I recently flew Delta/SAA to Namibia checking in at Asheville, NC and connecting through Atlanta. I was flying with 2 bows, 2 shotguns and 4 boxes of ammo. I arrived 90 minutes early for checkin. I copied this firearms policy off of Delta Airlines website and took it with me to the airport.

Rifles
One rifle case containing:
two or fewer rifles (with or without scopes)
one shooting mat
one small pistol tool kit
noise suppressers
11 lbs. (approx. 5kgs) of ammunition
Cases containing more than two rifles will be assessed an excess baggage charge.

Shotguns
two shotguns
two shotgun cases
11 lbs. (approx. 5kgs) of ammunition
Cases containing more than two shotguns will be assessed an excess baggage charge

I placed the ammo in the original manufacturers card board container into my tuffpak with the shotguns. When checking in, I declared the firearms to the Delta Agent. He immediately asked about the ammo and then informed me that it had to go in a different bag from the shotguns. I showed him the print out from Delta Website and he informed me that he did not care what the website said. I asked for his supervisor and was told that the supervisor was unavailable. I asked the Delta agent was I to unpack my Tuffpak in front of everyone in this long line behind me. He told me to wait until I was being checked by TSA to move the ammo.

The TSA agent was quite surprised when I asked to move the ammo out of my Tuffpak into my soft sided duffle. The TSA agent actually got in an arguement with the Delta agent and told him that he would prefer that the ammo was locked in the Tuffpak. The TSA agent told me that I could no longer touch my bags as they had been checked in. Eventually the TSA agent moved my ammo out of hte Tuffpak. I was actually 5 minutes past the posted departure time when I got to my gate but fortunately they held my plane.

I have also had experiences in the past where I was asked to move the ammo to the locked gun case when I packed it into my soft duffel.

Has anyone else had a similar experience and how did you resolve it?

Do the airlines individually have different policies?

Apparently this particular Delta agent does have a policy different from the policy of either TSA or the airline he works for. If I were you, I would file a complaint with the airline about this idiot's conduct. Both Delta and TSA state that ammo is to be packed in the same locked container as the rifles/shotguns. Where you might get into trouble is where some airline might want the ammo packed in your checked luggage or in a separate locked container. It surely would be nice if all of the airlines and government agencies would be on the same page, but I guess that is too much to ask for.

Ron,

Glad to see you had a good trip and that your feeling better.

When I was looking into the rules regarding carrying ammo, I found that airlines did have different requirements. In addition, it was also clear that most employees did not have a clue what the their respective airlines official policy was. Most I spoke with would tell me what they *thought* was required but when asked to confirm this via email, most declined.

If you took a written copy of the company rules and they still jerked you around, I am at a loss what to suggest, expect fly with somebody else next time.

Did you get the guys name who was causing the problem? I would be very tempted to email a letter of complaint about the incident and let them know you will be posting about their poor customer service on the various internet hunting forums..

Regards,

Pete

patrkyhntr,

An industry wide policy on the carriage of sporting firearms and ammo??? That would make life too easy!

I can understand the airlines concerns over security and theft ect, but why not simply let the traveller carry either the bolt or the fore end of the rifle on their person, or in their handluggage?

Regards,

Pete

When I have traveled with my TuffPak and they have asked me if the ammo was with the rifle, I truthfully answered that it wasn't, that it was separated from the rifle. I pack the rifle in a softcase in the TuffPak and throw the ammo into the TuffPak with everything else. I've never (yet) had them ask me anything else other than if the ammo was with the rifle -- which, to my way of thinking, it isn't. To me, "with" the rifle would mean I've got the ammo in side the same case as the rifle -- the softcase in this instance -- and it isn't. I don't think of a TuffPak as a gun case, I think of it as luggage.

Well, we'll see how it goes when I fly to Africa.

Russ

quote:

Originally posted by patrkyhntr:
It surely would be nice if all of the airlines and government agencies would be on the same page, but I guess that is too much to ask for.

patryhntr

Remember who your talking about here! "Airlines" "government Agencies" A dream come true!!! boy would it make things easier and smoother at the airports!

never happen!!!!!!!


Russell - -

I like your way of thinking!!!!!!

quote:

never happen!!!!!!!

I suppose it is too much to ask for. Still, I dream of a day when common sense becomes common again.

Delts tried that crap with my friend in San Diego. I had told him about making a copy of the airline regs. He stood his ground and would not leave the counter even though he was inititally told a supervisor "wasn't available." Eventually a supervisor appeared and the little POS gun-hating democrat ticket agent was put in her place. I'd most definetly write a formal letter of complaint to Delta with the indivial's name all over it. jorge

I would definately file a formal complaint.

I guess the easiest thing to do is to say, "Yes, sir" and go on. It sure is a pi$$OFF to say the least when the airlines employees refuse to obey their own rules. You can insist that you are obeying the airlines rules that are right off the website and threaten his job as he is insisting on you doing the opposite of what is the reccomendation of the airline. As far as I am concerned you are a customer in good standing with the airline. You have given the airline your money, have a ticket in hand and have packaged your sporting firearm exactly as the airline has reccomended. You could insist that you will not leave the counter until you see the supervisor. It still may not do any good. I had a similar situation in Atlanta with the person at the counter insisting that my cartidges be in original factory containers. That is not what the rule is but that is what they thought it said. The supervisor sided with the desk person. They said that I did not have to give up my handloads, but I could not get on the plane with them. If I wanted a plane ride I had to give them up. If I stayed on the ground I could keep them. I had a hunt to go on. I chose to give them up and go on a hunt hoping to find ammo on the other end. That was 5 years ago now and I am still mad about it. In my opinion you should definitely report this person and request at least a reprimand. I would request a meeting with that person's supervisor on your return. We should reserve the right to make miserable employees that are ignorant of the rules of their company. By the way how was your hunt? Wiemansheil

These people definitely have to be reported.

