So, I took all my goodies, including two rifles, down to the El Paso, TX Customs office. What an unpleasant experience by the way.

Anyway, when I finally found the right person to give me my Form 4457, he told me it's not enough by itself and had me fill out and sign a Form 4455. This looks like a long form 4457. In addition, he told me that I needed to register my rifles with the ATF before leaving the country or they would be confiscated upon my return. I've never heard of such a thing, here or elsewhere. What do you world travelers make of this? Has anybody else been told this? Just wondering where to go from here...

It sounds like another inept government employee who doesn't know what the hell he's doing.

He was just flat out incorrect. You do NOT need to 'register' your guns with anyone to bring them back; the 4455/4457 is all you need to bring your own guns back in without hassle.

George

Ram,

As Mike commented, the guy was a bit uninformed. The 4455 form is the longer version of the 4457 form but is generally used for exports of MOSTLY commercial goods, such as samples, tools or other equipment that come back into the country. And in most cases -- but not all -- the export/import is done via shipments in contrast to a traveller physically carrying and being present with goods.

As for the ATF registration, he's totally out of the loop. -TONY

Yep, that Customs agent is nit wit. Form 4457 is all you need.







Notice that the title of the form is

"Certificate of Registration for Personal Effects< !--color--> Taken Abroad".



Tony described what form 4455 is for; commerical goods, etc.



The info the Customs agent gave you about ATF is also wrong. Just another one of our fine public servants making up answers to questions that he had no clue about.



From the U.S. Customs web site:



Q: How Can I Prove I Didn't Buy My Watch/Camera During My Trip Outside the United States?



A: Foreign-made personal articles taken abroad are subject to duty each time they are brought back into the United States unless you have acceptable proof of prior possession. Documents which fully describe the article, such as a bill of sale, insurance policy, jeweler's appraisal, or receipt for purchase, may be considered reasonable proof of prior possession.



Items such as watches, cameras, compact disc players, or other articles which may be readily identified by a permanently affixed serial number or marking, may be taken to the Customs office nearest you and registered before your departure. The Certificate of Registration (CF 4457) that you will be given will expedite the free entry of these items when you return. Keep the certificate as it is valid for as long as you own the article(s).



From: Frequently Asked Questions from U.S. Residents Who Travel Abroad







U.S. Customs web site: http://www.cbp.gov/



Another good U.S. Customs web site link to check out:

Know Before You Go! - Online Brochure





-Bob F.

The Customs Agents I have dealt with in Dallas and the Custom Agent (yes I said Agent - there is only one - a 55 year old woman) at the local regional airport here in Missouri, have all been well informed regarding firearms. One agent had actually heard of ITAR, but he didn't know what it stood for, nor could he find his manual with the rules.

Regards,

Terry

Customs "Agents" are the investigative branch of the United States Customs Service...they are the named the United States Customs Agency Service...and there are probably 50 of them in the El Paso Office. There duties cover smuggled narcotics, arms and ammo, and a bunch of other investigations...

The people referred to as Customs Agents in this thread are U.S. Customs Inspectors, they man the bridges, do the forms such as the 4457, and normally one inspector is assigned to that duty, but any of them can perform the duty in his absence...

The Inspector you talked to is full of poop, and does not know poop from Shinola...All you need is a form 4457 and its none of ATFs business what you do with your guns unless your taking a machine gun to Africa...

Trust me on this one I was a Customs Agent for several years before a merger put me in what is now DEA that btw lead me to Africa and was instramental to me to become a booking agent overseas...

Ray,
That would be a facinating story, the DEA investigation that took you to Africa. Can you tell it?

Gentlemen, thanks for the replies. I was pretty sure that I only needed the 4457. It never hurts to make sure though, especially after someone supposedly "in the know" tells you otherwise.

SBT,
It was a temporary duty for some months off and on into the drug trafficking activity of some So. Africans and Russians bringing drugs into the USA, Mexico and So. America. It came to a successfull conclusion btw.. Africa has a fairly large drug problem, mostly cocaine and Marihuana at that time just like the rest of the world..

In another incident btw, only a couple of years ago, a fellow originaly from Idaho whom I knew well, was living in RSA and telephoned me and asked me to bring a client to RSA where he could put us on a 75 inch Kudu and bring $50,000 in cash..He said it had 3 full curls and almost 4, I told him he was full of crap and to send my a photo. He got really hot so I told him to kiss off, and not to call me back. He was a strange fellow and I didn't have much use for him, and never felt I could trust him..

A week later he it was concluded that he had murdered a number of people in the USA and was in hiding..I called the Police and told them he had called me..They went to arrest him where he was living in RSA and found the PH he was living with dead and in his own deep freeze. He had been murdered by this guy..They arrested him shortly after that in Las Vegas where he had fled from RSA....He turned out to be a serial killer..Glad he told me 3 curls or I would have took him a client.

I always thought that was an interresting story and could have been the demise of myself and a client.