Im at a toss up between guns. I have a 416 rigby which I plan to take my Zim cape buffalo with, but Im also hunting leopard and plains game on the same hunt. The two choices for the second gun are:

Win M70 338 Win Mag VX3 4.5-14 with 225 WL at 2750 fps

Ruger MKII 9.3x62, VX3 1.5-5 with 250 TSX at 2450 fps

Also, have several 270/7mm Rem Mag's but wanted a plus 200gr bullet so dropped them off the list.(?)

I shoot both guns equally as good, and both are equally as accurate.

The 338 Win Mag has a 26" barrel whereas the 9.3 has a 24", both weigh approx the same.

I feel more comfortable shooting 200 yrds plus with the higher magnification of the 338's scope but im not sure that is even a scenario where im going.

Which would you take? Thanks for your input.

Dead Eye

I would take the 338 for no other reason than your scope is much better suited to the leopard hunt than the one on the 9.3.

Mark

Love the 338 combo.
Amen on what Mark said.

Mark,

Why would you choose a 4.5-14x scope over a 1.5-5x scope for leopard?

I'm guessing b/c the standard objective on most 1.5-5 scopes is 20-24mm, while it would be at least 40/42 on the 4.5-14.

Better in lower light conditions.

I think the .338 and .416 combo is excellent for Africa! It was my combo on my first 2 safaris.

CCMdoc

As tygersman said because of the larger objective of 4.5x14. Particularly on a daylight hunt the larger objective will gather a great deal more light than the 1.5x5 which I've found to be quite dim at last light.

Mark

Fair enough.

Thank you both

Deadeye: I chose a .338 as my primary rifle on a plains game hunt and was very happy with it. My original plan was to take a .300 Winchester (which is what a companion took and which worked just fine), but I couldn't get my .300 to settle down and shoot like I wanted, so I took the .338 instead, which was shooting sub-MOA with Nosler 225 Partitions.

Not knowing where exactly you are hunting I don't know if you'll have any long shot presented to you, but the .338 definately has an advantage over the slower 9.3 on longer shots. I took a springbok at something in the vicinity of 400 yards with my .338.

i would choose the .338 - perfect second gun to a .416 - for very small game you will want some .416 solids

Great feedback, Thanks for all your help.

A pic of the M70 supergrade 338.

Go for the 338 Win Mag you won't regret it.

And even though it isn't legal, you're 338 can function as a buffalo gun in a pinch with the proper bullets. a 250 grain nosler, swift or TBB would work just fine in about 99% of cases, I bet.

There is very little that a 338wm is not an ideal rifle for in Africa, or over here either for that matter.

If a new scope is an option, I would get an illuminated VXR Leupold or Trijicon 3x9 for the 9.3 and use it with the 1.5x5 a suitable spare backup for both your rifles.

Yep, the 338 is a great light gun for Africa. It'll do pretty much everything if needed in a pinch, assuming you have the right bullets.

By the way, that's a nice looking rifle you have there!

Calibre wise I would prefer the 9,3x62. I would use 286gr Partitions for softs and carry a few 286gr Solids, Woodleigh or North Fork, for just in case.

But for leopard I would want a scope with a 36 to 42mm Objective and definately an illuminated reticle.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Yep, the 338 is a great light gun for Africa. It'll do pretty much everything if needed in a pinch, assuming you have the right bullets.

By the way, that's a nice looking rifle you have there!

The only modest improvement on the 338 Win would be a 330 Dakota, but then only on heavier bullets....that is fine looking Super Grade 70!!

338 is great leopard medicine in my experience.

My grandfather used his for two lions and multiple buffalo.

Just to throw a little bump. The same scope but an illuminated German #4 config. If he comes late black crosshairs a bust.

http://www.leupold.com/hunting...range-illum-reticle/

Mike

With your choices, the .338. My own choice is the .325 WSM (a close cousin of the .338). And, it's alternative is the .300 WSM.

Your rifle options are good. I would second NE 450 No 2 and Retreevers comments on scopes. The scope on a leopard hunt can be critical.

love the 338 also.

Funny, my scopes are removable.

If the scope currently on a rifle is unsuitable, I take it off and put another one on it.

I would take a .375 H&H with a 1.5-6X-40mm Burris Signature with the red-dot illuminated reticule. Use it for buff and the smaller critters. The red dot is great for low light. I would leave the .416 and the .338 at home.

Normally I would agree with the 338 as the smaller rifle because I believe the 338 Win Mag is one of the most under rated chamberings we have. However, with the main use being for a leopard, I would take the 9.3X62, and change the scope for one in the 3-9X40mm with a lighted reticle like the Trijicon with the post and crosshair. Or, simply remove the scope from the 338 and mount it on the 9.3, but I would rather have a illuminated reticle.

The 9.3X62 cartridge will handle all the plains game very well, but is less damaging to the leopard’s thin skin! Leopard are not hard to kill, but are easy to misplace the shot and wound if the scope is not up to the task, especially in poor light. Because of the light more than anything else, leopards are the member of the big five that is most often wounded requiring a scary follow-up. In any event good hunting with which ever you decide!

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quote:

Originally posted by Indy:
I would take a .375 H&H with a 1.5-6X-40mm Burris Signature with the red-dot illuminated reticule. Use it for buff and the smaller critters. The red dot is great for low light. I would leave the .416 and the .338 at home.

Why take the rifle that is neither fish nor fowl instead of taking 2 rifles that can cover the other's job in a pinch, but are better suited to each specific task? Not to mention, taking the compromise rifle only, leaves no back up plan should something happen to that rifle!

