Some Of Our Cheetahs, More Photos Have Been Added

12 April 2017, 21:29

12 April 2017, 21:40

Crazyhorseconsulting

Great pictures, beautiful creatures. You are very fortunate to be able to have such special animals.

12 April 2017, 23:07

butchloc

a thousand thanks for the pictures. truly on of the worlds most beautiful and unique animals.. closer to the canine family than felix as i understand it the dna can be traced to one original pair

13 April 2017, 00:13

WLW

Great pictures! Please excuse my ignorance. Being a feline, I would have thought those claws would have been sharper. Their feet almost look canine and claws non retractable.

Still beautiful.

Will

13 April 2017, 03:34

crbutler

Saeed,

Some of the old stories tell of cheetah being used as hunting animals, along the lines of hounds (or maybe falcons is a better simile) at least in Pakistan and India.

Have you used any of yours or tried to train them at all?

13 April 2017, 04:17

Brandon.Gleason

Excellent photos, Saeed! If my memory serves me correctly, you've quite a few other animals on your property??

13 April 2017, 15:29

Saeed

They are eating quale and chopped up lamb.

They are extremely playful, and love to climb all over me and Hessa.

They also love to just relax, as you can see in these photos.

13 April 2017, 20:48

Crazyhorseconsulting

quote:
Being a feline, I would have thought those claws would have been sharper. Their feet almost look canine and claws non retractable.

From everything I have learned about Cheetahs over the years, there is an evolutional linkage between Cheetahs and canines, and their claws are like a canine and are non-retractable.

Cheetahs actually evolved in North America along with an animal called a Long Legged Hyena, supposedly that is why Pronghorns, which are not really an Antelope evolved being able to run at the speeds they do.

Like the horse and camel, the cheetah left North America and crossed into Asia, the Hyena that was here simply died out.

As for the question concerning the use of Cheetahs as coursing animals by the nobility, yes. Had the animals been available to the commoners/peasants it is possible that cheetahs might have became domesticated. For the comment concerning all cheetahs coming from one pair, the last time I checked into it, all cheetahs alive today can be traced genetically back to one female. I do not actually subscribe to that, but anything is possible.

14 April 2017, 02:55

analog_peninsula

Whoever said that cheetahs never prosper was clearly incorrect. Great cat pictures!

14 April 2017, 03:51

WLW

quote:
Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
quote:
Being a feline, I would have thought those claws would have been sharper. Their feet almost look canine and claws non retractable.

From everything I have learned about Cheetahs over the years, there is an evolutional linkage between Cheetahs and canines, and their claws are like a canine and are non-retractable.

Whew. I guess I'm not a dumb as I thought.

14 April 2017, 04:06

Crazyhorseconsulting

Not dumb in any way. Cheetahs are really interesting animals and in many ways I wish that they had been domesticated.

14 April 2017, 04:52

AXEL19

quote:
Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
For the comment concerning all cheetahs coming from one pair, the last time I checked into it, all cheetahs alive today can be traced genetically back to one female. I do not actually subscribe to that, but anything is possible.

Can you expand on that?

14 April 2017, 06:19

Crazyhorseconsulting

It has been awhile since I was involved in zoo work and for a short period of time I did help take care of the Cheetahs at the zoo in Fort Worth Texas, so did a little research on the species. One bit of research suggested that all Cheetahs alive to day are related to a single female. I have a hard time buying into that, but I try to maintain an open mind when it comes to evolution.

I do know that many folks working with Cheetahs were or are concerned with the lack of genetic diversity within the species.

14 April 2017, 09:52

Cougarz

Very nice photos, thanks for posting!

20 April 2017, 12:46

Big Wonderful Wyoming

quote:
Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
quote:
Being a feline, I would have thought those claws would have been sharper. Their feet almost look canine and claws non retractable.

From everything I have learned about Cheetahs over the years, there is an evolutional linkage between Cheetahs and canines, and their claws are like a canine and are non-retractable.

Cheetahs actually evolved in North America along with an animal called a Long Legged Hyena, supposedly that is why Pronghorns, which are not really an Antelope evolved being able to run at the speeds they do.

Like the horse and camel, the cheetah left North America and crossed into Asia, the Hyena that was here simply died out.

As for the question concerning the use of Cheetahs as coursing animals by the nobility, yes. Had the animals been available to the commoners/peasants it is possible that cheetahs might have became domesticated. For the comment concerning all cheetahs coming from one pair, the last time I checked into it, all cheetahs alive today can be traced genetically back to one female. I do not actually subscribe to that, but anything is possible.

Where did you come up with this nonsense? Cheetahs are Felines, not hyenas nor are they canines. Cheetahs are only about as related to canines as canines normally are to any other cat.

