HI,

I just post the same topic on big game hunting, but I want to make sure that I will get as much information as possible. I look at all sorts of rounds and have narrowed my selection down to a 375 AI or a 416 REm, I have not shot either one, but with a 300 grain in a 375 AI and a 350 in a 416 REM, I think they should be about the same as far as recoil?.If anyone one here has experience in this let me know what is your opinion.I will move to Alaska in 5 years or less and will also hunt Africa down the road. I look at both and with handloads they both shot almost as flat as each other , using the 300 grain with the 375 AI and the 350 in the 416 REM.I like heaver bullets and think the 416 REM is alot more flatter shooting than most people realise.I would like your input as I am going to spend alot of money on this custom rifle, I plan on having MR. Ricks do the work and will have a 25 inch barrel on the rifle.I look at the ballistics and out to 350 yards with the bullet weight I stated there is little differents could use your help in the selection. Thanks you,Kev

With a .416 Remington Magnum there is no need for a .375 H&H Magnum nor an AI version of same. If my .416 Remington Magnum didn't weigh 12 pounds, I wouldn't have had my gunsmith build me a lighter "all around" hunting rifle. Still, if my stocks ever come up ("ha!") and I make it to Africa, both guns are going.

Also... in Africa, I'm sure you could find some .416 Remington Magnum ammo somewhere... and, for that matter, plenty of .375 H&H Magnum ammo... but you'd never find any AI laying around, and fireforming on a hunting shot isn't the way to go (though you "can").

Russ

HI,

Thanks for the information, which would you go with. I like both, but think maybe the 416 REM will shot just as flat as the 375 AI.Like I said I will move to Alaska in 5 years or less and will go to Africa someday, I am wondering if the recoil of the 375AI and 416 REM are about the same if so I would go with the 416 REM. Thanks,Kev

HI,

Someone is looking out for me, thanks for getting my post off that I posted twice. Thanks,Kev

Hi Kev,
My vote is for the 416 Remington magnum, on the other forum too (Big Game).

Hey, you can fire 375 H&H ammo in the 416 Remington too, makes nice brass, but really limits the effectiveness on game. Just a thought.

Kev

I made this decision a year ago. I chose the 416 Rem. Recoil is pushy but not bad. The 350gr bullets at 2700fps really are flat shooting and will kill anything walking, swimming or flying.

Peter

Go with the .416 Rem and never look back. Lay in a supply of brass and you good to go.

Flat shooting??? who needs a flat shooting DGR...not me.
The 416 will shoot as flat as a 375 H&H and thats fine with me...I don't even bother to shoot 350 gr. bullets because they only give you an inch or so advantage in the overall picture...

I shoot 285 gr. Northforks, and 300 gr. Northforks and 400 gr. GSFN solids and they all shoot to the same POI at 100, to 300 yards.

The 375 will do the same, but with a lot less authority...If I were not hunting dangerous game then I would opt for the 375...

The 416 Rem is king of the all around rifles for Africa. and if you want a two gun safari, then match it with a 338 Win...

Not to offend any one but first what can you shoot well. Most of our clients show up with a .375 H&H or one of the 9,3's. It is all a matter of accuracy. While I do not call my self a fan of the .416 bore they are very popular. From personal experience the 416 and the .375 are both effective. I have personally witnessed both calibers in action on all sorts of African game for almost 2 1/2years in the right hands theyare both good. A real change happens when you start shooting stuff with the old .458 Win. and up. I would shoot the .375 AI on buffalo if something larger is desired then the .40 bores and up a better choices. I hope this does not start a problem these are just my personal experiences.

What ever you shoot make sure you use a good bullet.

Ray I do not want to take you to task, but the old .375 and its variation are just fine for lion, leopard, and buffalo. I can appreciate the .416, but I would not call it the king. I hope this does not offend you.

[ 07-18-2002, 04:04: Message edited by: alekojjensen ]

Before his death, Finn Aagard wrote an article, I believe in Guns and Ammo, suggesting that if you were hunting large animals in Africa, he would, at that time, suggest a .416 Remington and a .30/06. I completely agree, although I do love my .375 H&H.

HI,

PETER WALKER, I am wondering what powder you are using in your 416 REM to get the 350 grain bullet to go 2700fps and how long is your barrel. I also would like to know if you have any problem with extration or any sign of high pressure.Thanks,Kev

I'd go with the 416. With a 350 gr bullet, it would be a moose rifle w/ few peers. I have also heard enough reports that suggest the 375 just isn't the be all end all of big bear rounds. I also don't think you'll find that the recoil difference signifigant between the two rounds.

If you want flat, get a .338 or a .300. If you want something that knocks the crap out of things, get a .416. For bear, moose, boo, elk, buff, larger plains game, the .416 is difficult to beat. For the perfect two gun solution for Alaska and Africa, get a .338 and a .416... like you need an excuse for another rifle.

It would seem that if one needs more than the standard .375, it is not more velocity that is needed. More bullet diameter and weight perhaps, but the .375 has plenty of velocity as it is. I am trying to decide between the .375 and .416 for buffalo next year, and leaning toward the .375 with Failsafe bullets.

