongst your friends."

This is a very interesting subject and one that I am particularly interested in at this time. I am having a lightweight "sheep" rifle built right now in a .300 Weatherby wildcat. As the rifle will only weigh just shy of 8 pounds, scope, strap, shells all in. Advice that I have been given is to have the muzzle brake built in as this rifle will be too light to shoot without, translation, severe recoil. I own numerous rifles,.222, 22-250, .243, .270 Weatherby .300 Weatherby, .416 rigby, .470 NE, but all are heavy rifles so I don't have any experience with "sheep" weight rifles. I do know that I do not want to sacrifice the performance by going to smaller calibers, lower grain bullets, etc,.. as this rifle will be for longer ranges. I have never shot a muzzle brake and I am not normally that recoil sensitive, (although that .416 Rigby is violent and has "bit" me a time or two). In the lighter weight rifles, what is are the opinions and pros and cons from those who have such a set up. Thank you in advance for any input.

I'd certainly never dream of telling a client he (or she) can't use a brake on their rifle. It's their money, their hunt and their rifle, so as far as I'm concerned they can use a catapult or a howitzer if they like.

Having said that, I hunted with a client recently who had a braked rifle from Ed Plumber of American Hunting Rifles (www.hunting-rifles.com) and that didn't cause any "backlash" whatsoever. All the blast went up and down and not out the sides...........bloody great design!

Muzzle brakes are for weenies. Grow up and just learn how to shoot a big bore.

In many years of hunting with big bores, not once do I recall the pain of recoil when dropping game in the field. A muzzle brake is about as useful as a gas-powered toothbrush.

Amen to that!

If you wear a combination of the highest decibel protection-rated ear plugs AND muffs, you will NOT have adequate protection against potential hearing loss that is caused by the extreme noise level created by muzzle breaks. If any African hunting company refuses business because they don't want breaked rifles on safari, it is for good reason: They are trying to protect the hearing of their professional hunters, trackers, and assorted staff members, as well as the client.

Why do you think that Browning was brought into a class-action lawsuit over it's BOSS device? Why do you think that it is no longer offered (and hasn't been for some time) on at least the Winchester Model 70 line of rifles? Why do you think that an UNBREAKED BOSS device was eventually offered as an aftermarket replacement accessory?

My advice is this: Learn to deal with the recoil of an unbraked rifle. If you can't handle the recoil of an unbreaked .458 Lott or .416 Weatherby, go with an unbreaked .416 Remington or .375 H&H instead.

For those outfits who still produce ported muzzle breaks, I can only say one thing: For you, the ride has just begun..........

AD

Any one that complains about the sound produced by brakes and doesn't complain about the muzzle blast from 375 and up is the south end of a north bound horse.

DOJ.

I figured that would stir a few folks up.

Because of his job, my father was about half deaf by the time he was my age, electronic hearing aids and all. Maybe one could get away with that stuff hunting plainsgame in a non-dangerous game area, but hunting DG with all those contraptions is dangerous indeed.

I wouldn't have wanted my father following up any wounded Cape buffalo with the hearing handicap he had, nor would I want him around if I was doing it.

So you will just have to keep on hating me!

Have I got a deal for YOU!

Measure -- by actual instrument test -- the decibel level of an UNBREAKED .375 H&H with a 24" bbl. versus a BREAKED .375 H&H firing exactly the same ammunition; also out of a 24" bbl.

If the BREAKED .375 H&H is just as quiet as the UNBREAKED .375 H&H, I'll buy you the new scope of your choice.

My word is good (ask anybody who knows me) so try me.......

AD

DOJ - I shoot several varmint/target rifles with muzzle breaks. The blast and sound difference is magnitudes higher over a traditional muzzle. As Allen Day pointed out, the blast from a muzzle brake is transferred to your middle ear through your skull. This transference is bone induced - hearing protection cannot stop this. You can wear all the hearing protection you wish, but muzzle brakes will cause nerve damage over time.

You can pretend it won�t hurt your hearing, however, the mechanics and damage are well documented...

Ganyana,
Had to reply to post on muzzle brakes. Part of my research before my 1st safari this year was what rifle to use. Read many accounts of not using them or a ported barrel. Bottom line bought Win model 70 in 375 H&H. Used ear muffs at my range, practiced enough to not be afraid of recoil, hit where I aimed. During my hunt, every time I shot at a animal, I never heard the report. Same was true for my Weatherby 300 for plains game.

Muzzle brakes are evil.

I won't hunt with one, and I won't hunt with anyone who uses one.

If you shoot one around a guide or a fellow hunter you are permanently damaging their hearing, even if they are wearing hearing protection.

How can anyone defend permanently damaging another person's hearing?

Big bore rifles are loud, but muzzlebrakes are an order of magnitude louder.

If necessary, use the muzzlebrake to practice with, screw on the thread protector, check zero, and go hunting.

As my girlfriend says, "I miss my hearing".

JCN

Ganyana,



Up here in Norway, quite a lot of hunters are begining to worry about their hearing for obvious reasons. What is becoming more and more popular is to use a suppresor.



I expect to hear lots of comments about how long it will make the rifle. This isn't necissarily so if you use the right type. For example, the BR-Reflex (made in Finland) is a so-called "telescopic" variant, and doesn't extend as far as a traditonal silencer since most of it goes rearward over the barrel:





.



On a bigbore rifle, the sound is obviously not eliminated, but is reduced sufficiently to make it comfortable to hunt with without hearing protection. It also reduces recoil to an amaziing extent! They make them for "any" calibur/rifle too as far as I've understood.



The question is, would something like this be considered illigal in southern african countrys? It might be considered a "mercenary tool" by an uninformed customs officer...



Erik D.

I have a ported .308Win which was basically done on similar lines to Magna Porting...I was a little green when I bought the rifle and had it ported on the advice of a 'smith when in fact I should have bought a better fitting rifle!

I have used it about 15 years now and I my impression is that the porting actually reduces the blast that I hear...indeed shooting an unported 25-06 is far worse...

People standing either side of the rifle do catch the blast however if they are too far forward..In the field the porting seems to dissipate the noise some what as very often other stalkers in the area say they never heard me taking a shot...

Regards,

Pete

IIRC: ANY reduction in sound is considered a suppressor.

I think that's ten and ten, ten years, and ten grand, for the Federal violation, and, they don't negotiate much.

s

In the last two years my PHs have remarked on the knurled muzzle caps threaded onto the ends of the barrels of my .338 Win. Mag., my .375 H&H Mag and my .458 Lott.

The conversations went something like this:

"I assume you're using those caps because your barrels are threaded for removable muzzle brakes and you left the brakes at home."

"Yes."

"Thanks."

If your PH doesn't mention that he thinks you're a jerk for using a muzzle brake--it's only because he's already deaf or just being polite.