I'm going to the Eastern Cape for the first time in mid-September and I'm really having fun getting ready. The only problem I have is what rifle to take. I've posted some pictures and comments about three that seem pretty good matches for the traditions of the area, and I'd like you to help me choose which to take. I'm limited to one rifle/drilling/cape gun so don't tell me to take all three, please.

Below is a J.P. Sauer & Sons pre-war Cape Gun in 16 gauge (70mm) and 7x57R. It looks pretty much like it did coming from the factory. It has claw mounts and a 1.5x4.5 Carl Zeiss with, of course, a German post. The choke on the shotgun barrel is almost full and shoots that way. #1 buck will hit a paper plate with 3 to 4 pellets at 35 yards. High brass #6 shot will put 15 or so pellets in the kill zone of a turkey neck target at the same range. The rifle trigger can be set and it is a 1.5" rifle at 100 yards the European Hornady ammo, I think 154 grain SST's at 2600 f.p.s. or so.





The next candidate is a military Oberndorf model '98 in 8x57 with a traditional German stock and another Carl Zeiss 1.5x to 4.5x scope. It is a .5" rifle and the action is slick as glass. It holds 5 down and even with the slightly heavier than usual barrel (a PacNor with express sights) it is balanced perfectly and a joy to carry. I realize that I can't shoot any birds with it, but I'll feel a bit more confident with it on any 200+ yard shots.





Finally, below is the final possible choice. It's another J.P. Sauer product, this time a pair of 12 gauge (70mm)barrels choked modified and full over a 9.3x74R. The rifle barrel shoots 286 grain Winchester PP factory ammo into a fifty-cent piece sized circle.... if you don't get the barrel hot. (The first two shots often touch). It has a German 4x32 scope with German #3 reticle on it that is as clear as can be. It has lever Q/D mounts as you can see.







What am I hunting? I have, as part of a contest I won, a kudu, an impala and a blesbok on tap included in the prize (free!!!!), but I'd like to hunt a bushpig over bait and maybe one of the smaller antelope. Birds will be secondary and mainly for the pot, if any. The shotgun barrels would give me a better chance if I decided on a blue duiker of caracal, I reckon.
I will be hunting no dangerous game this trip, btw.

And if you think I'm just doing this to brag about some great rifles.... not quite, but I do think they are pretty special and would all be fun on an Eastern Cape safari.

Question:
Please vote and then post your reasons afterwards by using the "reply" button.

Choices:
16 gauge/7mmR Cape gun
8x57mm Mauser
12/12/9.3x57R Drilling

 

I'd say the Drilling. Might be really nice on some small antelope.

Ernest, unless you want to hunt birds, bring the 8mm Mauser. The Eastern Cape was my first safari in 1999, and shots can be longish on Gemsbok, Kudu, and the like. The use of a shotgun for Duikers isn't needed, as they're full size Duikers as I remember, not tiny like Blues or Suni.

Biebs:

Didn't Mike Cuypers fix the little 8x57 rifle quite well? I knew he could do it!

They do offer blue duiker as one of their specialties.

And, I went and looked at the 7x57R ammo. It's Hornady 162 grain SST's at a nominal 2436 fps.

I haven't shot the 12 gauge with buckshot yet, but I plan to try it with some #4 buck in case I want to take it for the blue??? Ed says to do it, so what can I do but obey?

I'm going to the range in the morning before it gets hot and I'll shoot all three guns and maybe post a group or two.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Ernest, unless you want to hunt birds, bring the 8mm Mauser. The Eastern Cape was my first safari in 1999, and shots can be longish on Gemsbok, Kudu, and the like. The use of a shotgun for Duikers isn't needed, as they're full size Duikers as I remember, not tiny like Blues or Suni.

+2

Dang! The Drilling's rifle barrel is 9.3x74R. I can't type.

I just finished my second hunt in the Cape. Got at duiker at 65 yards, but other than that my shots have been from 175 to 420 yards. Nice rifles, but I wouldn't use any of them. I do all my hunting with handguns. Better use the 8x57.

I voted for the 8x57 Mauser. That will serve you well in case you get some longer shots which are quite common on the Eastern Cape. See if the outfitter can arrange to have a shotgun in camp that you could use if you wind up doing some bird hunting.

What Labman said.

Use the drilling, just because you can. A traditional type firearm with lots of potential when in the field.

Have fun and Waidmannsheil!

That's a pretty sexy looking 8x57 there but really prefer the Drilling Option; especially since I have a 20-20/9.3x74R Suhler; not much game large or small the 9.3x74R can't put a Whump on ..... won't tear up the small stuff and will put a big hurt on larger game.

I wouldn't get too awful concerned about the range constraints, just get closer.

Have fun with your choice and your hunt and of course some after-action photos would be a plus.

Waidmannsheil!

Drilling.

Cape Gun.

Bolt Gun.

