I noticed in another post on the double rifle forum that I'm not the only one who's had a bad experience dealing with A-Square. One the most valuable things about AR, to me at least, is that I can get warnings and advice from others before investing my hard-earned time and money. In that spirit, and wanting to save my friends unnecessary trouble....

BLUF: Art Alphin is either a very bad businessman or a liar, neither of which should end up with your money in his hands.

I purchased a 10-round wallet of A-Square .416 Rigby ammo through a big-name outfit. I took it to the range and had one round, in the several I tried, fail to fire. I called Art and he asked me to send him the full wallet of ammo and said he would conduct an autopsy of the round that failed to fire and then he would send me a new 10 round wallet of ammo.
- O/A 18 Sept: Ammunition sent back to A-Square
- Approx one week later: Art called and said the ammo was not defective, made some suggestions on dealing with my rifle, which he opined was at fault, and said he would send me the new wallet of ammo
- O/A 23 Oct: I called A-Square and left a message reminding them to send ammo and left my phone number
- O/A 31 Oct: I called, restated the history above, and asked for a return phone call
- O/A 1 Nov: I called and spoke with Art. He said, reference sending me the ammo, "it didn't get done" but "it's beng done now"
- O/A 14 Nov: I called Art and told him I would like the ammo in time for a Thanksgiving Day shoot and he said "you'll have it"
- Mid Feb: I sent a letter via USPS to the address on A-Square's web-site (the one I had in my 'favorites') and the USPS said "we attempted to deliver your item...on 15 Feb...and a notice was left"
- 12 Mar: I called A-Square to find the number had been disconnected. I later contacted the big name outfit and they were able to give me up-to-date contact info for A-Square
- O/A 30 Mar: I spoke with Art and he said he'd been out of the office with health problems, but he recalled our previous conversations. I ran through the history againand asked if, because I had now sold the .416 and bought a .470, if he would simply send me 10 pieces of .470 brass. Art said "sure" and I gave him my mailing address.
- No big surprise...nothing arrived in the mail today...

I've been extremely patient and given Art every chance to show himself to be a gentleman who keeps his word. Sadly, he did not. Recommend you spend your money elsewhere.

BadgerMatt,

I know they are moving to Glenrock, Wyoming (a small hamlet of 3500 outside of Casper).

I am sorry to hear that their customer service was so poor.

You know my father stopped in the FNAWs headquarters one time to renew his and my memberships and pick up some hats. It was the week of their convention (so not a good time to be doing this), and they told him they couldn't help him.

Customer service doesn't stop when the chips are down, but for some reason a lot of times it seems to.

A-Square is a neat company. It's too bad they screwed up your order. Good luck on dealing with them in the future if you continue to.

I hope it was just the move and not the lack of customer service that prompted this.

The point I was making with FNAWs is that communication is more important on explaining what you can't do then what you can.

Gosh, sounds like our buddy Art is still in the business of taking people's money and not delivering products.

Why folks continue to try to send him money is beyond me. How many times does he need to misrepresent himself and his products and get away with it?

Not to excuse anything, but AA was in a world of trouble a few years ago with the BATFE. He claimed it was not of his own making and was undeserved.

The feds basically shut him down. AA claimed a disgruntled former employee, whom AA had fired for stealing from the company, fabricated a series of charges against him. The ex-employee apparently alleged that AA had committed a number of violations of firearms and other laws. Enough, anyway, to bring the feds down on him with a vengeance.

I never did hear how it all turned out.

I know Art and he is a personal friend. I am sorry to hear of your problems with his customer service, PM me and I'll help out.


Aleko

D99 -- I've been in Glenrock a couple times to drop of antelope at the taxidermist who, by the way, had some very nice African mounts in the showroom at the time. I spoke with Art and I believe the only piece of Art's business moving to Glenrock is the rifle building.

Aleko -- Shot you a PM. Thanks for the offer. Know that it's not about the money, the ammo, or the brass...

A Square put the "cus" in customer service.

Matt's experience is not an isloated one. About 6 years ago, I placed a large bullet order with them (over $500). They took my money and never received the order. The calls, messages, etc. over a 9 months period were of little use.

I chalked it up to an expensive lesson. I for one will never buy this "Art is a good guy" crap. What does one call somebody that takes a person's hard earned money and goes into hiding?

This was in the Wyoming Business Newspaper

http://wbr.datajoe.com/app/ecom/pub_article_details.php?id=85887

Glenrock can't be a hamlet; there are no pigs in Glenrock, unless you visit one of the bars about 1AM . 3500 might be stretching it a tad by ~1000.

Well, I'll be danged. A box with 10 pieces of .470 NE brass from Art just showed up via FEDEX.

Good for you.

Maybe he saw this post and decided to FEDEX it over before things got out of control.

Quote from Heritage Arms

I know Art and he is a personal friend. I am sorry to hear of your problems with his customer service, PM me and I'll help out.


Aleko

www.heritagearms.net


Well I must say, your a true friend to Art Alphin. Bravo...I would only hope to think that some of my friends would do the same for me instead of join the pack. I have never done any buisness with A-square, read alot of negative feedback. There must be something good about his rifles. I think they are built on enfield actions, and there are alot of guys on here doing the same thing.

A box of .375 Weatherby brass I ordered from them wasn't even dimensionally correct. I found the brass to be soft and unable to maintain primer pocket size with loads other companies' (H&H) brass handled fine. There never was a response as to why -- phone service problems, "He's not here today", etc.

Thought him getting out of the business end would bring change. Lesson learned.

BNagel

So, does anyone know how AA's legal troubles were resolved?

I would think that he must have come out clean, or he wouldn't be able to get a manufacturer's license.

Unless he is only an officer or employee of the company, and not the licensee.

mrlex

I understand that the ATF did not pursue a case against Art and released all of his guns, equipment, computers and records after about a year or so. Then Art pursued a civil claim against the ATF agents involved, but I have not heard how that worked out. Perhaps your secretary can run a litigation search. The case would have either been in KY (A2's offices at the time) or IN (Art's home at the time, which was raided).

Regardless of the customer service issues, most of which Art has tried to fix, A-Square has published the best reloading manual of all time in my opinion.

I got ASquare`s manual a while ago and its one of the very best manuals i have seen, not just with loading the ammo, but its so very much more than just that included in the book.

So that book they got rightm and also the loading data for the 105mm artillery shell, it shows that all ammo is similiar, it just how many kilos difference in the charge and weight that seperates them.

unforunate about the complaints tha tsurrounds mr Alpin and his firm, but if there is someone else tha thas helped the Game departments and National PArk services getting proper ammunition and rifles tha tcan handle them than he , i dont know about it.

He has done very much good for the guys in Zimbabwe through the years.

Mr Rigby

A square ammuntion is the worst on the market. The bullets don't work as advertised and the loadings are so inconsistent as to be worthless and undependable.

quote:

Originally posted by 500grains:
mrlex

I understand that the ATF did not pursue a case against Art and released all of his guns, equipment, computers and records after about a year or so. Then Art pursued a civil claim against the ATF agents involved, but I have not heard how that worked out. Perhaps your secretary can run a litigation search. The case would have either been in KY (A2's offices at the time) or IN (Art's home at the time, which was raided).

Regardless of the customer service issues, most of which Art has tried to fix, A-Square has published the best reloading manual of all time in my opinion.

Thanks for the information. Regardless of what one may think of AA's personality, products or customer service, it would appear that he may have been grievously wronged in this incident.

I agree, BTW, about "Any Shot You Want." It is the flat out BEST handloading manual in existence.