For those that have followed up wounded Leopard, has a scoped rifle come in handy?
Seen a follow up on DVD by PH R. Labusechagne where he grabs the clients scoped rifle to see the Leopard in a thicket.

Oz
I have no experience in this, but after testing the Zeiss Z6IR whilst at a show, I think that it could be quite feasible if you practice with the setup. For me the Z6 was the first scope where I could keep both eyes open and still maintain perfect target alignment. That red dot just pulls you into the frame. Due to my eye dominance issues I would still seriously consider it for low light follow ups, the real question I would have to ask though, is would it be as reliable as a set of iron sights.

I guess everyone has their own preferences, but personally, I like to use iron sights (specifically a red fibre optic foresight), a big headlight, a small Surefire torch (flashlight to you Americans) taped to the rifle and a tracker with a (blue light) Surefire Kroma.

Those Surefire torches ain't cheap, esp the Kroma, but as far as I'm concerned, they'd be well worth the money, even if they cost 10 times as much as they do.

I never remember the shot when it comes but think the shot is just instinct rather than a deliberately aimed, but that's how I set it up and so far, it hasn't let me down.

I'm not suggesting that's the only way to do it, and others can do it any way they like, but (FWIW) that's how I like to do it.

Steve
Being that you are "The Cat Man", I am interested in that fibre optic of yours.
Who fitted it and do you have a pic to show
Might be the way to go with my 458.
Chat soon
Ian

Ian,

Here's the pic. The foresight was supplied by Sabi Rifles in Nelspruit and wasn't particularly expensive....... If I remember correctly, it was US$10-20 or so. You need to make sure you're buying a proper fibre optic sight and not just a plastic one. The plastic version is cheaper but it's a piece of crap and not worth having.

The fibre optic sight is a little bit delicate and they don't last forever and I keep a spare and a cut down allen key in the little storage doo hickey in my stock.

Incidentally, the pic doesn't really do it justice........ even in very low light, it just leaps into vision.

Steve
That is pretty impressive. I will give Eugene a call. Had you ever thought of putting a shield over it or would that stop it from working?
Chat soon
Ian

Ian,

If you shield it, you stop the available light getting to it and although it would probably work to some degree, it wouldn't work as it should.

FWIW, when I'm doing a night follow up, I actually wear two headlights. One very bright and set to point where I'm looking into the bush and a smaller LED one set to shine onto the foresight when the rifle is in my shoulder and ready to go............ and it stays in that position for the entire follow up process.

That looks like a NECG ramp. If it is their masterpiece ramp with the little spring detent thingie, they make a windowed hood for it. Just the thing for a fiber optic sight. Here is the link.

http://www.newenglandcustomgun...20&Category_Code=MFS

I have one on the way from Midway, NECG was out of stock.

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
I guess everyone has their own preferences, but personally, I like to use iron sights (specifically a red fibre optic foresight), a big headlight, a small Surefire torch (flashlight to you Americans) taped to the rifle and a tracker with a (blue light) Surefire Kroma.

Those Surefire torches ain't cheap, esp the Kroma, but as far as I'm concerned, they'd be well worth the money, even if they cost 10 times as much as they do.

I agree 100%! The absolute last thing I want on my rifle for a close follow-up in tight cover, is a scope on my rifle!

The red fiber-optic front sight coupled with two green or yellow fiber optic dots on the back sight is worth it's weight in gold for this activety. The Sure-Fire on the under side of the barrels on a double rifle also is a real binifite as well.

I use this set-up on my 9.3X74R double rifle for shooting wild boar as the light begines to fade, and even after full dark. Wild hogs are hunted at night in most of Texas, as they do so much crop damage, they are considered varments, and are not protected, and no bag limits in Texas. Works like a charm!

Mac
Have you got a picture of the rear? I shoot really well with the twin dots on the rear of handguns, never really seen one for rifles though. Did you get someone to make one up or are these commercially available.

Steve, what does that Kroma do and is is really that good?
Ian

Ian,

They're about US$330 in the US but I think here, they're about US$500 each (mine was a Christmas present from Mama Shakari so I'm not sure of exact price)......and yes, they're worth every penny of that. Every pinhead of blood shines back at you like you wouldn't believe.



US$500 sound a lot for a torch, but when you step out there in the dark to look for Mr Spots when you know he'll have lost his sense of humour, it suddenly seems like money very well spent.

I forgot to say that when I tape my ordinary (small) Surefire to the forend of my rifle, I tape it to the side so that my thumb naturally falls right behind the button on the end. That way, I only have that torch on when I need it and the rest of the time, I can relax my thumb and rely on my headlights.