That would be the order of my choices. The drilling and cape gun being a close choice but giving the edge to the 9.3x74R. Then would be single shots, then bows and arrows, sling shots, knives, a sharpened stick blackened in a Mopane fire, then in a distant last place, a bolt gun!

Don't even start Biebs!

Take the 8X57, & send me the Cape gun. Pretty easy decision, at least for me. It can sleep with the C&H .375, & if you ever want it back, I'll just not let you have it, just like the C&H.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Drilling.

Cape Gun.

Bolt Gun.

That would be the order of my choices. The drilling and cape gun being a close choice but giving the edge to the 9.3x74R. Then would be single shots, then bows and arrows, sling shots, knives, a sharpened stick blackened in a Mopane fire, then in a distant last place, a bolt gun!

Don't even start Biebs!

I voted for the Cape gun simply because you are going to the East Cape, and because I have a cape gun that is an exact clone of that one except it is chambered for 16Ga/8X57JR, and I've had very good experience with it in the cross canyon country of New Mexico and Colorado on Mule deer and Elk. The 7X57 in yours will shoot flat enough to do you proud on the Cape. If it were a 9.3X74R it would be even better.

I don't think of a drilling as classic in Africa at all, and the Cape gun was designed for the settlers on the Cape!

Ernest,

That's a great drilling, and I vote for it. I have a similar one in 12x12x8/57JR in a JP Sauer Sidelock. Probably the best drillings ever made. Use it, and use it proud. Good luck on that hunt.

My head says 8x57...logically that's the best of them and what I'd take.

On the other hand I'd LOVE to see a drilling on safari!

That Drilling is a beauty as are the rest, but would like to read your hunt report with the Drilling as the star. LOL.

Ernest, the drilling hands down, been there done that. I used my 16X16/9.3-72R in the cape. The fact yours is 74 makes a great difference. I was mainly hunting the little guys and didn't worry so much on the rifle part. I used 16 ga buck and it worked great. Blue Duiker and Cape Grysbok. I have used the 74R on Zebra and it worked great. I am planning on taking my 16X16/9.3-74R this fall to Ethopia for Dik-Dik and Lesser Kudu and other like size game.

Without a doubt, the 8mm. I was never a fan of combination guns, I view them as half-assed attempts at trying to do everything yet accomplishing little and from my point of view (and wallet) why go to Africa to shoot birds? Nope, the 8mm is my choice!

quote:

Originally posted by JudgeG:
I'm going to the Eastern Cape for the first time in mid-September and I'm really having fun getting ready.

The next candidate is a military Oberndorf model '98 in 8x57 with a traditional German stock and another Carl Zeiss 1.5x to 4.5x scope. It is a .5" rifle and the action is slick as glass. It holds 5 down and even with the slightly heavier than usual barrel (a PacNor with express sights) it is balanced perfectly and a joy to carry....... but I'll feel a bit more confident with it on any 200+ yard shots.

....

theres your answer. Kudu at 200+ yards. this rules out the other 2. Practice out to 250-300yds. The EC is wide open and the hills where the Kudu sometimes hide requires fetching distance.

AS FOR THE BUSHPIGS . . .



. . . THAT SHOULD BE A CLOSE SHOT
(trailcam date should read 2013)

looking forward to those cold beers

quote:

Originally posted by Labman:
I voted for the 8x57 Mauser. That will serve you well in case you get some longer shots which are quite common on the Eastern Cape. See if the outfitter can arrange to have a shotgun in camp that you could use if you wind up doing some bird hunting.

+1

Ernest are you going to hunt or practice long range shooting? Work to get the 100 yd shot and your drilling will do everything you can ask.

I'm going to the range in a bit. I'll post a target or three when I get back.

Ain't anticipation of a safari almost as good as the "doing"?

All beautiful rifles--tough choice. I vote for the drilling simply for tradition. If you need a safe place for the sweet 8 x 57....just saying

You have that 8x57 in your safe for hunts like the EC.
My kids found this 303 round in the dirt in the Karoo




I'm sure the 303 and the 8x57 have stacked up quite a few animals over the years as well.

Three shots with the 7x57R barrel of the Cape gun! I ought to take it to a bench rest meet.

It actually shot better than the 8x57 Mauser (3 shots from it are covered by the black dots, btw. I moved the zero over a few clicks and up some and, on another target, it shot almost as well using Hornady Vintage ammo for the first time).

I either will do 200 yards, no problem.... and, since I'm going to the Cape, I'm leaning toward the Cape gun, but y'all make good suggestions.... and I could take a stainless Model 70 in .300 Win Mag, but where's the fun in that?

Didn't shoot the drilling yet, but will try to do so in the morning. Boy if it shoots as well, maybe I'll have to book three hunts, one for each gun?

JudgeG,
I would take the cape gun, easy decision.

quote:

Ain't anticipation of a safari almost as good as the "doing"?

