Not a quick enough solution to the problem.

Neither-it's just part of the script for michael moore's next "documentary".

Jackson, Kerry, Kennedy, Moore,Teresa Heinz, Liberal Media, Conservative Media, and most of all,Tony Blair. And why- because there are't many sources for CASH in Zim and that is what makes our politcal world go around.Particularly the Reverends.

Gentlemen



soo this is Mugabes master plan to get rid of the white. I wonder what the US, EU, UN and Blair will say? I guess they might not do anything at all



What Zimbabwe need is a political coupe, to overthrow Mugabe and his thugs : If the other African regimes likes Mugabes plan they must be able to support them selves. No more aid for Africa I hope they freeze Mubagbes bank accounts since he is funding terrorism



Cheers

/JOHAN

Saeed, you are quite correct.



I have a bigger belief that this is accurate as opposed to a rumor. Look at the past and the willing accomplices in the other southern Africa countries.



Where is the outrage from Jesse Jackson? I guess the rainbow coalition has selective, non-color blind indignation.

Rather than speak in platitudes about Africa generically, why don't you address the facts vis a vie Mugabe, you know the subject at hand, the topic of conversation. Most (but not all) of the misery I saw in Zimbabwe was his doing. Rather than learn and practice from the part of Western civilization that has flourished, he chooses to mimic the best of Stalin.



As to the entire Africa for the Africans comment, since when does the color of ones skin determine where one calls home. Those whites that are being persecuted in Zimbabwe for the most part were all born and raised there and if you think most of them are wealthy, you would be wrong.



As to history, it's pretty apparent the you got lost and was over your head after the words, in the beginning......

Uhh, Gerald.... NitroX is Australian; not an American.



And I think your post was out of line. Expressing your opinions is fine with me, but the personal attacks are not what we need on these forums.



Mugabe is a totalitarian, brutal dictator. Period. But he's black so it's okay? It's to be excused? Is that your attitude?



If you want to read up on the news about Zimbabwe, here's a good web site:

http://www.news24.com/News24/Africa/Zimbabwe/Home/



One of the recent headlines from this web site:



Mbeki urged to speak on Zim

23/06/2004 20:31

Human rights groups led by Amnesty International is asking President Thabo Mbeki and other leaders to put pressure on Zimbabwe.



Johannesburg - At least 20 human rights groups led by Amnesty International is asking President Thabo Mbeki and other African leaders to put pressure on Zimbabwe over its human rights record.



"We are urging African states to take a more public stand in resolving the crisis in Zimbabwe" said Amnesty's spokesperson in South Africa, Samkelo Mokhine.



The London-based human rights watchdog last month said Zimbabwe had stepped up attacks on critics of the government, including torture and kidnappings, gagged the media and misused scarce food stocks for political ends.< !--color-->



The entire article can be found at:

http://www.news24.com/News24/Africa/Zimbabwe/0,,2-11-259_1547107,00.html





Yeah, Amnesty International sure is a right wing, neo-nazi, pro Boer group!



-Bob F.

NitroX

Give Mugabe "notice" of what? You are the perfect personification of the "ugly American" abroad. Saeed and the other lice (like you) just want to hunt in Africa. You never gave a moment's thought to sheer human misery that you must have seen. Africa for the Africans! Let them make their mistakes.If you want to take your "politics" from South African Boers, go right ahead. Just remember that you don't represent most Americans. BTW, if any of you yahoos ever get to read some history (get someone to explain the big words)you may find out that the Western white races spent CENTURIES to develop a civilization worthy of the name. What really gripes me about people like you is your total lack of pity or sympathy for human beings. BTW, did you ever shoot at somebody who shot back? I bet not!

Gerald

Now that hopefully you have finished wiping the egg off your face.


I have been to Zimbabwe three times.

The first in 1988. The place appeared peaceful but had a definite edge to it at times. It wasn't prosperous but not as poor as the black run for twenty years countries to the North which were pathetic (tough the people were often friendly). There were a lot of beggars, even a white farmer begged me for money. I came close to being mugged in the main shopping mall of Harare in the middle of the day.

I only learned afterwards that Mugabe had finished off killing tens of thousands of Ndebele opposition and innocents only a year or two before. The left-wing faggot Western media had the place painted as a black paradise after white man's "evil" rule under the Smith government.

**

The second time was in 1994. I travelled all over the country. Harare appeared to be twice the size and had a lo more taller buildings. Begging was way down and things appeared to be better organised. Travel was relatively safe and easy. People and business appeared to be prospering. However Mugabe continued to rumble about Marxism and bringing in a marxist economy. He also continued with his black "democratic" one party state government.

**

The last was in 2002. There was next to no tourist (and tourist dollars). The tourist souveneir hawkers were desolate with 0% custom. Hotels were next to empty. Resorts and tourist businesses were empty or desolate - having been "acquired" corruptly or forceably by blacks. One 'resort' Iknow of used to hire dozens of staff. Now that it is black "owned" it is empty and there is no employment and no money for food. I know of one farm where thousands of animals starved because the owners were thrown off and the animals not fed for weeks. There were people starving in the areas I hunted. Fuel wasextremely hard to get as was purchasable grain.

Many people report how wonderful there hunts went and they had no problems. However for many it is their first trip and they have no comparison. Their hunts went well as they dealt with connected outfitters who also spend a lot of $$$ to ensure they have what they need for clients.



***

Gerald

please tell us about your personal experiences in Zimbabwe and about your personal experiences with black "civilisation".

Gerald,

Yes we want stable government in the places we love to hunt. We want to be able to go there without fear of snafus or worse, and we want the resource properly managed so the animals don't become extinct. We contribute to those economies by doing so. The safari industry employs a lot of people in those countries, black and white, and it's often the brightest flame in an otherwise dim picture.

You can't possibly be an apologist for Mugabe? He's about the closest thing in Africa to Hitler or Saddam. He has single-handedly destroyed the economy and the livelihood of millions of blacks and thousands of whites, and taken lives along the way all for purely selfish reasons. He has created nothing. I think you ought to do a little research, and by that I mean more than reading the New York Times.

We do contemplate the human misery and the massive opportunity cost of political mismanagement, we see it first hand, and it appals us. That's why we want to see change in Zimbabwe, and why we want Mugabe to made an example of.

When the Western World ignores Mugabe, they are encouraging others in power to emulate his plundering of the economy and resources that they he is supposed to be custodian of. Thus, we (and that includes you, Gerald) are also partly responsible for the misery of millions.

I don't understand your comment about shooting back. We shoot animals, and no, they don't shoot back. Although sometimes they do kill the hunter.

If we follow your advice and ignore the shenanigans in certain African countries, wildlife will cease to exist in Southern Africa as has already happened to a large degree in the rest of Africa; genocides like that in Rwanda will be repeated; disease and poverty will continue to ravage the continent; and only a handful of politicians will do well.

What the hell do you read, Gerald? Marx and Mao?

Gerald: I qualify on all three countsl I'm an "ugly" American (look at my picture) I have two masters degrees one in History and political science and I've been shot at. albeit while in an airplane (BTW, Churchill was right, nothing in life is more exilirating than to be shot at....and missed!).

The "moveon.org" is probably a good place for you. What little the folks in Africa have is thanks to two hundred years (give or take) of european influence. No and I don't buy into we non-africans made slaves out of them for it was africans who sold other africans into the slave trade to be shipped off to the US, etc. The bottom line is that no one can argue that Zimbabwe AND South Africa have gone significantly down hill in recent times. Were we to leave {sic} "Africa to the Africans" as you say, well we DID since de-colonization and it just keeps getting worse and worse. jorge