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Just recuperating after an interesting night... I was asked to back up another PH who had a wounded leopard disappear into some thick stuff just before last light. As there are a lot of hyaena around he didn’t want to risk leaving it and coming back in the morning. His client insisted on coming along. Mine wisely decided to observe proceedings from the landrover, with a suitable amber liquid in hand. Other PH was armed with a mossberg pump action shotgun fitted with a surefire fore end grip with it’s seriously bright light. My rifle wears a streamlight TL3 on the side to illuminate the bush and fibre optic front sight, and it takes a 12" bayonet. Client had his .300 mag and a surefire M6 extra bright light, my tracker a shield and spear whilst his lad had a badly upset stomach/sore eyes, had to stay with the truck type of fever. We drove a truck in as far as possible and then advanced along the blood spore using it’s lights. When these ceased to help my client killed them for us and we tiptoed on. Since the other PH and his client were sweeping the bush with their torches, I kept mine off and stuck to scanning the shadows for movement. Then the torch carried by the client went flat- rather abruptly. Bother- and he fumbled round for some spare batteries in his pack. At this point there was a rustle in the thick grass to our left which the other PH lit up with his surefire- which promptly went out  As I stepped forward, and turned my light on (to illuminate a rather scared civet) my tracker asked the other PH “who said F$%K?†I nearly died laughing.  Moral- always fit new batteries to torches before a follow up- it reduces the Adrenaline surges Oh and we found a dead leopard about 50m further on | ||
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 You lucky t*rd! That is the problem with those fancy batteries. My M6 goes from illuminating a mouse at 400 yards to total blackness in a split second! They die in a hurry! ------------------------------- Will Stewart / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun. --------------------------------------- and, God Bless John Wayne. NRA Benefactor Member, GOA, N.A.G.R. _________________________ "Elephant and Elephant Guns" $99 shipped “Hunting Africa's Dangerous Game" $20 shipped. red.dirt.elephant@gmail.com _________________________ Hoping to wind up where elephant hunters go. | |||
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That sounds like a fun night!  ....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1 DRSS Charter member "If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982 Hands of Old Elmer Keith  | |||
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A good story and the other guy owes you dinner. | |||
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had a similar thing happen, only we had to go back to camp some 25k away for new batteries, and in the meantime a nice male lion came over to see what was going on. Makes sure ones heart is working on a dark night. Hope there was sufficient of that amber liquid left when you got back to the truck | |||
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I am surprised one could hear a spoken word over the noise of sphincters slamming shut! On the plains of hesitation lie the bleached bones of ten thousand, who on the dawn of victory lay down their weary heads resting, and there resting, died. If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue, Or walk with Kings - nor lose the common touch... Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it, And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son! - Rudyard Kipling Life grows grim without senseless indulgence. | |||
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Gents, this can all be avoided by giving thos "Antique" SFs to a buddy and getting your hands on the newer LED models Sure fire offers. We use them all of the time ; 3 times the battery life and a fade before death insted of that annoying black-out...Plus, you'll not have to worry about ever buying another replacement lamp for it. JW | |||
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To makes my M6 worse is that I have the high intensity bulb in it, 500 lumens. The 6 batteries only last 30 minuites! But dang it throws out the light. ------------------------------- Will Stewart / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun. --------------------------------------- and, God Bless John Wayne. NRA Benefactor Member, GOA, N.A.G.R. _________________________ "Elephant and Elephant Guns" $99 shipped “Hunting Africa's Dangerous Game" $20 shipped. red.dirt.elephant@gmail.com _________________________ Hoping to wind up where elephant hunters go. | |||
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The new "modern" bright lights that utilize the 123A batteries will defiantly give one heart failure at the most horrid moments -- they seem to have the ability to quit just when one needs them. I am trying to find LED replacement heads just for that reason. May even go back to units that utilize the old AAs or D type batteries with LED lamps. The Surefires are really really bright but---- DANG! OMG!-- my bow is "pull-push feed" - how dreadfully embarrasing!!!!! | |||
