George,



It's interesting that you mention the "Ping".



I personally (having no double rifle experiance) would prefer ejectors from the logic of a faster reload.



Another question thus is; Is the effect of the "Ping" with elephant a myth created by Capstick and other writers, or reality?



Erik D:

When choosing a DRG double rifle, would you pick one with or without ejectors?



And why would you choose as you do?



Are any double rifles made with a selector that enables you to switch the ejectors "on and off" such as found on some Beretta SxS shotguns?



Erik D.

I would prefer ejectors. If you need to reload quickly, having the brass ejected while you are moving fresh rounds toward the breech would be better (despite the 'ping' that Capstick seemed to write so much about).

George

I completley agree with what geronimo said.



The usefullness of ejectors far outweighs their drawbacks.



Antonio Arino/Sanchez said it best. A double without ejectors is just a chunk of metal.



My double has them and I wouldn't want it any other way. A fast reload could be the difference between getting the job done and getting hurt.

The "ping" itself is reality. However unlike Taylor and other professional elephant hunters of old, we no longer wade into a herd and try to drop 3 or 4 before it scatters or stampedes.

I had a rather unnerving experience while hunting a tuskless in the Sapi safari area in the Zambeezi Valley, Zimbabwe back in 2000. We found a tuskless cow in a herd of about 12. I took a side brain shot with my double .500NE from about 30 yds.leaning against a tree as a rest. At the shot, the matriarch rushed forward to face the direction of the shot, then slowly she advanced toward us with her ears spread and testing the air for our scent with her trunk. None of us dared move nor even breathe hard as a charge would have been a certainty. After what seemed to be hours, and without any signal(at least any that was audible to human ears), the entire herd turned in unison and rapidly departed. There was great relief all around, especially among our unarmed trackers. In discussing this little adventure later, my PH commented that he was sure glad that I had had not ejected the spent round as it would have certainly telegraphed our position in the eerie silence that attended this event. I must admit that the very same thing was going through my head at the time !

Geronimo

The movement required to break open the action to reload would probably have also caught the elephant's attention.

George

In his book, Safari Rifles, Boddington has some very interesting things to say about the supposed need for ejectors in a double rifle.

He sees no need for them at all. His Army & Navy .470 doesn't have them. He covers the "ping" issue, the slight flick of the wrist needed to dump the empties, which he says can be accomplished in a fraction of a second while breaking open the action, and other matters.

He also notes that the Heym Model 88-B double rifle had selective ejectors/extractors. On one he used, the selector broke off in the field, leaving him with one barrel that ejected while the other only extracted. Heym has since discontinued this feature on its double rifles.

Gentlemen

Picture this... you are breaking open your .600 NE double rifle and the ejectors punch out the two spend cartridges stuff like that will put a great big smile all over your face

Only the budget doubles like Krieghoff and Merkle big game double rifles do not have ejectors. WHY
How come all the top brand London gunmakers offers the option

Cheers,

Andr�

I have used extractors only for many years with my doubles..My new Searcy has ejectors...I like them both but:

After using both I still prefer the extractors because the action drops open by simply releasing the lever, and I can dump the fired cases in a easy move by just rolling the gun up, letting them drop out (low pressure they never stick) and I carry two rounds stuck in my left gloved hand (the glove holds two rounds between the fingers without any effort to hold them on my part) then I just drop those two rounds in and close the action which closes easier with extractors..and no ping if thats an issue.

With ejectors you must forcefully break the action open and this takes extra seconds, and a bit of effort, the ejectors make a double very stiff to operate, at least until its worn out, so it's about a push on the time frame..

I will probably remove the ejectors from my double for awhile at least, BTW when you take the ejectors out of your double, then it automatically becomes an extractor gun for those who are not familair with doubles.. then if I change my mind I will simple reinstall them, its not a big deal...

Thats just my take on situation, its subjective and everyone should decide for themselves by using your double both ways, practice with both and make your own determination, and never take double advise from anyone who does not or has not used a double, tis a whole nuther world.

Ray

I se what you mean but you can not put ejectors on a double that is born with them right ??
It is nice to have the option when you are spending top $$
I do not own a double but have shoot then and like it very much. One day I will get one.
I like the B. Searcy PH in .500 NE you get quite a product for those 9,5 and EJECTORS
I was just trying to say that when looking for a double then look at the brands where you have the most options and not the brands that make strange cocking systems and do not give you the option of chosing ejectors or extractors.