That way, I get as much time out of the batteries as possible.

quote:

Originally posted by Vlam:
Oz
I have no experience in this, but after testing the Zeiss Z6IR whilst at a show, I think that it could be quite feasible if you practice with the setup. For me the Z6 was the first scope where I could keep both eyes open and still maintain perfect target alignment. That red dot just pulls you into the frame. Due to my eye dominance issues I would still seriously consider it for low light follow ups, the real question I would have to ask though, is would it be as reliable as a set of iron sights.

Ian,

Have a look at this site.

www.tacticalconcepts.net/HAKKO RED DOT.htm

I have very limited experience with this sort of thing, several followups but just two charges. One with a shotgun, NEVER AGAIN, the other with a scoped rifle because that was what I had. Okay, could have taken the scope off, but it wasn't my leopard and at the beginning we thought it was dead . . .
My opinion is you are better off with whatever you shoot best when it's close and fast. I like those highly visible fiber optic sights. I have a couple of friends my age who have mounted "holo sights" on their doubles, looks pretty weird, but they work, and these guys have sensibly accepted that that they can no longer properly resolve iron sights. Eyesight aside, an awful lot of us are children of the scope era, and we do not wake up one day at middle age and find ourselves suddenly proficient with iron sights. If you're going to use them, huge amounts of practice is essential. I wouldn't necessarily give up on a low-powered scope, especially for those of us with middle-age-+ eyes! It helps immensely if you can shoot a scope with both eyes open, which pretty much means shooting from the dominant-vision side. All said, an actual leopard charge is so fast my very limited experience suggests you will shoot the rifle like a shotgun, so gun fit and pointing abilities are paramount, sights not critical. But it seems at least as likely to have a chance for an aimed shot before things become point-blank, which is my rationale for using what you use best.

Craig,

Brilliantly put! I couldn't agree more.

FWIW, my 500 has a 19 inch barrel (I think!) and handles like a skeet shotgun........

All that said, I believe the best way to deal with a charging leopard is to avoid the charge in the first place by having the client rehearse the shot so many times he gets his shot right when he's in the blind. Since I started that routine, I'm glad to say, I haven't had to a single follow up on a wounded Leopard.

Shakari, even better said! The best followup is none at all--no matter what you're carrying, not all leopard charges will be stopped, too fast, too close. No other animal is as likely to get through to you. Cheers, C

The way I like to rehearse the shot is to measure the range from the blind to the bait and the ground to the bait etc. Then we go off to the range and recreate the shot EXACTLY. Even down to the same chair and rifle rests etc.

Then I take a long cardboard box and draw the (lifesize) shape of a Leopard on it and fix a small plastic water bottle inside the box where the heart would be on the cat. Then I tell the client he has as much time as he likes, but he needs to put at least 3 consecutive shots into the 'heart' of the Leopard.

Bearing in mind he can't see where the bottle/heart is inside the box, it makes him think about where the heart really lies inside the box/cat. More often than not, at least the first two shots are too far back to hit the bottle.

It takes a bit longer this way but it's surely saved me some grey hairs.

Shakari, I like your system!!!!!! There is no excuse for wounding a leopard over bait--but I've done it, and I'm not alone! Ever since the "leopard project" I've been watching this stuff a lot closer. Chifuti keeps a couple of the Texas-made "Versarests" (VRS) in camp. Of course, they're not always in the right camp when needed...but I don't think they've had a single wounded leopard off of a really good rest like that. More food for thought!

No leopard, thank God, but two lion. And both times with a scope.

I have found that a 1x to 2.5x scope can be very fast at close range. Fast enough, anyway.

But I think I would feel just as confident with a good set of irons.

A fiber optic front bead, like the one shakari has posted above, with a wide, express "Vee" rear sight, with a centered gold line below the bottom of the "Vee" - is what I prefer.

I have posted this before, but this is the rear sight set up I like.

Knowing the physiology of the cats will help tremendously in making a one shot kill. The heart sits further to the rear in the cats. Also. I recommend picking a single rosette and holding a steady POA on it - the rosettes (spots) can cause sight confusion, as the designer intended them to do.

Of course this all goes out the window during a charge.

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:
I have posted this before, but this is the rear sight set up I like.

MR,

They have that on the Ruger M77 African. I love it. With that back v notch site and a large white front bead it's ridiculously fast. In fact I don't think I've ever seen open sites that are faster or that I like more.

Brett

Craig,

I've never been lucky enough to see a Versarest let alone have the use of one, but looking at your video, they look like a helluva good idea in a Leopard blind (or at the range for that matter).

I use a set of (firmly fixed and lowered) Long Grass shooting sticks in the front and make up a rock solid rear rest with suitably shaped poles usually held together with umpteen ladder straps. I'm not satisfied until the rifle sits naturally (and wobble free) into a position where it's going to point directly at where the cat will be when it's on the bait....... I also like to position the rifle so that only the shortest part of the muzzle sticks out of the blind.