It doesn't get much better than 338WM and 416Rigby.

You might want to consider your rounds for the Rigby. If you handload, you can probably duplicate the trajectory of the 338 in the Rigby, which might come in handy if you run across a long range eland while the 416 is in your hands. 350grain TTSX or TSX can be loaded to 2750 or 2800fps, as you wish.

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:
It doesn't get much better than 338WM and 416Rigby.

You might want to consider your rounds for the Rigby. If you handload, you can probably duplicate the trajectory of the 338 in the Rigby, which might come in handy if you run across a long range eland while the 416 is in your hands. 350grain TTSX or TSX can be loaded to 2750 or 2800fps, as you wish.

Good call. i have the 410WL at 2350 fps shooting on at 100 yrds and the 340 WL at 2500 fps 2-3" higher, might have to step up the powder on the 340's to try to get some better trajectory but load developing the 416 can be a painful, long drawn out process!

Just take the 9.3 X 62 with a Trijicon 3 X 9 green post reticle and a spare scope. You can shoot everything with this that's on the menu. I never take two rifles, but always a spare scope. If the rifle should go South, I know my PH has one that can be pressed into service if need be. I have shot Buff, Hippo, Leopard, Sable, smaller plains game with the exact setup described above.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

Ron, I think the most important thing is the scope. Your 270 will kill the cat but you have to be able to give yourself the best opportunity if it is in low light. You are going to be hunting with Zambezi hunters and can hunt after dark and will need the best scope available in low light. I ended up getting a 3-9x40 VX-R. I will either put it on my 375 and shoot everything with it or I will most likely just put it on my 300 win mag and have it set just for Leopard dead on at 75 yards. I plan on shooting 180gr Nosler Partitions or 180 Accubonds for my leopard on the trip and think it will work well. I hope these bullets don't do too much damage which is also a concern of mine. I think you are thinking and have a lot of options and will figure it out.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by Indy:
I would take a .375 H&H with a 1.5-6X-40mm Burris Signature with the red-dot illuminated reticule. Use it for buff and the smaller critters. The red dot is great for low light. I would leave the .416 and the .338 at home.

Why take the rifle that is neither fish nor fowl instead of taking 2 rifles that can cover the other's job in a pinch, but are better suited to each specific task? Not to mention, taking the compromise rifle only, leaves no back up plan should something happen to that rifle!

Right! I always like my smaller rifle to be able to be a leagle backi-up for my big rifle if something happens to it! The 9.3X62 is leagle for the cape buffalo, and the 338 Win Mag is not in Zimbabwe.
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quote:

Right! I always like my smaller rifle to be able to be a leagle backi-up for my big rifle if something happens to it! The 9.3X62 is leagle for the cape buffalo, and the 338 Win Mag is not in Zimbabwe.
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then a 375Ruger gives flatter trajectory to match the flat 416Rigby

Good comments, I have a NXS 2.5-10 by 32 with a illuminated recticle, I think I'll mount that on the 338 and see how that works, giving up a bit of objective, but adding the illumination should be a better setup overall. Cheers.

Deadeye: I have that same scope on my 340 Weatherby for early and late shooting and love it. You will be in great shape for leopard with that combo. Remember your leopard will be less than 50 yards away when you shoot so the Nightforce will be fine.

Given that you always have a PH with you, my reasoning isn't necessary, but its what I have done several times.

Both my cats were shot with a .375, and the leopard stayed in the tree at the shot, so the .375 with 300 grain TSX's will do the job on spots.

I want my light gun to be able to do anything that I might have to do on that hunt. In wild areas of Africa, that means a maddened elephant. I use a .375, but the 9.3 is roughly equivalent, so I would get the nightforce scope that you have and put it on the Ruger. The 9.3 is capable of stopping an elephant if you get in the wrong place at the wrong time. I don't think that the .338 has many bullets available that can make a frontal brain shot on a elephant- yes a bigger gun is in order IMO if I am deliberately going for Jumbo, but if my .375 is what is in hand I feel perfectly capable of pulling off a brain shot.

I kind of have my stomach rumbling for saying that because that Winchester looks so nice that it deserves to go, and I just don't care for Rugers, but caliber wise, that is what I would do.

It pained me to pull off the gold ring on my M70 338 WM and put this NF on it, target turrets, 30mm tube...hmmmm
will see how it works this spring before i take it for leopard, thanks again for the suggestions re the illuminated reticle versus higher power.
Cheers.

I would not be afraid to shoot a leopard over bait with a 243 with 95 gr Nosler Partitions or a 308 with 165 Trophy Bonded Bearclaws. I have hunted leopards with the 308 and the 165 TBBC's.

I did have a 9,3x74R double rifle for the follow up, and I have hunted leopard with the 9,3x74R as the Primary.
Whe I had the wife along I used her 308 with a really good after dark scope. Whe I went to Zin with out her I always took a 450m no2 double and a 9,3x74R scoped double.

The bottom line is a 9,3x74R double or a 9,3x62, or a 375 H&H bolt rifle with some solids can double for elephants, cape buff and giraffe, where the 243/308 etc. cannot...

My thoughts are I want both of my rifles to be capable of killing all the game I plan to hunt...

First check on the minimum legal requirement for DG, in your case, Leopard - then decide to kick the ball with whichever foot you wish
seeing it can be done with a well placed shot at 35/40 yds from any of the light calibers