Hell, anticipation is half the trip.

I'm anticipating for you on this trip; not (sadly) with you ..... spent my wad last year in Namibia; gotta save some scratch & be patient 'til my next turn rolls around; meanwhile live the urge and have a really good Safari.



PS ..... take the Drilling ......

Practically speaking I'd take the 8x57.

Emotionally speaking I'd take the Cape Gun.

I don't think you are going purely for the trophy aspect, but to have a fun safari. That spells Cape Gun.

Hi SBT above took the words right out of my mouth.I voted for the cape gun and stand by that.
Have a great time. Bill

quote:

Originally posted by SBT:
Practically speaking I'd take the 8x57.

Emotionally speaking I'd take the Cape Gun.

I don't think you are going purely for the trophy aspect, but to have a fun safari. That spells Cape Gun.

bring them both Judge, but in the end the Karoo will be the "Judge"
The important thing is that you have a plain and simple Bloody good time.

I wouldn't want to shoot a Kudu sized animal with an SST bullet. They tend to fly apart pretty badly in my experience. That would let that rifle out for me, otherwise, it would be a pretty cool option. I voted bolt gun. I imagine they will loan you a shotgun for the occasional bird...

quote:

Originally posted by leopards valley safaris:

quote:

Originally posted by SBT:
Practically speaking I'd take the 8x57.

Emotionally speaking I'd take the Cape Gun.

I don't think you are going purely for the trophy aspect, but to have a fun safari. That spells Cape Gun.

bring them both Judge, but in the end the Karoo will be the "Judge"
The important thing is that you have a plain and simple Bloody good time.

Having a good time is the whole purpose of this safari, and that alone should decide the proper tool for the most satisfaction at the end of the safari.

Practically, there is no difference in the capability of any of the scoped firearms in this choice. any one of them is capable of long range shooting on animals the cartridges are designed to be used for. The drilling and he cape gun are simply single shots where scoped rifle barrel is concerned. I have taken Mule deer at well over 200 yds with the rifle barrel on my 16ga/8x57JR cape gun with iron sights. and Brenneke slugs print right beside the rifle at 100 yds as well.

Your Cape gun, with an illuminated scope would be one of the best Leopard gun one could ask for!

........................................................................

First: all rifles are exceptionally nice. And fitted with appropriate scopes. 2nd: I would take the 8x57. But why not take two guns especially as one will be detachable and I guess you could screw down the Mauser too.

This is what I call a good problem to have! Great guns and a good hunting trip planned.

JudgeG

As you know I am a big fan of Drillings and Combo guns.

So here are some randon thoughts.

If you really want to shoot some birds, then the rifle is OUT...

The Cape Gun and the Drilling both have ONE rifle barrel.
So they are equal in that regard.

The Drilling has the advantage of having two shotgun barrels, making it better for birds.
Also 12 ga barrels are much easier to get than 116ga.

The Cape Gun is probably a little lighter.

So I would base my choice on which rifle barrel shot the best, at the distance I would be shooting the 4 footed game, balanced on how much bird shooting I would be doing...

However usinng a "Cape Gun" while huntoing on the "Cape" does have a certain nostalgic appeal.

And I will have to ask, why cannot you take two gguns???

If I could only take one, I would take the Drilling.
A 12x12x9,3x74R is a hard gun to beat.

After very careful examination of all your choices I believe you should buy a NEW gun. You should buy a Merkel SxS in 8x57R with a set of 20ga barrels. Scope the rifle set and go shoot some birds (what birds are found there in quantity?) and enjoy yourself and you get a new gun in the bargain. If the Merkel is too much money get a Valmet. That's what I did. A Valmet in 9.3x74r with a set of 12ga barrels. Shot lots of Guinea Fowl and other birds along with a Kudu and other animals. If you are absolutely forced to use what you have use the 9.3x74R,it would be better on birds. Whatever you use ,enjoy using it and know lots of us will be envying your opportunity.

quote:

After very careful examination of all your choices I believe you should buy a NEW gun. You should buy a Merkel SxS in 8x57R with a set of 20ga barrels. Scope the rifle set and go shoot some birds (what birds are found there in quantity?) and enjoy yourself and you get a new gun in the bargain. If the Merkel is too much money get a Valmet. That's what I did. A Valmet in 9.3x74r with a set of 12ga barrels. Shot lots of Guinea Fowl and other birds along with a Kudu and other animals. If you are absolutely forced to use what you have use the 9.3x74R,it would be better on birds. Whatever you use ,enjoy using it and know lots of us will be envying your opportunity.

Zim, you are my hero... a man always needs an excuse to buy another gun!

Ernest, why not take two? Easy enough to import into the RSA... bolt rifle and drilling.

you know which is the most practical, or you wouldn't have asked the question. But which would be the most fun? And that is the answer.

Can you take two?