Cheers,

Andr�

My 450/400 Hollis has ejectors. My friend 400 Nitro Express' Hollis doesn't have ejectors. Having used both while hunting I like the smoothness of the action that opens easily without ejectors. Rounds are dumped out with a flick of the wrist or tilt of the barrels. Just my opine!

Nothing wrong with a Merkel with extractors, in 470 or 500 NE. The Merkel factory will add the ejectors on a special order. They offer the high dollar sidelock too, as well as the workmanly boxlock. The sidelock will not shoot anymore accurately or quickly than the boxlock, eh?

The Merkel A&D boxlock with Greener third fastener is a bargain from Merkel. That Greener crossbolt can be a bit stiff and tight when new, but wears in nicely. I wouldn't want the added stiffness caused by cocking of ejectors on closing.

Both Ray and Craig Bodinton agree, good to see. And hopefully the safety cocker-decocker on the Krieghoff and Blaser will soon be defunct. Sometimes the thumb can bump the decocker in recoil and decock the rifle for the second barrel ... totally defeating the purpose of a double rifle.

And hopefully no DG double will ever again be made in a belted or rimless cartridge, or an O/U. Many makers have sinned, some are coming to their senses, and all would if people would quit buying those abominations.

Two of my doubles have ejectors and one has extractors. At first glance you might think ejectors are the best way to go, however I think I spend more time being sure I "catch" the emptys from the ejector guns, and reloading, than just picking them out of the extractor gun and reloading it.I used an ejector rifle and an extractor rifle side by side in Africa and I have not had any drama going from one to the other. I have hunted quite a bit with both types. I have never lost an empty with the extractor rifle, but I have lost a few with the ejector rifles. The only time I think an ejector rifle would be a distinct advantage is when you have shot both bbls and the animal is not down, is very close, and still coming. An ejector rifle might be a little bit faster to open, reload one bbl, and close than an extractor rifle.
I do believe what some people have said that when hunting elephants an extractor rifle is better. If you are in thick cover with a herd of elephants, especially hunting cows, you can reload your rifle silently if it has only extractors. After being within a herd and shooting one elephant at 6 yards, and a few days later being within a herd and shooting another at 12 yards I was glad my 450 No2 had only extractors.
After all is said and done it probably does not make that much difference. I use and like both types.

Both of my Chapuis doubles are extractor guns and I ordered them that way (i.e. I specified non-ejector). I find that the 'flick of the wrist' technique for dumping out fired cases works exceedingly well allowing for fast reloads, with minimum noise and without spraying expensive cases all over the countryside. I think that being able to reload, almost silently, can often be a real advantage and not just in a "middle of the herd" scenario. And while the cost of cases is insignificant, compared to the cost of a hunt, it is still nice to be able to backtrack, after the photos are done and the skinners are hard at work, and pick up your fired cases from a single location.

Yessir, you can install ejectors and change out triggers on most any "quality double" that does not have them or take them out of most any double that has them..I suspect there are some lesser quality guns that you cannot...

I have often thought that a single selective trigger set up like the Browning would be a neat set up , but it's not a well excepted idea among double rifle shooters for some reason which has slipped my mind...Browning at one time had the berries of a trigger set up, a double trigger, single selective option that worked either way, I had one years ago and I loved it....

Thanks Ray

Then their is still hope for the Krieghoff owners
I was at one point considering getting a Krighoff classic big five in cal. 500 NE but did not due to the lack of ejectors.
What would such an upgrade/modification cost ?

Now I am not even considering the Krieghoff. The B. Searcy PH is more my way from birth.

Quote:

---

Browning at one time had the berries of a trigger set up, a double trigger, single selective option that worked either way

---

Ray is that two triggers where you could use the front one for both barrels ?


Cheers,

Andr�

Jeffery

Quote:

---

What would such an upgrade/modification cost ?

---

Southgate ejectors are from US$1,000.00 - 1,500.00. As Ray stated, not all doubles can be modified.

I recently sold a Merkel double because it lacked ejectors. Who can/would do the modification? Will the factory retrofit? I need numbers because I may be able to pick up another Merkel at a good price. I find these guns to be very accurate.

Geronimo