I agree with what Ray said in regards to the difference in trajectory beytween the 350gr & 410 gr bullets in the .416 calibres. When I was choosing which projectile I wanted to use for my .416 Rigby at 300 yards there was 2" difference between the trajectory's of the two bullets. But the 410 grainer still packed a heabvier wallop. On big game 2" in trajectory is not worth worrying about. So if you do not have plans to own both rifles I would opt for the .416 & sight it in with a 410 gr woodleigh bullet, it will shoot plenty flat enough and it will pack a punch. Recoil is nothing that someone could not master.

Kev - I prefer the 416 for many of the previously stated reasons - with the Swift A-Frame 400 grain, try working up to 82.0 grains of RL-15 with a CCI or Federal primer - you should safely achieve approximately 2450-2475 FPS from a 24" barrel with reliable grouping - work up the load from 76.0 grains in your rifle - KMule

KLN - I would scrap any notions of using a Failsafe on buff. The hollow point is designed for rapid expansion and lots of superficial tissue damage. While devastating on plains game animals, you might have a serious penetration and tracking problem on something thick like a buff. In short there are lots of more suitable bullets available which offer more controlled expansion and superior penetration.

If you are serious about buff, and are considering a two gun solution, the .338 & .416 combination is difficult to beat. For an all-around plains game and dangerous game rifle, the .375 is a weeny, I mean a wiener, pardon me, I meant a winner.

KLN,

I have both a 416 remington (dakota) that weighs only 8 1/4 pounds with scope, ammo and sling, and a 375 improved (10 pounds) with 300 gr at 2,825 fps.

I can shoot the 375 prone as well as a 30-06, so it is versatile.

Velocity is not a problem since the early 1960's. Never had a bullet failure on large animals at point blank range using 270 or 300 nosler (both old and new style), 270 powerpoint, 300 new style silver tip, 270 woodleigh, 250, 275, 300 bitteroot (the first and still best bonded bullet ever made), or 250 swift. Velocity from 2,825 fps to nearly 3,100 fps.

Only bullets that broke up you would expect too, original silvertip (junk), 270 remington (junk), 235 speer (well what did you expect), 270 hornady both old and new style, and original Barnes 250.

The 416 kicks more but you'll like it if you can handle it. I dont think you can shoot this rifle prone if thats important.

The facotry 400 remington/swift ammo is absolutely terrific. To me it is the benchmark that all ofther DGR ammo has to be measured against.

Andy

Interesting point about the Failsafe. Most of the criticism I have heard centered around too much penetration and too little expansion.

One very experienced African hunter told me he did not like them due to overpenetration. He had seen two Zebra killed with one bullet unintentionally.

My experience is limited to the .308 180 at 2550 fps which penetrated completely on Gemsbok and Blue Wildebeest after breaking the near shoulder.

Any other experience with larger Failsafe bullets?

[ 07-25-2002, 21:49: Message edited by: KLN ]

Here in Australia the shooting mags tout them as being "the projectile one should use" if making a trip to Darwin to shoot scrub bull & our Buff if one is taking there 30/06 etc.

I have never used them for I thought they were for really tough game.

Zero Drift-
Please tell me where your information about the Fail Safe bullet comes from. It has been widely criticized in various circles for not expanding enough! Penetration has never been an issue with this bullet, unless you don't care for 100% penetration.

Russ:

My friend and I completely agree. Rule 4: "Be sure of your target and what is beyond it."

[ 07-26-2002, 04:55: Message edited by: KLN ]

I agree with John S.

the Fail Safe, in all calibers, is a Barnes X that works.

they do not blow off petals like Barnes X does. They are a low expansion, high penetration bullet. Local Fish and Game used them in 30-06 for deer and quit using them and went back to Remington core lokt as they had too much penetration and not enough tissue destruction.

Ive used them in 375 and can send you photos of recovered bullets. They have as much penetration as a 300 nosler in 375.

You are right about hollow points sometimes not opening up, as the lead helps get things going. Wood will plug it up if you shoot through a peice of plyboard, tree limb or sapling.

You will find it is a very appropriate bullet for your 375 AI.
Andy

Kev

The powder I'm using in my 416 is Varget. It takes 88grs to make 2713 fps out of a 24" barrel. I have no signs of pressure with this load and case expasion above the belt is no more than if loaded with 2 grs less powder. I did load it down to 2650fps for my trip to Zim this year. Mostly as insurance that I don't get sudden pressure spikes. Kamloops in July and August will hit 35 to 40 degrees in the afternoon and shooting sessions during the heat didn't make any difference, but you can never be to careful and I don't expect the buffalo will be able to tell the difference.

Peter

HI,

PETER WALKER, thanks for the information I was wondering which powder would be best for the 416 REM and it saw either Varget or bl(2), I think that is the powder. I see Varget will get the same fps with less grains and therefore it will not be as compressed. Thanks,kev

JohnS - I agree that the steel cup design on FailSafes does pose an over-penetration problem in most shooting situations. I have always had problems getting them to group worth a damn, so I have never used them in the field. Therefore my information is second hand.

The report about .375 FailSafes came from a PH I know who has used them several times on buff and had clients use them. The problem he reported was the bullets were not tracking properly through the animal and not so much a penetration issue. I don't know if he has recovered any bullets to know if they were bending or shedding too much nose material.

I have sent him an E-Mail asking for more information. I am sure I will hear something from him in a week or so. Sorry that my statement was a little vague and broad. In any event, I think there are more proven bullets for buff in .375 and .416.

[ 07-29-2002, 05:41: Message edited by: Zero Drift ]