I have read numerous posts regarding what rifles are dangerous game ready "from the factory". My conclusion is that few if any rifles are ready without some gunsmith work to improve feeding, extraction, etc. Is there a consensus on what rifles or actions are the best to start with and then have a gunsmith work them over?

There is no consensus, but IMO a DGR begins with a CRF action like a Model 70 or Mauser 98.

George

mufasa,

I assume you mean which factory rifle is suitable for tweaking rather than which action for the basis of a full blown custom rifle?

If so, the trouble I see is that not only is there a variation in quality from maker to maker, but also within in the guns that come off the production line of any one maker...basically they all make lemons from time to time.

I would say the two main current production factory rifles to consider today are the CZ550 and the Win Model 70...If you were a Ruger fan you could add the M77 Mk11, but it does not seem very popular for this.

All these rifles would benifit from bedding work, they may or may not need the trigger done and they may or maynot need the action, feed rails polished ect to ensure proper reliable feeding..You might require different open sights depending on personal preference.

I would say many other modifications you read about here are often done for cosmetics/tradition rather than to ensure the rifle finctions properly..

Regards,

Peter

Thank you both for your replies. I actually meant to include actions that would be suitable for a full blown custom rifle. There have been a lot of posts regarding actions that have flaws that even a gunsmith couldn't correct. If we are going to talk about "mauser" actions there seem to be so many that which mauser actions we believe are suitable for DG need to be specified. In short if we were going to hire a gunsmith to build a custom DG rifle, then are we going to start with a CZ or a Win mod 70 or a mauser? Further, are we going to start with a complete rifle or do we think they are such pieces of junk that we will just use the action and start from there?

Granite Mountain Arms magnum Mauser action

or

Gottfried Prechtl Mauser action.

I almost totally agree with GeorgeS...the M-70 and the commercial mausers are what I'd recommend. Frankly starting with a military mauser will lead to a very nice rifle action but at far too great a cost for me.
As far as I know no one makes a "ready to go" DG gun.....

How about a Montana Rifle Co. action? The price is most certainly right.

If we are to suggest best as in "best quality", then the two actions listed by 500grains are probably the top two commercial Mauser pattern actions with good availability.

You can also hand D'Arcy Echols a new Winchester Classic action and $7,000 and get back (in some months) his Legend rifle that is eminently suitable for dangerous game.

WffHein also makes some excellent quality actions, those I have handled were first rate.

The Empire Rifle Company rifles are candidates too. I arranged to borrow two to evaluate them, but they stood me up and I can't comment further.

I bought two M99 actions to build .458 Lott rifles. They are not in the same class as the other actions, but they are "good enough". The rifles Jim Brockman builds with them are good to go dangerous game hunting in my experience.

jim

Thanks. This forum is absolutely the best.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
How about a Montana Rifle Co. action? The price is most certainly right.

Good thinking Rusty....I have both M-70s and a 1999 rifle (.404 Jeffery) and consider them roughly equivalent.

The cz 550 or M70 would be my choice for a run of the mill rifle................some nice rifles have been built from cz's and m70's. For best quality stuff 500 gr is correct.

An m98 will also come up great but at a pretty big $$

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
How about a Montana Rifle Co. action? The price is most certainly right.

Good thinking Rusty....I have both M-70s and a 1999 rifle (.404 Jeffery) and consider them roughly equivalent.

I love my .404J 1999 taking it to Zambia for buff. Can't wait!

mufasa,
if you want something that works from the factory and you've got the bucks, go for one of the modern doubles like searcy or krieghof. they are more than, but close to the cost of a serious custom mauser action, but doubles are hard to beat for dangerous game.
Regards, tim

For my own use, I put my trust in the Model 70 action as the basis for my rifles, and I put my trust in D'Arcy Echols to build my rifles.

