The folks in RSA are trying really hard to become the next Zimbabwe:

http://allafrica.com/stories/201003160543.html

For all you guys that scathed me for calling Mandela a common terrorist and comparing to Mugabe...

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
For all you guys that scathed me for calling Mandela a common terrorist and comparing to Mugabe...

Mate, it's Zuma that's the issue, not Madiba!

I knew you would reply Steve...I bet I would be good at setting leaopard baits.

...RSA is on the slippery slope with it's terrorist born politics!

Lane,

I bet you would be good on spots!

I'd certainly agree that SA isn't as safe under Zuma as it was under Mandela. - But if I wanted political security, I'd move back to the toilet of the UK!!

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
Lane,

I bet you would be good on spots!

I'd certainly agree that SA isn't as safe under Zuma as it was under Mandela. - But if I wanted political security, I'd move back to the toilet of the UK!!

Steve,
All in good fun!!!

But I do really believe in my heart RSA is headed in the wrong direction.

Lane,

I hope you're wrong but I think you may well be right!

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
But I do really believe in my heart RSA is headed in the wrong direction.

I recently spent an afternoon with a horse vet from over there and that was that young man's take on things.

quote:

I recently spent an afternoon with a horse vet from over there and that was that young man's take on things.

Justin

Justin,

That is what I am...a horse vet. I go to RSA periodically to speak. That is definitely what everyone I know in RSA (with the possible exception of Shakari) thinks!

J. Lane Easter, DVM
Diplomate, American College of Veterinary Surgeons
Owner & Surgeon
Performance Equine Associates
15257 U.S. Hwy. 377
Whitesboro, TX 76273
Phone: 903-564-7443
Fax: 903-564-3704
ledvm@msn.com
lane.easter@pea-tx.com

Lane,

I don't disagree with you that SA may well be going downhill - and I'm sure most SA residents would also agree...... but I do disagree with you about Mandela.

I think SA was incredibly lucky to have Mandela in power during the handover of power and as I see it, it's a great shame he didn't have a few more years to be active..... and I'd bet that the majority of SA residents would agree with me.

We're ALL going downhill!

quote:

I think SA was incredibly lucky to have Mandela in power during the handover

Steve,
I agree that Mandela might be a lesser of evils than others...but in my court...all evils are treated equally.

And I will agree with "UEG" the USA is going to hell in a handbag as well.

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
We're ALL going downhill!

Agreed

We got our own Mandela!!!

I had an interesting conversation with a family from RSA who just moved to Canada early this year. They had applied for and were granted landed immigrant status a few years ago. They then ran their RSA businesses right up until they had to move to Canada or lose their status. They were quite open about milking every cent they could from RSA and then bailing out while they could. This family was predicting a major exodus of money and talent from RSA after the World Cup, which they characterised as a major profit making opportunity. Thier prediction was that once the World Cup is over and Mandela dies, things will go the way of Zim in a hurry.

I met an engineer in the J'bourg airport a couple of years ago who was in the process of leaving RSA for North America. He had a similar take, and it rings true to me. The populist politicians have been promising the sun and the moon and not delivering. To survive, they'll need to do something drastic once the media spot light moves elsewhere and Mandela's moderating influence is removed.

Dean

South Africa has a serious problem, the situation is unravelling fast, very fast....

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
We got our own Mandela!!!

Or maybe ours is a Mugabe...not quite sure yet!!!

You chaps enjoy this thread, me Im going to have a stiff whisky and fondle my firearms.