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Gentlemen A little advice from a fella who has been usiing a "flashlight" on a rifle in "his world" for a little over 23 years. [Back in the day, before all these fancy lights we just used electrical tape to attach a Streamlight to our rifles]. I always have 2 flashlights attached to my rifle. It is a good idea to have the second one using the LED bulbs. The surefires are so small amd light that this is easy to do. I would tape them on the rifle, or shotgun where the thumb of the front hand can work the on off switch. On some of my scoped rifles I have a mount on the scope and the flashlight has a tape switch, so the light can be turned on with pit disturbing the aim, such as when hunting pigs or leopard. When following up wounded game the scope comes off and out comes the tape. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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Its been a while since I heard of a bayonet being used on a follow-up. I thought maybe the practice had somehow become taboo. Also, why do people not use headlamps anymore ? They used to light up sights quite well. Comments? | |||
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Great story! | |||
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Who said F#@$? Could be a universal question across the continent. Our first trip over UEG and I were amazed and the proficiency and fluency that the F-bomb was inserted into foreign african languages. | |||
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Boet I am the only person i have ever met who always uses a bayonet for following up a cat. On my very first leopard hunt as a PH, a bayonet on my F.N. rifle saved me a heap of hurt (I think the story is on the Nickudu files), and I have modified a Lee Metford bayonet to fit onto my favouite rifle (the rifles have come and gone but still have the bayonet!) I think the reason everybody went to the surefire and streamlight type torches is they are so bright- they really do blind the enemy and offer a real advantage. On my .458 Lott I kept breaking Bulbs so have a LED bulb in it- it is not as bright but it is ok. Have a couple of the Pelecan recoil LED lamps that I am Very impressed with. One of those on a head lamp would be awsome. | |||
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Surefire has the Aviator model which I think can be swiched from LED to super bright. This option sounds handy. Has anyone used this model? ozhunter | |||
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ozhunter I have the Aviator model. The led's on it is not bright enough to be useful for searching. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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Taylor says that a headlamp instead of the barrel mount is useless because when you look away the lion can see you. Sounds reasonable. Seems like if you use a headlamp you would need a barrel mounted light as well. ------------------------------- Will Stewart / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun. --------------------------------------- and, God Bless John Wayne. NRA Benefactor Member, GOA, N.A.G.R. _________________________ "Elephant and Elephant Guns" $99 shipped “Hunting Africa's Dangerous Game" $20 shipped. red.dirt.elephant@gmail.com _________________________ Hoping to wind up where elephant hunters go. | |||
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Never got round to it myself but the bayonet idea is excellent for leopard follow ups. Greg Butler and Ian C - Mackintosh used to use one as well. I have personally experienced one charge where the bayonet would have been ideal, as the tracker held the cat off with the muzzle of his rifle down the cats throat. Good plan. A reliable tracker with a good old school rechargeable mag-lite has stood me in good stead as well. | |||
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Ganyana, Now that is a funny story, one of the best I have heard in many years.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Had an uncle who did follow-ups using a bayonet on his old 303 . Some of his friends did too, though I never saw them. This was of course back when you did´nt worry too much about using the best calibre, you just used what you had. Also, the 303 was´nt a useless round back then like it is now. A carbide headlamp is what he wore. I saw a video of a south american hunter provoke a charge from a jaguar while carrying only a spear....there was no way the jag could get close to him. The jag kept circling the hunter and rushing in untill it impaled itself once too often. I´ve often wondered what a PH would say if I arrived with a bayonet. Sorry for rambling on. | |||
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I wonder if Butch can be talked into putting a bayonet lug on my Searcy 470. 465H&H | |||
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Would you use two bayonets on a double ??  | |||
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my mossberg 590 pumpgun came with a bayonet lug on the barrel plus the extended magazine- i put ghost ring sights on it and surefire barrel mounted light. the bayonet lug fits standard US military issue bayonet- nice combo for close quarter situations Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… | |||
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465, No need, I will do it for you, I just got a new batch of rawhide lacing. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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mete, On a double only bayonets with two cutting edges ahould be used!  Andrew | |||
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Thank you Ganyana! That is a great story and a classic line that will live forever. "Who said F$%K?" Just wanted you to know how entertaining I thought that story was, and how great that line will be for ages to come. Like "I used to go with a girl who said that." Or "... in bed" uttered at the end of every fortune cookie read out loud. "Who said F$%K?" should prove immensely useful. I shall certainly utter the phrase, with a smile, the next time I pick up a bayonet, or check the batteries of a "torch."  | |||