Complaints pointing to specific employees, times, dates, etc... will eventually add up and force the airlines to clarify their internal policies or get these people out of their current position.

Either way, your complaints will ease the path for fellow hunters.

For the last 18 months or so I have flown every month or nearly every month with a firearm and ammo. I have in every case had the ammo in the case with the guns. TSA has never said a single word to me about this on a Domestic filght. The Gate agents primarily with Delta, although I have a lot of flights on NWA and AK Air too. Have asked me to put the ammo in the other bag. Some of those flights I have had no other checked bag, just my roller-bag carry on. No options there! They let it go 100% of the time.

When I returned from RSA on my fisrt trip this year the US customs officer saw the ammo in the gun case and said that I would have to remove it as it's not Legal in the USA to keep them in the case together. Not wanting to have him detain me and possibly miss the next flight I was as polite as possible and said that it was actually suggested that ammo and guns were kept together and locked. That was the new policy I was told by TSA. He quickly asked another Customs agent who said that it was fine as long as the ammo was in a factory box or better. Mine was in 20 round plastic slip cases with rubber bands around them. He said that's fine go ahead and "lockem up". I proceeded to the recheck in Atlanta and was on my way with no problem.

On the second trip I was checked by a TSA agent when I rechecked my guns and he saw the ammo suggesting that it could not be in the case either. I politely asked if some rule had just changed and he said no it's always been that way. I handed him my passport which has only 4 blanks remaining and said look at the amount of trips I have been to RSA and I have been told on many of them that TSA suggested that ammo and firearms be secured in the same case. So how can it have always been that way if I have traveled that many times and your the first agent to say I can't? He called over another TSA agent and they looked over my things. Then the new one said if it's under 5 pounds it's OK. I said that's 5kg not 5 poounds! He said "OH yeah I get that mixed up, it's no problem".

Now with this said I will tell you the rules change so fast that just because I know what it is right now does not mean that will be the case next week. 3 months ago you could carry on a small disposable lighter, you cannot anylonger. So it goes with TSA Security. Lets remember too to put the blame squarely where it belongs. On the shoulders of the terrorists. These TSA folks are just trying to keep us safe and do their job. In any large employment base you will have the occasional Jackass, but for the most part I have not struggled one bit and I fly very frequently both international and domestic with firearms. I strongly suggest you print the rules you intend to follow the week you leave and have them handy in case any questions come up.

I don't care whether it's permitted by policy or not, it's just not worth the risk of running into any of the hassles that have been reported on this and MANY other threads on this subject.

For smooth flying, DO NOT put your ammunition in your gun case. Split it into TWO different separately locked ammo cases and place ONE of them in each of TWO separate pieces of checked luggage.

Screw the TSA...I am not one damn bit safer doing anything thanks to them. I consider them a royal pain in my ass. Flying to Reno from D/FW in Jan. (with no firearm) they worked me over because of 6 screws in my left hip made their little ding dong go off. You would have thought I was some major criminal.
I miss my pocket knife which I have carried since I was 4 yrs. old. I think they should issue every passenger a loaded 45 ACP Auto for the duration of every flight and then we could see what the hell happens.
I dislike anyone in a uniform and badge looking after me...I have managed to do quite well at that for 67 years so far. Big Brother! Bah!! Humbug!!

Mims, I thought you were some young buck!, not 67 years young. How come you're not a crotchety old fart like Ray?

quote:

Originally posted by mikeh416Rigby:
Mims, I thought you were some young buck!, not 67 years young. How come you're not a crotchety old fart like Ray?

He is! But his wife monitors his posts so he doesn't get into trouble!


Besides, he is just a youngster at 67!

Mac, thanks for clearing that up for me

I just returned from Africa. We had 2 rifles in the case with all our ammo and we were never asked to remove our ammo. Fact is it was never brought up by anyone, Ak airlines, Delta, TSA, or Namibian police. Next time I go I will lock it in my rifle case again. Good luck!

quote:

Originally posted by mikeh416Rigby:
Mims, I thought you were some young buck!, not 67 years young. How come you're not a crotchety old fart like Ray?

Apparently, you have not spent much time with Mims.

quote:

Originally posted by Wendell Reich:
Apparently, you have not spent much time with Mims.

And I stopped myself from posting that exact thing yesterday...

I have a standard Tuff Pak that I have not yet used. If you carry one rifle and four or five boxes of ammo, how do you keep the ammo boxes from bouncing around insde the Tuff Pak?

quote:

Originally posted by H James Wilson:
I have a standard Tuff Pak that I have not yet used. If you carry one rifle and four or five boxes of ammo, how do you keep the ammo boxes from bouncing around insde the Tuff Pak?

I did not carry my ammo in my Tuffpak, but I would make sure that there is enough packed in the case to keep the rifle from moving around and use some of that to hold/cushion the ammo. Sweaters, jackets, boots, or other clothes depending on your destination. If you put your ammo in a small box and wrap that in a sweater or jacket that may work.

this is more or less a normal attitude for delta. it's why the SCI boys in washington consider them to be one of the 2 worst airlines. you'd think that going broke they'd cater to their customers, but i think they're so used to abusing them that its habit.