For what it's worth or not worth, I've been reading Mandela's autobiography entitled: "Long Walk To Freedom". I am about 1/3 of the way through the book (625 pages), and he's already made it very clear that he embraced communism, blamed all of the woes of the "African" (black) people for the past 300 years on the whites, and believed in the use of violence as a "freedom fighter". He also states that the sight of beautiful colonial buildings and white names on street signs angered him. He also admits that he was viewed as a hot headed radical by his own ANC leaders, and was enamored with the Russians, the Chinese, Leninism, Marxism, Maoism, communism (comrade is a term that he regularly uses in his autobiography)and with the extreme left wing radical whites of the country who were avowed communists. He also states that even though South Africa was to be a place of equal freedom and opportunity for all Africans, the only true Africans, in his mind, were the indigenous ones (black), who had been robbed of their "birthright" by the whites. With that said, I am reading the book solely to educate myself on the the man that many Africans (white, black, colored, Indian and/or otherwise) look to as a hero. I am reserving final judgment until I am finished, but so far I have not been compelled to see him as a hero for all South African people. This is just my opinion of course, and it is not being offered for some useless debate with anyone else.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
We got our own Mandela!!!

Or maybe ours is a Mugabe...not quite sure yet!!!

See there Lane, something else we both agree on! Man, this isn't gonna be fun anymore if we keep agreeing on everything??

quote:

See there Lane, something else we both agree on! Man, this isn't gonna be fun anymore if we keep agreeing on everything??

Heck I know Aaron!!! We'll have to find a controversial subject to argue about in the future!

quote:

the man that many Africans (white, black, colored, Indian and/or otherwise) look to as a hero.

UEG,
Trust me...there are many (white at least) who don't! He wasn't on the US terrorist watch list until 2 years ago for no reason.

Aaron,
I can't even get Steve to argue with me. I must be loosing my touch!

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Aaron,
I can't even get Steve to argue with me. I must be loosing my touch!

I don't argue my friend...... I debate!

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
For what it's worth or not worth, I've been reading Mandela's autobiography entitled: "Long Walk To Freedom". I am about 1/3 of the way through the book (625 pages), and he's already made it very clear that he embraced communism, blamed all of the woes of the "African" (black) people for the past 300 years on the whites, and believed in the use of violence as a "freedom fighter". He also states that the sight of beautiful colonial buildings and white names on street signs angered him. He also admits that he was viewed as a hot headed radical by his own ANC leaders, and was enamored with the Russians, the Chinese, Leninism, Marxism, Maoism, communism (comrade is a term that he regularly uses in his autobiography)and with the extreme left wing radical whites of the country who were avowed communists. He also states that even though South Africa was to be a place of equal freedom and opportunity for all Africans, the only true Africans, in his mind, were the indigenous ones (black), who had been robbed of their "birthright" by the whites. With that said, I am reading the book solely to educate myself on the the man that many Africans (white, black, colored, Indian and/or otherwise) look to as a hero. I am reserving final judgment until I am finished, but so far I have not been compelled to see him as a hero for all South African people. This is just my opinion of course, and it is not being offered for some useless debate with anyone else.

At least some one see him and his organization for what it was and still are...

I wonder what Mandela thinks about how "his" people have historically treated the San?

quote:

I don't argue my friend...... I debate!

Debate is one of those English words that Texans butchered out of the English Language.

In Texas we just argue! Unless you are fishing and you need someone to pass you a mudbug for your hook. Then you might hear pass "debate"!!! All in good fun though my friend!!!

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Aaron,
I can't even get Steve to argue with me. I must be loosing my touch!

I don't argue my friend...... I debate!

Steve - Like Lane says, here in the "now becoming" socialist republic of the USA, we argue!! Fact is, I am afraid to comment too much on this topic, as I KNOW I will lose control of my words.

quote:

the "now becoming" socialist republic of the USA, we argue!! Fact is, I am afraid to comment too much on this topic, as I KNOW I will lose control of my words.

Boy Aaron...do I hear you there!!!

You think you've got it bad now...... just give him a few years and see how he stuffs things up.

You'll find a good example of what is coming to you by looking at how Blair, Brown and the labour party have totally destroyed the UK.

My greatest concern is when the Kenyan loses in the 2012 election, that he will decide the country needs him, declare a national emergency and see if the military will back him.

Rich

will Woodleighs .470 solids penetrate body armor?

South Africa is discussed in the article.


