Can Legally taken Ivory be sold? If so what's the best plan?
The Ivory is in Zimbabwe and can be sent to Europe or the USA.
Regards.

I see you're in Oz and going from memory, I thought they didn't allow import of any elephant product but if you mean post ban sport hunted ivory (excluding the Oz issue) then the answer is no.

If you mean pre ban ivory and depending on where etc then the easiest answer is possibly but probably not easily.

quote:

from memory, I thought they didn't allow import of any elephant product but if you mean post ban sport hunted ivory (excluding the Oz issue) then the answer is no.

If you mean pre ban ivory and depending on where etc then the easiest answer is possibly but probably not easily.

I know this is historically a hot button issue on AR....but I really find it tough to believe that all ivory sold at trophy auctions in the US or everything sold at places like boonetrading.com is "pre-ban" and not more modern sport hunted ivory. Of course, even the reality of "sales taking place" of post-ban ivory doesn't make it fit the letter of the law.

I also find that hard to believe but I also wouldn't dream of suggesting that such sales are not strictly kosher.

As far as I'm concerned, the entire ivory ban was and still is a super mega bugly stuff up that should never have happened.

It would have been far better to allow the trade to continue but police it properly.

I now see the OP has amended his post to clarify matters and think he's asking 'can sport hunted ivory that is currently in and presumably was taken in Zimbabwe be sold/exported to Europe or the USA?'

And the answer to that exact question is no.

If however, one changed the question to: 'can sport hunted ivory that is currently in and presumably was taken in Zimbabwe be gifted to an individual in Europe or the USA and might that individual be inclined to give a reciprocal gift of some kind?' the answer might possibly be maybe and a lot would depend on the wording of the original permit and probably other permits and what the giftee did with the gift.

Personally I don't think it's worth the hassle or the possible risks if one got it wrong and I certainly wouldn't encourage anyone (esp anyone based in the US) to even sail close to the wind on such a thing.

All sport hunted ivory has an individual and distinct number punched into each tusk. Such ivory may not be sold. If you have sport hunted ivory and are not aware of this fact, you should look for the number(s) and record them. A part of the number includes the year taken, the country in which taken and the annual number of tusks taken during that year from that country. This is in accordance with CITES.

Good link with info from Boone:

http://boonetrading.com/Pg18.html

One should be very careful about using information from a company with a fiduciary interest in the buying/selling of ivory, IMO. Note that Boone makes no reference to "sport hunted ivory". I find their explanation of African Elephant ivory to be contradictory and confusing.

BTW, I own and posses legally sport hunted african Elephant ivory. However, I am not an attorney and do not represent myself as an expert on this topic.

quote:

Originally posted by LionHunter:
One should be very careful about using information from a company with a fiduciary interest in the buying/selling of ivory, IMO.

Not to be argumentative, but one could also take the position that those who have been in the business for a long time would absolutely know the ins and outs while also being subject to intense government scrutiny. I will agree that Boone does not mention sport hunted ivory at all but I would be very inclined to believe their statements on the subject for reasons noted above.

Here's some information I received from the USFWS when I asked them about selling rhino horn that was legally taken under the sport hunting quota after it was listed. I think elephants and rhinos are both listed at the same level, so it should apply to both.

