For you experienced Elephant hunters:

How thick is an Elephant's hide over the heart lung kill zone?

How large is the heart and were does it sit in realation to the leg/elbow(broadside view)

Are the major heart veins & arterys "protected by the upper legbone(Again broadside view)

Most of the kills I've seen hear we brain shot(understandably so) has anyone made a kill with a single heart shot?

If so what were the results, in time & distence?

What is an "undisterbed" tolerence level for a human 50yrds? 20yrds? I do understand with ALL animals in the wild ANYTHING can happen.

Thank you!

One Post script question: How high from the ground is an Elephants heart?

Boss Kongoni,

Most of our hunting was in thick rain forest or jungle. For that reason, 90% of our kills were lung shots. The elephant would go anywhere from 50 to 300 yards. It's not hard to track an elephant when he's plowing a trail for you . The surest shot was behind the front leg/shoulder area not more than midway up. It's large target that anyone can hit (but my wife, but that's another story).

Rich Elliott

You should read "A Hunter's Wanderings in Africa" by Selous. He preferred the heart shot, and describes it extensively in the book. From what he said, the heart is "covered" by the front should when the leg is in the rearward angle position. He often mentions waiting until the animal took a step with that leg to expose the heart.

That said, I have no experience at all on the subject, so this is just FWIW.

"Mahohboh" by Ron Thomson is a "must read" for anybody planning to hunt elephant for the 1st time, IMVHO. $50 from Safari Press.



Mahohboh



I am currently reading "Months in the Sun" by Ian Nyschens, which was loaned to me by Buzz. It is a great read for anybody planning to hunt big game in the middle Zambezi Valley into Mozambique, as he spent many years hunting in these areas and talks about them as they were 1947-1958, while relating to the present. I understand Mr. Nyschens is still living in Harare, somewhat of a recluse. Some of you may know him perhaps? The book was #20 of a limited 1000-copy run from Safari Press, and may no longer be available, but would be worth checking.

Pursuant to this recommendation, I just ordered the book. I head off on my 1st ele hunt in Botswana (with Johan Calitz) July 31st. Any and all answers to the above quesions by Boss Kongoni would also be appreciated as well as any other information for the first time ele hunter.

D. Nelson

From the limited experience of one heart shot on an elephant:

1. How thick is an Elephant's hide over the heart lung kill zone?
Not so thick that it will stop a bullet. Seriously, why do you ask? What difference could it possibly make?

2. How large is the heart and were does it sit in relation to the leg/elbow (broadside view)?
It's huge. Get Roberston's book "The Perfect Shot".

3. Are the major heart veins & arteries protected by the upper legbone (again broadside view)?
Only the very front portion of the heart, when the leg is in the normal or forward position.

4. Most of the kills I've seen here were brain shot(understandably so) has anyone made a kill with a single heart shot?
Yes, along with 3 follow up shots from the PH and one from me.

5. If so what were the results, in time & distance?
Distance: 100 yards. Time: just a few minutes.

6. What is an "undisturbed" tolerance level for a human 50 yds? 20 yds? I do understand with ALL animals in the wild ANYTHING can happen.
What to do you mean? You better be closer than 50 yards. I was 20 yards away.

Regards,

Terry

Terry,

I think he means how close can you get and not disturb an elephant (pissed-off, charging range).

That varies a whole bunch. If they know you are there and they are ticked-off they can and will charge from a really long way off!

Obviously, if they do not know you are there, you can smack them on the ass. I've never tried it myself, though.

There is supposedly a danger circle, inside of which the elephant will charge the hunter, but it is just pure bullshit, because there is no way to determine the diameter of the circle at any given moment.

I can't believe anyone will soon hunt elephants and not know where to shoot it: Get a copy of Mahohboh.

Will , thanks! Yes, That's what I was tring to ask. I reread it and I guess my question wasn't that clear.

Quote:

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Obviously, if they do not know you are there, you can smack them on the ass. I've never tried it myself, though.

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You know Will, if you counted "coup" on a Bull Elephant that would be real big medicine. Hell, they might make you a cheif. LOL

Oh, OK. If the elephant knows I'm there, I don't want to be any closer than a mile.



Here are the best pics I have of the skin.











This link Imagestation Album should take you to the album. Left Click on the thumbnail pic, then Left Click on the pic that comes up, then Left Click on "View Original Image" and it whould give a very large pic, for more detail.



Regards,



Terry

I posted some pict's on a new thread at: Ele 101 Pict's

I have seen a pi$$ed off cow charge our car from about 100 yards.

Elephants are moody beasts. Since they are so smart they are very complex and there isnt any "rough" guidlines regarding their behaviour. With enough time in the bush you can learn to "read" them to a certain degree. As with anything the more you do it the better you get.

It is my hope to track, appraoch and shoot an elephant all on my own someday. With my PH at my heels in case I screw up. I think that if I get to Africa this year that I will be ready to approach an easy one or perhaps approach a small heard that isnt all fired up. I told my PH about this plan a while back and thats what were working on, teaching me to be able to do this. He said that towards the end of the last hunt that with my current level of experience it isnt far off. I took it as a complement but I still dont feel ready yet.

BK,

Go to www.google.com and type in the words "elephant skin thick" and you will get answers re: elephant skin thickness. Most say about 1" thick, thicker on the back and thinner around the face, stomach and sides.

Interestingly "pachyderm" means "thick skinned".

Regards,

Terry

If you can punch up the African Hunter site,and go to the arcives look for the Hunting Ele section there are several digrams of shot placements