Hi,
I have played around with the idea to add a "stopper" to my gun collection. I already have a .404 Rimless Nitro Express and want some larger bore.. The .458 class is not what i am looking for and it has to be a classic caliber. No wildcat!

First I was thinking about a Ruger No 1 in .500 N.E. -but now i have decided (for the moment atleast ) to build something large on a Brno ZKK 602 action. I can get hold of one of the older ZKK 602 actions with built in peep sight.

The rifle will be a pure working rifle, maybe laminate stock , only open sights.

But what caliber?

.505 GIBBS or .500 Jeffery???

Advice please!

Husky

The guys who own them should weigh in soon to help you but in the meantime my own choice would be the 505 gibbs. Only because it turns a few more heads.
I think fitting it in the Brno is a bit of a shoehorn job.
The 500 jeffery is easier in every way.

By the way what is your 404 built on?

Karl.

I have and regularly use a .500 Jeff (and find it devestatingly effective), but in all honesty it's just a case of which you would prefer to own. Either one will do the job and although people will probably chime in with one is better than the other ballistically or for other reasons, it really doesn't matter.

I use the lightest of the 3 usually available bullet weights (535 grain) and have never felt a need for a heavier bullet..............or for that matter, a second bullet. (just lucky I guess)

Karl,
My .404 is built on a Brno ZG 47 acion
-only the Best is good enough

Husky

Shakari,
Tell me what action is your .500 Jeffery built on? Do you use scope?

Maybe it would be possible to built the .500 Jeffery on a Brno ZG 47 action?

I am very fond of my .404 and it would make sence to have the large bore made on the same type of action!

Husky

Husky,



Mine is on a left handed weatherby action that started off life as a .416 weatherby. As you probably know left hand actions are pretty rare and the reason I chose this one was not because I like weatherby calibres, it was because it was the only left hand action I could buy. After a couple of run ins with irate Buffalo, I decided to have the action rebuilt into the .500 Jeff by Sabi Rifles in Nelspruit South africa who are just up the road from my home............Since then, I haven't looked back. I'm delighted with the rifle and although some people will decry push feed actions, I've never had a sniff of a problem with it.



I've used the rifle at ranges from 300 yards to 3 yards and although the longer ranges are not really suitable for this calibre it will do the job at a pinch.



No, I don't use a scope. I have a shallow vee rearsight with 2 leaves, and at the moment a large pop-up moonbeam foresight, but that will be changes as soon as I can buy one of the large red fibre optic foresights I recently saw on a client's rifle.

Hi,
Nice information! What case brand do you use?

I used my .404 a couple of weeks ago north Pietersburg while hunting during the short weekend with Ken Stewart. He has made some 425 grains Hi Performer for the rifle that I am very fond of.
Shot one Wildebeest and one Impala -long shots 150 - 170m.

We are now planning a DG (elephant and buffalo) hunt for 2005 and I suppose that the .404 is good enough - but as always one starts to think about "The perfect combination" for such a hunt.

Maybe that would be a .303, a .404 and a .505 - it sounds nice in my ears anyway...

Is there any gunsmiths that you can recommend in the Jo-burg or Pietersburg area for a rebarell, new stock work? I guess that it would be cheaper doing it in RSA than doing it in Sweden

Husky

I've used Sabi, Romey and Stewart cases, and without a doubt the Stewart cases have proved to be the best. Ken also makes most of my bullets.

I guess we're talking the same Ken Stewart here, but I would have thought he'd be well past the hunting stage. Ken had a major operation a few months ago and must be in his 70s at least.........if it is the same KS, then you're a lucky man. He's one of the most interesting guys I've ever met.

If you're looking for re-barrel and or restock, I would suggest Sabi Rifles in Nelspruit who did mine. You can take a look at their website at www.sabirifles.co.za.

Husky

You might want to check this out:

http://www.rbbigbores.com/projects.html

I do not know about the price but the Dollar is low.

There are also many German makers:

http://www.buechsenmacher.de/custom.html
http://www.jagdgewehre-ritterbusch.de/eng/frame.htm
http://www.golmatic.de/Waffen___Arms/MAUSER_Jagd___Hunting/mauser_jagd___hunting.html



Cheers,

Andr�

If the .505 were actually a "shoe-horn" then I doubt that CZ would be bringing out the 550 ZKK in that caliber. Since they are (in January) and since a factory chambered rifle will inevitably be followed by more reloading component choices, if not factory ammunition, logic would dictate the Gibbs. Of course, damned few of us choose our rifles logically but I'd be for the Gibbs.

CZ is bringing out the Gibbs along with factory ammo.

shakari,
Yes, that is the same Ken!
I don't think that he will join me on the hunt next year -but he is doing the planning with another PH and "Kenya bloke" that will follow me on the hunt.

We had some nice evenings togheter that weekend at the hunting farm -listening to Ken telling stories when he hunted with A.J. Hunter, K. Randall, I McDonald, T. Carr-Hartley, D. Collins, N. Reid and George Smart among others.

Ken has a rather impressive record:

More than 100 big elephants
More than 400 Buffalos
More than 400 Black Rhinos...

Most of them shoot with 475 Cogswell & Harrison double, .470 Westley Richard double and .458 3" Brno ZKK 602

I find Stewart bullets and cases to be absolutely among the best.

I will contact Sabi rifles and see what they think about a .500 jeffey on a Brno ZG 47 action.

Do you know by the way if The old German PH J�rgen J�sch still lives at the Klipspringer Lodge outside Nelspruit? I hunted with him for some years ago.

Husky

Hi Husky,

Ken is great company isn't he? I could listen to him and Kathy for a lifetime and not get bored. The other East African type is almost certainly David Brooke who I hope to have hunting with us next year for a few trips.....he also is very experienced.

Jurgen Josch, yes I know him, although I was under the impression he's moved from Klipspringer Lodge, but I may be wrong. His son, used to hunt Burigi until the refugees came through, and he also made a video about Buff hunting there.

If you know the area, I live just outside White River, on the White River Country Estate....... if you decide to bring your rifle over or are just in the area, please let me know and we'll get together for a beer or two.

Husky..........by the way, did Ken tell you about his old 4 bore (I think, double) rifle?........previous owner one F.C. Selous.

shakari,
Its nice to hear that we are having common friends!

Yes, Kathie was also with us and Kens half brother Jimmy -now living in England did also turn up. He had been at a Kenya Regiment reunion in Durban.

Jimmy started to tell stories about the Mau Mau terrorist rising and how he and Ken got involved...

One of their "specialities" was to reload .303 ammo with the fastest handgun powder they could find and "lose" these ammo on the road there they knew that the Mau Mau guys where patroling...

Or as Jimmy said "- It was better for us letting the terrorists kill themselves than that we should do it".

Dave Brooke is the PH I was talking about. He is very very experienced and always with a smile -can't think about a better bloke to go hunting with!

I travell rather regulary to RSA nowadays, but can't say for the moment when i will come next time. Probably after the new year.

Let me pay the bill when we meet

Husky

The 4 bore is a single barrel... previously owned by Selous

Husky,

I'll look forward to it........whoever pays the bill!!!