Thank you for your inquiry regarding the sale of a white rhino game trophy. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service's mission is, working with others, to conserve, protect and enhance fish, wildlife, and plants and their habitats for the continuing benefit of the American people. The Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species (CITES) is an international agreement between governments. Its aim is to ensure that international trade in specimens of wild animals and plants does not threaten their survival. The species covered by CITES are listed in three appendices according to the degree of protection they need. Appendix I includes species threatened with extinction. Trade in specimens of these species is permitted only in exceptional circumstances. Appendix II includes species not necessarily threatened with extinction, but for which trade must be controlled in order to avoid overutilization that may threaten them with extinction. Appendix III contains species that are protected in at least one country, which has asked other CITES Party countries for assistance in controlling the trade in that species. Please be advised that on August 23, 2007, we published regulations that restrict the allowable use after import of Appendix I and Appendix II annotated listed species under CITES. You can view these regulations at: http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/...1.1.6.3.1.24&idno=50 The Southern white rhinoceros, Ceratotherium simum simum, from South Africa and Swaziland, is listed as an Appendix II species under CITES. Therefore, under paragraph (b) at the above link, specimens from Appendix II species, where other specimens of that species are treated as if listed in Appendix I, which is the case with the white rhinoceros, that were imported after the listing date for the white rhinoceros under CITES, which is January 7, 1975, can only be used for noncommercial purposes. You can view the CITES appendices at: http://www.cites.org/eng/app/appendices.shtml. Therefore, unfortunately, if your white rhino game trophy was imported after January 1, 1975, it cannot be sold. Thank you for your cooperation in complying with our regulations that help protect fish, wildlife, and plants and their habitats. Please feel free to respond to this message with any further inquiries that you may have regarding this matter.

quote:

Originally posted by tendrams:

quote:

Originally posted by LionHunter:
One should be very careful about using information from a company with a fiduciary interest in the buying/selling of ivory, IMO.

Not to be argumentative, but one could also take the position that those who have been in the business for a long time would absolutely know the ins and outs while also being subject to intense government scrutiny. I will agree that Boone does not mention sport hunted ivory at all but I would be very inclined to believe their statements on the subject for reasons noted above.

tendrams-
Nothing in Boone's comments has any bearing on ivory imported into the USA after January 1975, so believe what you like, but the relevance to the question is nill.

talentrec-
Thanks for posting your reply from USF&W, which confirms my understanding of the law.

If I understand this correct, sport hunted ivory can't be sold in the United States if imported since 1975. If this is the case, can you make molds of the tusks to keep and sell the ivory in (Zimbabwe as an example) at the end of your hunt?

If so does anybody ever do this?

If you can't do this how do families in the United States handle ivory in estate sales?

If anyone can help me understand this better I would appreciate it.

Post ban sport hunted ivory can't be legally sold in any country that is a signatory to CITES which means more or less anywhere but even if it could, values are relatively minimal because there's no real legal demand for it because of the ban.

AilsaWheels-

Let me respectfully suggest you do some research yourself to answer your questions. You are essentially asking for legal opinions on matters of law, so any answer you receive here or in any blog/forum would not justify nor defend any course of action on your part.

You do understand what the term "...may only be used for non-commercial purposes" means, yes?

You may certainly have molds made, but why would you choose to do so when you could legally import the ivory?

Mike

I think you misunderstood the question.

As I understand it, he was wondering if he could shoot an elephant in Zim, sell the ivory there & have fibre glass copies made for his trophy room.

Hi Steve,

No, I didn't misunderstand anything. I simply do not understand why anyone would prefer to have faux tusks when he could have the real deal?

You and I both agree that there is no market for legal sales of sport hunted ivory, as it is AGAINST THE LAW! One can sell the sport hunted Ele hide legally in Zim. Ivory is a separate and distinct item under CITES and by extension, any CITES signatory nation. At least that is my interpretation, but again, I don't claim to be a legal expert, just an informed sport hunter.

Shakari and LionHunter,

Thanks for the information. I did not realize post ban ivory legally taken couldn't be sold anywhere.

Do hunters estates or families just have to give the ivory away if none of the children want it?

I believe it can be given away but safer to leave it to someone in the will....... Even then, it has to have suitable permits to move across international borders but the good news is CITES are pretty much always happy to issue permits under those circumstances..... I've done several times including moving a tiger skin from RSA to England.

Shakari,

Thanks for the help. That sounds like the wisest thing to do.

quote:

Originally posted by LionHunter:
One can sell the sport hunted Ele hide legally in Zim.

That's a bit of a grey area but I wouldn't like to put it to the test.

The game dept etc can sell their stocks in country but I'm not aware of any legislation that actually says sport hunted trophies may be sold.

What we need to remember is there are an awful lot of of people/organisations out there waiting for an excuse to stop the transfer of sport hunting trophies & we need to be cleaner than clean & also seen to be so.

So why take the risk for what in reality isn't much more than a few hundred dollars.