quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
The MSR is completely out of reach for 99% of us here. My version is, at less than $3500.
Rich

quote:

Originally posted by scottfromdallas:
I think a $16,000 multi-caliber sniper rifles is a complete wast of our money. Freaking just decided on a standard sniper caliber already. How about using the one in the middle (300 Win Mag)?

Sorry,just annoying how much the military wastes on this crap. The 300 will do everything the 308 does and then some and it will keep pace with the Lapua on human targets with todays long range bullets. Bring the 50 cal if you need more.

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
It is not my problem that you lack the common sense to do any research on your own.

It is also not my problem if you weren't knowledgeable enough in the late 1980's to subscribe to PS like I did, and then ask questions. For nearly eleven years my name was on the masthead as a staff writer. Dave Brennan played the consummate Shanty Irishman as editor. I played him once by naming a wildcat the 257 Banshee. I'd guess you can check that with JGS, since they made the reamers. Brennan got me back, when he posted my name under the heading "Obscurata & Mythology". A veiled reference to the Banshee.

I had the privilege of writing about anything that interested me there. I went out, did things, and sent a report, including pictures, back to PS. They usually printed it, and sent me money.

I wrote on lots of subjects over the years. The Banshee project got me to the Tacoma area, where an old gunsmith named Manley Oakley found me an early Unlimited era fiberglass stock, and an 11 1/2" aluminum sleeve to build it on. After a pleasant afternoon visiting with he and his wife I asked him if there was anything worth doing that weekend. It turns out that there was a Coors Regional Schuetzenfest at the Tacoma R&P club. My wife and I drove over to see the show. Someone there figured out who I was, and I was coerced into shooting their Media/celebrity Match. I shot a record score of 247-7X. You can check that, I think it still stands.

Coors invited me to the Nationals that summer in Golden, Colorado. I finished 4th there. I also got to spend the best part of two afternoon meeting and becoming friends with Dean Miller and his son Cyle, along with their families. The 32-40 still owned Schuetzen back then. Dean and Cyle talked with me about their wildcat, the 32 Miller. It would shoot right alongside the 32-40, but "as accurate as..." doesn't get many people to switch over. Their case was a european cartridge, the 222 Rimmed version of the 222 Remington Magnum. It got necked up, much like a mini-32-40, measured 1.520" OAL, and was breech seated. That Spring Russ Hayden, Hayden's Shooters Supply and I went to the Super Shoot. I had done an article for PS on his leaving a cushy job at Boeing as a draftsman to start the business. We visited their house that early spring and Russ's wife had shared that Russ wanted to attend the SS, as a way of meeting his customers from across the country. I did not own a 6PPC, but the trip sounded like fun, and my parents live enroute, near St Louis. So, I volunteered to share the driving and watch his store while he was on the line. Ever been to the SS? Kelbly's Range has 60 covered benches, and they had seven relays that year.

Any way, I had the good fortune to visit again with Alan Hall. We had met up here and gone to the NRA Show together in Seattle the year before. That was the year Krieghoff introduced their DRs. Did I tell you, I had done an article on Rockchuck shooting with the original Trail Guns Armory double rifle in 45-70? Michael Powasnick was the inporter from the Houston area. They had two rear sights, one for each barrel. Anyway, I shot four, iirc, Rockchucks with 500gr RFN cast bullets from an old Lyman mold I had. Dieter Krieghoff and Co. had subscriptions and when I told them my name and that I was from PS, he laughed and said "Ach, der Rockchuck Shooter from Idaho...". I used to sign off my articles, just a rockchuck shooter from Idaho. So, anyway, Alan Hall was with me, and I introduced him to Dieter. They went off into an extended discussion about various bolt and single shot action designs. They ended up inviting me to dinner that evening. The next day they asked me if I would be interested in doing an article on their new double rifle line. OF COURSE!! So, Dieter Krieghoff asks me which one of the display rifles I preferred. Easy question, I want the .500 NE. So, he walks me down two booths to Zander and Sons who were the importers for Kynoch at the time. Bart and I had met earlier that morning, so he knew who I was. Dieter asks him if they had any ammunition, and Bart reaches behind him to the display and gives me, GIVES ME, 5 boxes of softs and five of solids. At that time the price tag was $132 for softs, and $156 for solids. $1440 for those of you who don't want to do the math. So, I took the rifle and ammunition home with me and shot it all up a 5-pack each on bullseye targets at 100yds, and the rest trying to kill Rockchucks. It worked. I hunted with it that fall, but that's another deal.
I could have bought it for $6300 that early winter. It was, waaaay too pretty for someone like me.