The cheetah is the only extant species of the genus Acinonyx. It belongs to Felinae, the subfamily of Felidae that also includes lynxes, wildcats, and the puma. The species was first described by German naturalist Johann Christian Daniel von Schreber in his 1775 publication Die Säugethiere in Abbildungen nach der Natur mit Beschreibungen.[7]

The cheetah's closest relatives are the cougar (Puma concolor) and the jaguarundi (P. yagouaroundi). These three species together form the Puma lineage, one of the eight lineages of Felidae.[11][13][14] The sister group of the Puma lineage is a clade of smaller Old World cats that includes the genera Felis, Otocolobus and Prionailurus.[12][15]

Although the cheetah is an African cat, molecular evidence indicates that the three species of the Puma lineage evolved in North America two to three million years ago, where they possibly had a common ancestor during the Miocene.[16] They possibly diverged from this ancestor 8.25 million years ago.[13] The cheetah diverged from the puma and the jaguarundi around 6.7 million years ago.[17] A genome study concluded that cheetahs experienced two genetic bottlenecks in their history, the first about 100,000 years ago and the second about 12,000 years ago, greatly lowering their genetic variability. These bottlenecks may have been associated with migrations across Asia and into Africa (with the current African population founded about 12,000 years ago), and/or with a depletion of prey species at the end of the Pleistocene.[18]

Cheetah fossils found in the lower beds of the Olduvai Gorge site in northern Tanzania date back to the Pleistocene.[19] The extinct species of Acinonyx are older than the cheetah, with the oldest known from the late Pliocene; these fossils are about three million years old.[2] These species include Acinonyx pardinensis (Pliocene epoch), notably larger than the modern cheetah, and A. intermedius (mid-Pleistocene period).[20] While the range of A. intermedius stretched from Europe to China, A pardinensis spanned over Eurasia as well as eastern and southern Africa.[2] A variety of larger cheetah believed to have existed in Europe fell to extinction around half a million years ago.[6]

Extinct North American cats resembling the cheetah had historically been assigned to Felis, Puma or Acinonyx. However, a phylogenetic analysis in 1990 placed these species under the genus Miracinonyx.[21] Miracinonyx exhibited a high degree of similarity with the cheetah. However, in 1998, a DNA analysis showed that Miracinonyx inexpectatus, M. studeri, and M. trumani (early to late Pleistocene epoch), found in North America,[20] are not true cheetahs; in fact, they are close relatives of the cougar.

20 April 2017, 12:49

Big Wonderful Wyoming

Science is not a strong point for you is it?

21 April 2017, 06:08

Crazyhorseconsulting

It will do no one any good what so ever to get into a pissing match with you.

I worked at a major zoo for 25 years, around individuals that know more about Cheetahs than you ever will.

Go ahead and make a fool of yourself, I do not care.

21 April 2017, 09:01

Michael Robinson

I will only say six things:

1. Fabulous photographs, Saeed.
2. I want a cheetah. Not as a hunting trophy.
3. Pronghorn antelopes, a/k/a speed goats, are the second fastest mammals on earth, behind the fastest by a wide margin.
4. Cheetahs are the fastest.
5. Africa and North America are separated by vast oceans.
6. I still want a cheetah.

21 April 2017, 09:40

Steve416

Awesome Saeed.
They are obviously happy and thriving.

21 April 2017, 10:42

Big Wonderful Wyoming

quote:
Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
It will do no one any good what so ever to get into a pissing match with you.

I worked at a major zoo for 25 years, around individuals that know more about Cheetahs than you ever will.

Go ahead and make a fool of yourself, I do not care.

Shoveling cheetah poop and doing 5 seconds worth of research are unrelated. I googled cheetah origins, and found none of the nonsense you claimed.

I am a wildlife biologist by education, and a grad student. I can do research.

As far as the distance between Casper, Wyoming and Windhoek is concerned. The Bering sea has been a big chunk of land several times over the past 300,000 years.

21 April 2017, 18:03

Crazyhorseconsulting

quote:
3. Pronghorn antelopes, a/k/a speed goats, are the second fastest mammals on earth, behind the cheetah.

Yes, that is true, BUT, cheetahs can only run at those speeds for a relatively short distance in comparison to a pronghorn.

As for my comment:

quote:
From everything I have learned about Cheetahs over the years, there is an evolutional linkage between Cheetahs and canines, and their claws are like a canine and are non-retractable.

Cheetahs are more canine like than any other feline and some researchers have theorized/claimed that there may have been or was a more canine like ancestor or possibly a common ancestor that died out, while the early form of cheetahs continued to evolve/adapt.

I do not believe ANYONE can deny that cheetahs are more canine like than cat like.

21 April 2017, 18:52

Fury01

quote:
theorized/claimed

The most used phrase in the Science of Evolution.

Love the pictures so thanks Saeed. Cheetahs are indeed a masterpiece of design, pleasing to their Creator in every way. "It is good."
Hope your day is great,
Fury01

21 April 2017, 19:24

Big Wonderful Wyoming

quote:
Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
quote:
3. Pronghorn antelopes, a/k/a speed goats, are the second fastest mammals on earth, behind the cheetah.

Yes, that is true, BUT, cheetahs can only run at those speeds for a relatively short distance in comparison to a pronghorn.

