I've heard a lot about them over the years and was introduced to one a few weeks ago in South Africa. In camp the sight on the rifle seemed wonderful: point while looking through the glass and where the red dot is that is where the bullet will go.

But not so fast.

Out in the field a gent missed a wildebeest at 150 yards. Three times! Why? I looked through the red dot sight on a wildebeest that was ranged at 180 yards. The damn red dot was larger than the critter's shoulder at that distance. No wonder he missed. The dot covered the animal so accurate bullet placement could not be done.

Why are these things so popular? I see them only for quick shooting at very close distances on larger game. What am I missing???

I guess it depends on the size of the dot.

I’d like to try one on my double 375 Flanged Mag, if I can find a base to fit a 11mm dovetail.

Something like a 2.5 to 3 MOA dot should work?

quote:

Why are these things so popular? I see them only for quick shooting at very close distances on larger game. What am I missing???

Hi Cal,

These contraptions are quite versatile at close ranges only and come with a choice of 4 different reticle options.

My preferred choice is the very fine cross hair that offers better precision than the dot which tends to cover the target .... especially at 150yds.

I have been using a Hakko Panorama MK 3 on my 500 for a number of years and swear by it for close-range shots; anywhere over 70yds is potluck and not recommended.

Red dots are for short range pistol shooting.

We use them here quite a lot.

Many people prefer them to open sights.

But, on a rifle??

At 180 yards?

No.

Agree with above comments. For short range out to 100 yd. JJ put a Micro Aimpoint on my .45-70 and Doktor on my .577 NE. My eyes are getting old and they both improved my accuracy out to 100 yd over open sights. Out to 300 yd I use Leopold B&C scopes for speed (Gibbs .505, Lott .458) and then beyond that NFS to 1200 yd and beyond that Schmidt and Bender 12-50 to 2650 yd.

My Trijicon RMR on my .500NE was a game-changer for me. It is real good from 50 nearer but I can shoot accurately to 100 yds.

Anything beyond that, unless an emergency hail Mary on wounded game, I will be shooting a scoped (bolt-action in my case) rifle.

There are 6MOA down to 1MOA dots however.

The trick is to sight them in right.

Even in the pistol games, the dot can obscure the target with a smaller target or at range.

The idea is you set it up and sight it in so that at your arbitrary sight in distance the point of impact is on the upper edge of the dot. So for close and fast work you just put the dot where you want it to go. For precision you aim with the top edge or point depending on your reticle.

I agree it’s not as precise as a regular scope or match irons, but it’s every bit as good as notch and blade iron sights in my experience.

It just does require you to sight in carefully, and check zero with a new shooter or any changes.

I find that when you get the dot small enough for accurate shooting, it becomes much more difficult to find against hunting backgrounds.

I suggest it depends what you mean by "red dot" and assume we talking of holographic sights?

My Swaro Z6i has a "red dot" which is bright enough on the highest setting to be absolutely brilliant on driven board at X2.5, but can be switched off and turned up to X15 if you are looking at something beyond far. It does work very well and is ultimately a much more versatile (but MUCH more expensive) tool than a holographic sight.

Having said that I'm sufficiently old fashioned to think that putting a variable scope on a very heavy rifle is ultimately not going to turn out well - though of course you do get such scopes in pretty compact dimension for just such a purpose.

I regularly shoot my RMR on a .223 bolt rifle out to 200 yards from a rest. Keeping bullets into three inches is very easy and regularly done by myself and a friend. There are many good uses for RMRs and Red Dots

The Trijicon RMRs that I have for two of my double rifles (375 Flanged and 450-400) are the 3.25 MOA. That size of red dot is small enough for any shot out to under 200 yards. That is the key-get the smallest red dot, sight it in and use it. Both of those double rifles are Searcys and Butch set them up with the quarter rib that allows the use of the iron sights, a scope or an RMR. Easy to put the scope or the RMR on and take them off quickly.

I put a Docter Optic 2 MOA on my VC 500 NE for my last Buff hunt in SA. My eyes are still good but barely, so I decided to give it a go. Definitely helps with longer shots and regulation. However, when I actually got in the bush and started tracking these beasts, I realized the shot would be close and quick. I took it off at the last minute and went au-natural. Glad I did. Damn bull came out of the Mopane thicket like a freight train and instinct took over. I don't even remember aiming, but there were 2 holes in the vitals and he was done after 60 yards.

As stated above Cal, it depends on the size of the dot. I just had JJ put Trijicon RMRs on both of my doubles. I finally had to give up the irons as my eyes aren't what they used to be. I can still shoot irons, but barely. The red dots are great.

I had the Trijicon 1.25 to 4 scope with post and red triangle on my 9.3 and was able to shoot both barrels past 250 yards easily. The new red dot on that same rifle is smaller than that triangle.

quote:

Originally posted by clayman216:
I regularly shoot my RMR on a .223 bolt rifle out to 200 yards from a rest. Keeping bullets into three inches is very easy and regularly done by myself and a friend. There are many good uses for RMRs and Red Dots

Agreed, far more hits than misses at 100 yards on a beer can with a 3 MOA RMR on my wife’s Ruger 10/22. But as always to hit you have to squeeze the trigger.