AD

Allen,

Just out of curiosity, does D'Arcy have a preference between pre 64 actions or the modern ones?

regards,

Pete

quote:

Originally posted by Pete E:
Allen,

Just out of curiosity, does D'Arcy have a preference between pre 64 actions or the modern ones?

regards,

Pete

When I asked, Darcy told me he ONLY builds rifles based on the Model 70 Classic (modern production, claw extractor). But another forumite reports that he is building a .505 on a Hartman Weiss action too.

I believe that for any of the belted magnums, he'd prefer a current Model 70 Classic action in his fiberglass-stocked 'Legend' rifle.

For a walnut-stocked, short belted-magnum (i.e. 7mm Rem. Mag.) I think he'd go with either a Classic Model 70, pre-64 Model 70, or Mauser 98. For .375 H&H, .300 H&H, .300 Wby., .416 Rem., or .458 Lott, I suspect the Model 70 Classic would get the nod.

If the client was going to build a .30-06 or .270, he'd likely recommend a pre-64 or Mauser 98. Walnut stock only.

For a .416 Rigby or .505 Gibbs he'd likely prefer the Hartmann & Weiss Mauser action, and he has a .505 Gibbs in the works on a H&W in the works right now. Walnut stock only.

AD

Vapodog, Carmelo,
I jealous! I am finally making progress on my two 404 jeffery projects. The componets are enroute to Tip Burns in Canyon Lake, Texas.

Finally, feel like I'm making progress. (Long story. How long? Real long!)

Allen,

Did Darcy actually say that to you? Because if so, it is completely different from what he told me.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
Vapodog, Carmelo,
I jealous! I am finally making progress on my two 404 jeffery projects. The componets are enroute to Tip Burns in Canyon Lake, Texas.

Finally, feel like I'm making progress. (Long story. How long? Real long!)

Rusty I know the feeling!
But when you have your project done you will really enjoy your new .404!

Good luck with it.

Carmelo,

Did you find a way to resolve the headspace problem on your .404?

500 grs., I've talked actions with D'Arcy quite a few times, but he does change his mind on occasion. What action recommendations did he make to you that are different than what I listed?

AD

quote:

Originally posted by 500grains:
Carmelo,

Did you find a way to resolve the headspace problem on your .404?

Don't know of any such problems.
Have a nice day and thanks for your interest.

quote:

Originally posted by allen day:
500 grs., I've talked actions with D'Arcy quite a few times, but he does change his mind on occasion. What action recommendations did he make to you that are different than what I listed?

AD

He said he would ONLY be willing to build rifles on the Win M70 Classic action. NO Mausers. NO pre-64's. I can't blame a guy for specializing, because it leads to both efficiency and a higher quality product in most instances.

quote:

Originally posted by carmelolisciotto:

quote:

Originally posted by 500grains:
Carmelo,

Did you find a way to resolve the headspace problem on your .404?

Don't know of any such problems.
Have a nice day and thanks for your interest.

You know, the headspace problem that was causing numerous misfires in your .404.

quote:

You know, the headspace problem that was causing numerous misfires in your .404.

Sorry I don't know of any such headspace problems.

quote:

Originally posted by carmelolisciotto:

quote:

You know, the headspace problem that was causing numerous misfires in your .404.

Sorry I don't know of any such headspace problems.

?????

So when you talked about all the misfires you had, was that actually an internet hijacker posting from your account?

Model 98 Mauser is my first choice, closely followed by a pre 64 M-70, then I suppose one of the new M-70s with control feed...

I am a Mauser fan, no doubt about that.

I agree with Ray on the selection of actions for a full custom but I would put the pre-64 Mod70 first but that is simply because I already have 3 custom pre-64's. Recently I had the oppurtunity to handle a custom single square bridge mauser in 404 Jeffery built by Al Biesen and had JOC's double square bridge mauser 416 Rigby here for a few days. I now have the vapors and the only cure will be to have a custom mauser in my gun safe.

465H&h

Last week I was in Moscow, Idaho, and found for sale an Al Biesen custom Ruger No. 1 .375 H&H at 'Husky Sport Shop'. That rifle really felt good!

AD