I reckon it's vitally important to make the client absolutely as comfortable as possible for the shot and to rehearse the shot sufficient times so that he is 110% comfortable with everything that's gonna happen when the big moment arrives.

The shot at the Leopard should be the easiest shot of any safari but it's the one that is most often stuffed up.......... I was 'taught to be cautious' and like to try to reduce the chance of something going wrong to the minimum.

Regarding rearsights, I also use the shallow vee but mine are on a quarter rib (gotta have a bit of style what!) but I'm not sure I actually aim when a shot occurs. I think it's instinctive snap shooting and although (as I've said before) I never remember the shot, I'd guess I just use that big red foresight and nothing else.

Thanks Guys,
As you may know, I have been trying for Leopard semi serious with guys like Ian Gibson, Pete Wood and Stu Taylor, but it's not been a high priority.
I will be in Northern Moz shortly for a good portion of June and July and might get the opportunity at a Leopard.
Due to flight weight restrictions I will only bring one rifle with Blaser QD mounts.
I was wandering if open sights where always best for follow up or if a scope amongst the tools would be a better option than all open sights?
Times when one wishes he held on to ones scoped 450/400

Oz,

This is probably a stupid question, but I hope you'll forgive me for asking it.

You do know that the Aussie Govt won't allow you to import a Leopard trophy don't you?

quote:

Originally posted by Brett Adam Barringer:

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:
I have posted this before, but this is the rear sight set up I like.

MR,

They have that on the Ruger M77 African. I love it. With that back v notch site and a large white front bead it's ridiculously fast. In fact I don't think I've every seen open sites that are faster or that I like more.

Brett

Ruger and CZ have long made the most useful and sturdy factory rifle sights.

Other makers, especially Winchester, should do the same.

I obviously agree that this set up is the best!

Winchester uses Recknagel, the best of the best. What the hell are you talking about????

You're kidding, right?

Winchester doesn't even make ANY version of the Model 70 with ANY factory iron sights these days.

And they haven't made anything in .375 and up since they left Connecticut a few years ago.

And even the CT rifles did not (to my knowledge) come supplied with Recknagels from the factory.

?????

Yes, ALL the CT Big Bores came with Recknagel sights from the Winchester factory. The M70 Classic was the best M70 of them all.

quote:

Originally posted by Buliwyf:
Yes, ALL the CT Big Bores came with Recknagel sights from the Winchester factory.

You are simply wrong.

quote:

...and yes, they're worth every penny of that. Every pinhead of blood shines back at you like you wouldn't believe

Steve, about the Surefire Kroma,do you mine to emphasize that point about the blood spots?

I see that in addition to the white light, they also have blue and red light by a twist of a ring.
Does the blue or red light make the blood spots stand out in some way, such as it easier to follow a wounded game in darkness?

Or is it that the white beam is so bright that the blood stands out red and clear as in bright sunlight?

Arild,

The torches are LED and not particularly bright, but the blue function makes even the smallest pinhead of blood shine jet black back at you.

I've no idea if it's some kind of special light or if it works with any blue light..... FWIW, a couple of people have told me it's the same kind of light that the forensics people use to detect blood.

However it works, it REALLY does work brilliantly!!

Thanks for the reply Steve.
I just cheked the price for the Surefire Kroma at Midway here in Norway.
They ask aprox 580 USD !

Cabelas ask 329 USD stateside, but when delivered over the pond, I guess it will be as expencive as at Midway.

Anyway, I will be looking around for the Kroma

Arild,

You might be able to find one on e-bay and/or see if any AR members from the US might be coming your way and willing to bring it over to you.

Alternatively, have it sent to a US address and then have it sent to you and marked as a gift. Which would probably mean yoo don't have to pay duty on it.

Whatever the cost, (IMO) they're absolutely priceless when you have to do a night time follow up on dangerous game.

Arild,

It's probably cheaper toget someone in the states to buy oyuo one and post it over.

Rgds,
FB

Thank´s guys, will have a look see

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:
You're kidding, right?

+1

I assumed he wasn't serious, so I didn't reply. I'm not much on the Winchester sites. The Remington's are horendous. CZ is reasonably good, but as stated the Ruger site is outstanding.

Brett

Ozhunter as a rule iron sights are best for fast shooting - you seldom have time to aim anyway so detachable mounts are a good plan.

I have once or twice spotted the cat (good tracker's eyes not mine)at some distance and a scope would then be quite useful - as with Rusty using it to check out thick cover.

But not as your primary charge receiver - because make no mistake if its wounded you are 90% going to get charged.