I drift, back to the SS. We are sitting in the reloading shed, while George Sr went over the ground rules, when the infamous Skip Otto of Grand Junction, CO asked me if I were shooting. I said "No, no BR rifle and no extra $$$ for entry fees...". Those of you who have ever met Skip, know what I am about to say; the rest of you, I cannot explain Skip. He had to be experienced firsthand.
Anyway, Skip stands up and tells everybody there who I am, and how it just does not seem right that I drive all the way over and not shoot. He takes his baseball cap off and walks around the floor, asking every competitor there to help sponsor me at the shoot. He would only take change or $1 dollar bills. It was the darndest thing. I say thank you, but figure I'll get off the hook with the "No BR rifle..." excuse.
Alan Hall, a man I thought was my friend volunteers the use of his Hall-built 6PPC HV rifle. Skip dumped out the hat, and George Jr counted it. Over $400. We paid my entry fees, and the rest went to the "take up a collection fund" for the scorers.

I was ready to run, but Dave tells me, "Rich, if you do not cross fire on someone else's target, you can't finish dead last. That proved to be true, at least one or two competitors each relay did. I am thinking I finished up 87th. All of my groups were in the .1 moa range at 100/200. I shot one 5-shot group that measured .09X" at 100. That was good for 16th place. The best target that relay was by Tony Boyer, a .043".

That is the deal on my one and only trip to the SS.

Oh, yeah, we were talking Schuetzen. So, the last day, we are talking about the SS trip, and the issue I saw with Schuetzen. 6PPC's operate at about 101% loading density. It makes for 2-5fps 5-shot spreads. The 32 Miller was about 9-10 fps. Loading density was about 40% with AA#9, aka H110. I suggested to Dean and Cyle that they shorten the case, an arbitrary 1/4 inch. It made sense to me, but Dean and Cyle were polite, but very skeptical. A set of JGS reamers by Keith Francis were about $350. A lot of money to lay out on some gunwriters whim. What made the deal, was that I had sent Dave a reamer print, a 6.5x68S case, and the fireformed Banshee round. He put it on the cover the next month. He even paid me an extra $50. JGS had recently been sold by Keith, to Jim Cuthbert, and I was smart enough to get PS to send a couple copies to them. Jim called me, and offered me a free set of reamers as a way of saying "thank you". So, the Millers and my wife and I are sitting at a picnic table at the Coors Range outside of Golden. I offer them the reamer credit if they want to take a chance. At the same time, I ordered a Schuetzen rifle on the amazing Miller-DeHaas single shot design. The next Spring, again, iirc, the weekend after Easter, we drive up to St Onge, South Dakota. It's about an hour west of Sturgis. We get in about dinner time, and Dean & Cherie ask us to stay at their other house. The next morning we go to their range.

Dean has mounted Cherie's 36X Unertl(sp?) on my rifle, made up 20 cases, and we start shooting. This is a 1.5" bullseye, which is also the 25-ring. 200yds. The first ten shots score a 248-8X. Up a half a grain, 247-7X.
The next two groups score 248-8X and a 249-9X. Every one is smiling. About that time Lowell Hamilton pulls up. The first thing he says after "hello" is "Where is that barn burner midget Rich dreamed up...?".

It turns out that Dean and Cyle took the completed rifle to the range the night before to test. It could have been a bust, if so they would have rechambered it to the standard 32 Miller. Five different people shot that rifle that morning with the same 10.5gr of AA#9, and all ten 10-shot groups, at 200yds, scoped off the bench were 248 or 249. No 23's. We return to town to celebrate, and Dean suggests we call it after me. Having at least a modicum of common sense, I decline. Since Dean was in the business, I proposed the name 32 Miller Short. By end of the next year, it owned Schuetzen, and still does today. Last I heard, every perfect 250-10X since 2000 was using a 32 MS.

I wrote a nine-part series that year on everything you needed to do, building a rifle, learning to cast good bullets, with one of Jerry Barnett's spitzer 215gr molds I cast nearly 300 32 caliber bullets one day that had a total spread of .2gr. It was called "On the Yellow Brick Road, to Golden, Colorado."

So Craig, in a roundabout fashion we are back to your comment. Are you disputing the validity of the Savage packages, or just jealous of me?

What I wrote here represents less than half my PS printed and paid for output over a two year spread.

You've kept me up past my bedtime, and the ComputerStop tech is coming around 9am to install a new computer.

Good night to all. For those of you who read PS in those days, some of this may ring a bell. For those who haven't, this is about ten-percent of what was published. Boyd Mace and I were the live varmint shooters during that era.

Good night,

Rich
still "Just a Rockchuck Shooter from Idaho."

quote:

Originally posted by Macs B:
Without checking your long division I would say your math is correct. Remember that those rifles may look like a M-700 but just like the Berreta M-94 and the M-9 they are not made on the same line or using the same contract specs. That dollar amount accounts for years of service, parts, consumables, you name it. Its not just a question of how many rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
Only $16,000 for a Sniper Rifle. Does not sound like too bad a deal to me....

I seem to remember something about a $10,000 coffee pot.