I recently installed a Holosun HE507C-GR on my 577NE, for my old eyes. I like it. Has fine dot. Have not used it yet. Brian

I have used my rmr on my .500 NE in the bush and not found it lacking in any regard — in fact I would never use anything else. Have killed 2 ele with single brain-shots with it as well. For me and my eyes — it is a good tool.

For ranges out to ca. 100m they are excellent..

I have also used a RMR on a 458 Lott for elephant and for Cape Buffalo . Outstanding and quick aiming device adding no weight to speak of. All good in my opinion.

How do you use traditional crosshairs ?

By placing the intersecting crosshairs, ie,lines, on your target.

And what do you call the intersection of two lines?

A point, aka, a dot.

So, a red dot is fundamentally no different than traditional crosshairs, except in your mind.

I can easily hit a target at 200 yards with a 2 moa aim point or better yet a 1 moa dot with 65 moa circle eotech with 5.56 carbines. And 300 with some holdover. So yeah no issue on my big bores. Got a 3 moa delta point on the 505 and going to put a 3.25 moa RMR on my 500 double. Red dots are where it’s at for fast accurate shooting ask any competitive shooter….

Also the reason I have multiple swaro 1-6 ee z6i just like a red dot only better…..

A few years ago I nailed a moving groundhog behind the shoulder at a bit over 100 yards using an Aimpoint H1 with a 2 MOA dot. A Wildebeest at 150 would be EZ, tho probably too much critter to shoot with an AR15.

Small dots can be dialed up brighter to appear bigger, then turned down for a bit more precision. Like any new gear there is a learning curve and you need to research your purchase instead of buying the biggest.

I mounted one of the original OCG Single Point sights on my Mauser 404 after I had used it with open sights on buffalo, The green dot (green better than red for poor light conditions) subtended 16 moa but for fast close range target acquisition on bigger animals it was fine. These old sights used natural light and required both eyes to be open. One eye saw a green or red dot on a black background through the 'scope' and the other the target and surroundings, the brain bringing the landscape, target and dot together. Good for running shots as the whole landscape is seen.

I used it on a few deer and feral goats but never got back onto buffalo to try this sight out.

I liked the Single Point as it looked like a small ordinary 1" tube scope, with a rounded clear bubble at the objective end containing a green/red prism that collected the light and produced the dot. The POI adjustment was effected with very low adjusters covered with rubber cups.

I don't like the aesthetics of the modern crop of red dot sights, the scope like ones seem to be cluttered with large adjustment knobs, battery covers and accessory rails while the holographic/reflex types just look odd sticking up in mid-air, waiting to be broken in the event of a fall or snagged up in scrub if bush shooting.

I ultimately put a Leupold EER scope into the same rings as although the dot worked to a fashion when target shooting you had to take the shot quick otherwise your eyes, or maybe your brain, lost focus and the dot wandered off or disappeared completely.
It was an interesting experiment and far better than open sights when up close and personal, as personal as culling mobs of goats in the bush gets
I'm sure this sight would have acquitted itself well on the style of buffalo shooting I did, up close in long grass and scrub and in among mobs.

Years ago while hunting the BVC in Zimbabwe, I had a PH, Ade Langley, who had a .416 Remington bolt action rifle. He was having a hard time using it due to his eyesight. I gave him a brand new RMR and base as part of his tip, that I had used once (just for that safari) on my 450-400 double rifle. He later had it mounted to his rifle. When I saw Ade again a couple of years later while hunting the BVC with PH Shaun Buffee, Ade told me that the RMR had made all of the difference and he was able to hunt effectively with that rifle again. Ade is now camp manager and a PH in Uganda, running Karamojong-Overland Safaris. Just read an article in Sports Afield about him and Prince Albrecht Oettingen-Spielberg's efforts at restoring game in the Pian Upe Game Reserve. Great article!

While this may not be strictly on point, it may be something to consider if any of you are oddballs like me. I'm cross eye dominant. with a pistol, but not a rifle. My friends can't understand why I shoot pistol left handed but rifle right handed. I also am a CCW (out here in CA no less), and the basic NRA rule is to keep it simple.

You don't run around with different type of pistols (I do for competition -- which I still do a lot of at 72) with different means of engaging the safety, different trigger pull weights, different sights.

The eye adjusts differently moving from iron sights to a red dot. And if you are cross eye dominant, that little bit of difference requires a forced realignment off the axis angle of your head when you are picking up the sights to engage your first target. A lot of it has to do with your stance, which many hunters never learn. The position of your feet, especially the relationship in front of or behind an imaginary line drawn between your heels will determine how well you engage your sights as the rifle rises to your shoulder.

While this is much more easily accomplished with a rifle, it is a completely different skill moving from iron to dot, should require some instruction and a ton of practice to see if it works for you.

You can't just slap a dot on your rifle and off you go. That could prove very dangerous, or at least very distracting. Also, you want to make sure you purchase one of the new 'shake awake' technologies so you are not looking for the 'on' button in the field.

It is a lot to consider. I'll be happy to help anyone who needs more info.

I shot an ostrich at 140 yards with my 470 using the doctor red dot. I think mine is 3.0 MOA

I had never used a red dot until this past April when I put one on my 500. Perfect for a double, especially with presbyopia. Target acquisition is fast. As long as you're not doing something stupid they're fine. A lot depends upon the size of the game to increase your point blank range.

Kudu at 90y was fine. Impala at 90y, bushbuck at 110y was about the limit for me.