Indigenisation must be broad-based

From The Herald
March 19, 2010



AT the dawn of industrialisation and urbanisation in this country early in the 20th Century, there were more restrictions than opportunities for black people.

There was discrimination on the grounds of race as far as educational, employment and business openings, among others, were concerned despite the fact that blacks were fit and able to perform alongside whites.

The other cause of exclusion was self-inflicted.

Minorities, especially in a foreign land, often pool together their resources and sharpen their business instincts while majorities remain in their comfort zones.

That is why many of the people who took up offers by the colonial regime to buy houses in the then townships (now high-density suburbs) were "rootless" Malawians, Mozambicans and Zambians whose parents had come into Rhodesia as migrant labourers while it was deemed "hurombe" for indigenous people to abandon the village and buy property and start business in town.

This was the main source of bloody xenophobic attacks in South Africa two years ago, which still break out now and then to this day. Foreigners grabbed opportunities and jobs that were there for the taking, resulting in an improvement in their lives. They became objects of hate and envy. This is an untended consequence of cultural entitlement, which embeds conservatism, typical of any indigenous people anywhere in the world.

That was then — before blacks regained their country and, as a result, full rights. A lot happened in between, but not much was achieved as far is indigenous economic empowerment was concerned although various policy measures were taken.

To the uninitiated, indigenisation does not necessarily spell anarchy and disorder. It is but a form of affirmative action. Affirmative action is a term coined in the United States in the 1950s to promote mainly the educational and employment rights of the descendants of freed black slaves and other minorities. It refers to policies that take race, ethnicity, physical disabilities, gender, or a person’s parents’ social class into consideration in an attempt to promote equal opportunity or increase ethnicity or other forms of diversity.

The focus of such policies ranges from employment and education to public contracting and health programmes. The goal of affirmative action is twofold: to maximise diversity in all levels of society, along with benefits, and to redress disadvantages due to overt, institutional, or involuntary discrimination.

Affirmative action is referred to as reservation in India, positive discrimination in the United Kingdom and employment equity in Canada.

Today, with Zimbabwe on the road to economic recovery and the enactment of the enabling legislation, indigenous economic empowerment activity should increase this year bolstered by the emergence of world economies from the global financial turmoil that hit two years ago.

South Africa is currently grappling with this issue. Although apartheid has been dead for two decades and the country is ruled by blacks, whites still dominate the economy and hold most of the wealth. Comprising only 10 percent of the country’s population of 45 million, whites (directly or through equity positions) control 69 percent of the companies listed on the Johannesburg Stock Exchange; 27 percent are in foreign hands, and just 4 percent are controlled by blacks.

The imbalance is also pronounced among wage earners. Some 100 000 white South Africans earn more than US$60 000 annually; just 5 000 blacks do. While almost 300 000 blacks became middle-income earners (between US$13 000 and US$23 000 annually) over the past three years, there is still 40 percent unemployment, which largely affects the black community. According to Black Economic Empowerment (BEE policies), South Africa’s largest industries have to set targets for training more black workers, promoting more black managers, and using more black-owned suppliers.

Since 1994, the government has been implementing BEE policies. However, the government has been cautious in implementing BEE, partly because it has benefited mainly politically-connected individuals rather than the mass of the previously disadvantaged, and partly because South Africa’s corporate sector continues to be dominated — managed and owned — by the minority whites.

The government has co-operated with corporate capital and set empowerment targets acceptable to local industry and foreign companies. Labour and black business have been peripheral to the empowerment process. Black business has expressed criticism at the slow pace of reducing white domination of the corporate world, while labour has criticised BEE deals for enriching a small number of people.

As companies rush to meet their BEE requirements, they often turn to the same small group of black capitalists, offering to sell or grant equity stakes at favourable terms, often financed by the companies themselves, in return for connections, expertise and links to the black marketplace.

President Jacob Zuma has continued to push BEE policies inherited from his predecessors, designed to put more of the economy in black hands, in part by forcing the country’s largest industries to set targets for training more black workers, promoting more black managers, and using more black-owned suppliers.