As for my comment:
quote:
From everything I have learned about Cheetahs over the years, there is an evolutional linkage between Cheetahs and canines, and their claws are like a canine and are non-retractable.

Cheetahs are more canine like than any other feline and some researchers have theorized/claimed that there may have been or was a more canine like ancestor or possibly a common ancestor that died out, while the early form of cheetahs continued to evolve/adapt.

I do not believe ANYONE can deny that cheetahs are more canine like than cat like.

What zoological park did you work at? Let's call the zoologist there and ask them? I know a couple of paleontologist that work at Universities, some of them have written textbooks.

Or maybe Dr. Geist from the University of Alberta.

You have been attacking people with your own brand of nonsense logic on this site, and tons of them have proven you wrong. It seems since ISS left you have taken the lead job as self proclaimed village cheetah poop scooper to new lows. You get pissy and site God the almighty as your reference.

Just don't pull a Rich and start sending threatening emails.

21 April 2017, 19:32

Crazyhorseconsulting

I worked at the Fort Worth Zoo for 24 years and 6 months, from 6 - May - 1982 until I retired at the end of June - 2006.

Sad to see that the Accurate Reloading Forums, across the board are succumbing to the same disease and attitude that is prevalent in the Political Forum area.

Funny, I do not remember seeing a notice from Saeed or Don that only individuals with Membership Approval could respond or comment on an open topic.

21 April 2017, 20:01

Bill/Oregon

Saeed, thank you so much for the photos of your beautiful cats.

21 April 2017, 23:11

Big Wonderful Wyoming

Yes even the Catholic Church has made the same statement.

21 April 2017, 23:20

Big Wonderful Wyoming

So 24 years of working in a zoo, and you didn't learn to tell the difference between a cat and dog?

I have been here since Saeed scooped us all out of the primordial ooze. The 2000 update killed me off, I got tired of Ritch's poison and left for a few years, but eventually I missed it.

Others have done the same.

22 April 2017, 01:24

ALF

Saeed: Great pics and awesome that you are caring for these wonderful cats.

Big Wonderful Wyoming is correct regarding the cheetah and though they exhibit some canid like behaviours and some canid like anatomical features ( partially at least ) such as semi retractable nails and thus a dog like foot print they are in fact cats and sadly cats who suffer from a genetic bottle neck in their evolutionary development making them a very vulnerable species.

22 April 2017, 04:33

Crazyhorseconsulting

BWW, I merely stated that they are more dog like than cat like, I do not think anyone disputes that!

I did not claim at ANY point that Cheetahs WERE NOT FELINES!

I have actually worked with them, HAVE YOU???????

Just answer that.

22 April 2017, 05:36

ALF

Worked with Cheetahs ? no did not they would not cooperate as they were wild !

Actually we owned some and in the early years we viewed them as pests and actually shot them on sight ! same with wild dogs.... I have pictures taken in the 70's with Cape Hunting dogs and cheetahs that I shot ! then things changed and our behaviour towards them changed.

An old Varsity friend of mine became a wildlife vet and for many years worked as the vet at the Kapama Cheetah breeding centre at Hoedspruit and the owners of the centre are friends of may parents ( both my father and the owners husband have passed on) but my mom still sees and visits the lady who owns the breeding centre.

I am actually going past there next week

22 April 2017, 07:05

Crazyhorseconsulting

Cheetahs are special, we could go in their enclosure and clean and they never bothered us. They were not as calm as those Saeed has, but they do not have the same disposition as most of the other felines.

22 April 2017, 11:21

Big Wonderful Wyoming

Circle of cheetah poop from Crazyhorse.

1. Claim nonsense about cheetahs having an evolutionary basis with a hyena and not with cats.

2. When questioned by BWW, claim that Crazyhorse has friends who know more than BWW about cheetahs, and that he has 24 years of working with cheetahs.

3. This is your exact original quote "From everything I have learned about Cheetahs over the years, there is an evolutional linkage between Cheetahs and canines, and their claws are like a canine and are non-retractable.

Cheetahs actually evolved in North America along with an animal called a Long Legged Hyena, supposedly that is why Pronghorns, which are not really an Antelope evolved being able to run at the speeds they do."

So yes you did claim that they evolved from a non-feline ancestor. Versus what is considered scientific, in that they are in the same family lineage as Mt Lions, and their ancestor was some type of cat that probably started in North America pre-ice age.

In your case experience and scientific knowledge are not the same. I have thousands of hours launching aircraft off the point end of an aircraft carrier, that doesn't mean I know anything about the nuclear reactor that powers said aircraft carrier.

22 April 2017, 15:57

Bushchook

Nice photos of a beautiful animal that has always captivated my attention.
We were told to shoot on sight in Africa recently. Glad I didn't see one.

22 April 2017, 18:58

Crazyhorseconsulting

Once again Saeed Thank You for sharing the pictures with us.

My apologies for the unnecessary dialog that took place.

22 April 2017, 19:45

drdlongshot