What I think it is is the O mighty dollar! They make more on seperate shipments, why let we, "the hunter" get a brake!
The brokers could have had alot to do with the US changing their policy, there it is again, "The O mighty dollar!"

Good idea Mike, there is always at least one way to beat the system.

Where did you get this information about shipments coming into the US? I can't find anything about it?

Mike...........Freaking BULLSEYE!
I have had my hunters doing this for 10 years now!

Balla Balla is correct. Not quite as easy as Mike's idea.



In Zim, at the end of the hunt, you sign off on the Government paperwork stating all of the animals you took. It would have been quite difficult to say that Mark and his PH shot nothing, while I ended up shooting two of everything with my PH. In fact, I am pretty sure (but not certain) that the Zim Government Game Scout signs off or at least sees the paperwork to confirm that the list includes the animals you took.



At the end of the day, not worth the trouble. Yes, it is an increased cost, but in the scope of the total safari cost, it is not much.



Tim

I would dissagree with this difficulty as we have been doing this for almost as long as I have been working in this business. The Concerns Peter writes of may be true in Zambia, but then only when you add in the odds or need of employment for a group of people who would have to close the loop on this. It does not exist in RSA maybe in Zambia.

Peters point of two gun permits with one hunter not shooting anything may not add up. I'm not sure at what point that is checked in Zambia? I have not hunted in Zambia enough to know this detail. His concerns may be well founded.

In RSA I have lots of hunters who do not bring their own guns so that is never an issue. Even with those who do if all the trophys from a 2X1 hunt are listed on one PH register in one hunters name there is no government entity that verifies who shot what and who owns what trophy when it's shipped. The pack and dip process is so long after the hunt, as is the shipping. So long as the Vet paperwork and the PH register match the game all is well with the world.

The system just does not go that far into checking nor does it really care. I have only had one hunter in my whole career who shot nothing in ten days. This a long story but it was his forth or fifth trip with me and the trip started out with his lost luggage. From that point his Zim hunt was cancelled due to unrest in the area. It got worse from there with bad weather and his poor health.

The point is I have had a hunter come and shoot nothing. Nobody did an investigation on this. If there was a bit of paranoia and you really want to save the money while hunting 2X1 bring two rifles put them in one hunters name and and then hunt 1X1 with a "non-hunter".

This whole effort could save you as much as 500-600 bucks in all the paperwork and shipping etc. If that is worth it then the idea is good and functional. If that amount is not worth it then don't sweat this and pay your own way. If you clear your own trophies then the savings can be much more. This is the most important part of the savings. You cannot clear trophies unless they are in your name. When two hunters share a shipping crate and they are listed as two diffferent owners then you must have a brokers license to clear the box. I have only heard of one single time where the two hunters arrived together at the customs to clear the box and it was allowed. I have never again heard of US Customs letting that go. The Broker fees on this side can be the real killer. If you intend to clear them yourself the savings can me quite good.

I have had countless non-hunters come to video for their spouse or friend. Or just to tag along with their dad. Many of these non-hunters have shot game during their visit. In every case the non-hunters trophies are part of the hunters PH register. Imagine the cost of shipping a single set of impala horns and a cape back. Then compare that to sticking it in with another load going to the same place!

Mark65x55, I am beginning to see the light. Two buff skulls and hides and one hartebeest cost $3500.00 plus to get to me. That is the cost of another hunt.

You guys are clearly hunting in the wrong place or with the wrong people! Thats a pile of money for your trophies to get to the states! My 2 things from this past season were in another hunters crate. He had a full safari with 11 animals. The pack and dip for all the contents was 700 bucks, the shipping was 650.00 and the broker/tannery clearing service was 150...... 1500 bucks total from RSA to New Method tannery in San Fransisco. The hunts ended in mid May and the trophies were here in late October. This is not the exception. It's the same every year.

It depends on the country I suspect..It would be very easy for these guys to regulate this if they choose..A package must conform to the license, end of story....I think that will happen in Tanzania very shortly, but thats only gossip as of now...The increase in trophy fees is not gossip, it is now a fact of life, however the good news is they are still a bit cheaper than any other country..

The Tanzanians are jumping on the Zimbabwe problems and I assure you they will milk it to the bone..I foresee all these African getting their heads together and forming some kind of a union and regulating pricing, and if they ever do that you can bet the greedy bastards will shove themselves into poverty and much of what we have today will again be only within the pocket book of the very wealthy..Our only salvation is they are still tribal enough not to get along together or trust each other....

Now thats just an opinnion and I have no basis other than I have delt with these folks for years and do have some insight into their thinking...

Based on the problems we've had, plus just what you stated, the cost, I don't plan to import anymore trophies. And if I could talk my wife into it I'd tell the PH to keep the ones we've got over there now. Its come to the point that the hassle and cost just ain't worth it. Plus I talked to Pattie at Coppersmiths Friday afternoon, she stated the Feds have cracked down on imports from Namibia. If all the paper work wasn't in order and dated correctly that they'd refuse entry and could send it back to Namibia. She also stated that in some cases, when the package was refused entry, that the shipping agent was trying to charge people for the return shipping. 8x10 photos are starting to look better all the time, with a lot less hassle and cost.

I know that I have some serious differences in opinion with Ray and others on the forum but my problems are not unique to me as others seem to be having the same problems and once your trophies are shipped you seem to loose control of them all the while the expenses mount up and you are responsible for them.
I hunted with a reputable booking agent in Tanzania last year and had some issues with how the hunt was advertised and the final outcome. This was discussed ad infanauseum on the forum with the final outcome that I was wrong! The issues were setteled and the tropies were sent to me. They were shipped per someone elses instructions and not mine. They went to Houston not Dallas and because they used another clients instructions the trophies could not clear customs. The trophies sat in storage for two months while they tried to sort the mess out. When they finally got through with me and $2800.00 for all charges they would not ship the trophies to me without going to a FDA approved station in Houston even though there was one here in Oklahoma city. That took an additional 3 weeks of negotiations. Finally, It went to Quality Fur Dressing in Houston area. They would not ship to me as they wanted to ship to a Taxidermist. My taxidermist was asked to submit a full credit report and Banking info to deal with them on a one time basis. No one here wanted to do that but after a month I found one that would. In the intrim, I tried to pay them for charges using my credit card which they took. After all this it was decided that the Taxidermist would have to be the one to pay and another $ 5.00 per day charge was accumulating to a bill total of $486.00 plus $180.00 for trucking to OKC. What a gem of a group to deal with. The State Attourney General has been involved with the frausulent basis for all of these needless charges!!!!

These shipment costs from Southern Africa always amaze me and I've paid a few. We ship with Lufthansa Air Cargo from Addis Ababa to the various ports of entry in the USA and have never had a shipment go over $750. Meanwhile, without going into particulars, if the law says it's two separate shipments, then that's the way we'll do it.

Rich Elliott

N'gagi

According to the people that shipped my trophies last year. This proceedure results from requirements directed by the U.S. Dept. Of Homeland Security [not the shippers or brokers] this started in mid 2003 in Chicago and is now being spread everywhere.

The intent is to verify responsible parties for each shipment. All shipments are x-rayed
"over there" so that dangerous stuff does not end up here.

Apparently there is a paperwork system to combine shipments but the paperwork is probably prohibitive and not worth the shippers time. [to them!]

I was informed however that [customs clearance broker] Fauna and Flora has gotten permission to continue with combined shipments, however requiring an additional $50 for each additional hunter [which, of course is much less than even the cost of an additional crate much less shipping]

If I get more definitive word I will post it here.

Les