Big firms that want to do business with the state must now file a BEE scorecard to prove they are promoting "previously disadvantaged individuals", including blacks, mixed-race "coloureds" and Indians. Since government spending is some US$20 billion a year — or about 20 percent of GDP — it’s a deal not many companies can afford to pass up.

There is more to empowerment than merely taking over a business. Empowerment should encompass business skills development, economic development, management control, employee equity and preferential procurement. Ownership and management control are closely linked.

Through preferential procurement, indigenous empowerment cascades through the economy by compelling big companies to purchase from smaller empowerment-compliant companies which, in turn, procure from even smaller companies and so on.

On its own, empowerment is not broad-based if compliance emphasises ownership. Truly broad-based empowerment focuses on deals that bring in employees, unions and ordinary black people through, for instance, employee share ownership schemes and union investment companies. The nation will not benefit from narrow-based indigenisation where a handful of people get the lion’s share of empowerment deals. The empowerment strategy should not lose its broad-based nature.

Business leaders always use politics to promote and protect their business. Management guru Tom Peters says anyone afraid of politics is not made for business. Granted that deal-making and shifting alliances are part of the business game, this can be taken too far to the detriment of the company and economy — which seems to be the case at Telecel.

It’s not coincidental that the ownership wrangle at the mobile phone company has re-erupted at this time when firms have to regularise their ownership structures. Accusations and counter-accusations have been made. It appears there is too much bad blood and the organisation has been torn apart.

The miracle of the market is supposed to be that competition is healthy, that the struggle to create something better, faster and cheaper benefits nearly everyone. That’s the rationale some people use to explain why greed is good but throw in animosity, the game easily goes out of control.

That’s how the vicious 10-year rivalry between two top executives — the chief operating officer and the vice chairman — drove US multibillion dollar company, Enron Corporation, its employees and its shareholders over the cliff in 2002. The two bad-mouthed, undercut and outmanoeuvred each other.

One of them wanted to crush not just Enron’s competitors in the corporate world but any potential rival within and subordinates were caught up in the rivalry. They were virtually running two competing companies within what was supposed to be one focused organisation. The culture turned paranoid: former CIA and FBI agents were hired to enforce security. Using "sniffer" programmes, they would pounce on anyone e-mailing a potential competitor.

The "spooks", as the former agents were called, were known to barge into offices and confiscate computers. A local pastor, after hearing from so many unhappy workers, wrote to the company: "These people don’t belong to you. They belong to God." As things spun out of control, they masked losses and debts and projected future profits as present earnings through creative and possibly fraudulent accounting. Telecel had better take note.

Exceptional leadership will be required to establish a balance between entrepreneurship and social responsibility and accountability to bring about success in the pursuit of genuine transformation.

While Government policy is key and decisive, business should not shy away from working for the common good.

l conway.tutani@zimpapers.co.zw

It is the old story of greed... Africa has been ruled by it and no matter how good the intentions are at the start they somehow always turn to greed, and when a hungry dog wants something and you resist he will kill you. This story of taking over commercial farms is a load of sh1t, it boils down to an infinative lack of understanding and foresight. Do they honestly believe that they will be at the same level as the current commercial farmer if they had started out in a race?

They want us to hand in our guns..... hmmmmm, the SAPS woman phoned me whilst doing my firearm applications and asked why i wanted a glock in 40 S&W, i said to her "maam, i dont intend using the weapon to kill anyone. but if the need arrises and i am in the parrameters of what is set out in law i want to make sure that he dead" she said " oh okaaaay, thank you and put up the phone" i am collecting my firearms next week after 4 years of constant fighting.

But this post does no one any good, we dont have oil so there is no real vested interest in what happens down south in africa, one might as well have posted the whole "night of the long knives saga"

Greed is obviously one of the a root causes of the troubles in Africa. But greed combined with tribalism is the killer. Very sad.