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What about a 1903 Springfield with its foot and a half long bayonet, but in 411 Hawk instead of 30-06? Five shot reload via stripper clip with one reach to the belt and pig sticker on the end of the barrel... | |||
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Sounds like the perfect PH night time Leopard gun is a 12 Ga Cyl bore Winchester M97 or M12 trench gun with its Bayonet and a surefire on the pump handle. Complete with six rounds of 00 buck brass shells of course! That combo sure wrecked the evenings for a whole bunch of Japs during WWII. Would of wrecked more if they had surefires back then.-Rob Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers to do incredibly stupid things- AH (1941)- Harry Reid (aka Smeagle) 2012 Nothing Up my sleeves but never without a plan and never ever without a surprise! | |||
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Shotguns are for shooting birds and clay pigeons!  Look at Andy Hunters' story. It took 3 shots (2 in the head area) from a 10ga to kill that leopard! "...Them, they were Giants!" J.A. Hunter describing the early explorers and settlers of East Africa hunting is not about the killing but about the chase of the hunt.... Ortega Y Gasset | |||
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I no like Shotguns for leopard. If the pellets are copper plated they bounce off the kull and push blood vessels asside instead of penetrating, if they are too soft they don't penetrate the chest muscles. People forget that tensed muscle is harder than bone. A lion is easy to kill with AAA if it is caught unawares but those muscles have broken up many a soft point. Picked up on one where a .458 Lion load didn't make 4". Only the rottewil ammo seems to have a reasonable balance in the pellet hardness, but my Mossberg with surefire is for people! Boet, I think you are right, when most people used a Lee enfield for all their hunting, a Byaonet was alot more common. Two of my uncles tell tales of using one which is where I got the idea, and since I put up this post I have run into old Owen Connor who also always carried His Lee for leopard- because it is handy, has a short (19") barrel, more than powerful enough and has a Bayonet! In 70 years of hunting Old Owen doesn't seem to have picked up too many scratches | |||
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Not to hi-jack this most interesting thread but the US has used combat shotguns equipped with Bayonetts since 1916. Literally hundreds of thousands were used in WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Afganistan, Iraq. They are and always will be frontline weapons. I find it hard to believe a lion will survive 4-5 ) buckshot or Brenneke slug loads ( sometimes mixed) at close range. Then you can initiate a Bayonet charge if all else fails.!-Rob Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers to do incredibly stupid things- AH (1941)- Harry Reid (aka Smeagle) 2012 Nothing Up my sleeves but never without a plan and never ever without a surprise! | |||
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Rob Ask Bill bedford of Ingwe Safaris about that little lioness that moved him up Ten- Nill. She had a .458 and a .375 through her before the follow up started. She took two 00 loads in the chest and throat- the last at about 3 paces, and five loads of 000 in the side before she hit him- and then was she mad- None of the buck shot made it through the muscles. And that was on a 200lb lioness - not a 450lb male! | |||
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Try the old flechette rounds in that 12ga | |||
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Shotguns and cats....hmm Its not that they cant work, its a question of are they reliable? Its a dodgy passtime as it is, I´ll leave the 12br for the birds | |||
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Dear friend excelent post as ever,as the great JEFF COOPER always said i dont trust batteries gadgets most of the times speaking about Aimpoint sigths .On respect to the shotgun i never killed leopards but i finished some pumas and always have a good performance,but of course pumas are not so agressive and smaller than a leopard.The greatets risk here is from some excited hunters like one that almost blew out my head while i was searching in the grass for his badly shot puma ....he saw a brigth and fired...... www.huntinginargentina.com.ar FULL PROFESSIONAL MEMBER OF IPHA INTERNATIONAL PROFESSIONAL HUNTERS ASOCIATION . DSC PROFESSIONAL MEMBER DRSS--SCI NRA IDPA IPSC-FAT -argentine shooting federation cred number2- | |||
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All deference to Jeff Cooper aside I have never ONCE had a battery problem with an aimpoint scope, but then again that's probably because I use a NEW one every time I go out. Then again, I've also inadvertantly left one turned ON for several years.... and found it still working... so I REALLY don't expect to have one "die" unexpectedly. That and to make absolutely sure it makes good contact I put a dab of conductive paste on the terminals. AND I carry a spare. Hey, it's not like a pair of 2/3A Lithium batteries will weigh you down.... if it does leave something else behind like a cheeseburger or two before the hunt. AD If I provoke you into thinking then I've done my good deed for the day! Those who manage to provoke themselves into other activities have only themselves to blame. *We Band of 45-70er's* 35 year Life Member of the NRA NRA Life Member since 1984 | |||
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