I have an AR that has been untouched for 3-4 years, but I am thinking of using it for some long range shooting.

It is an original Colt HBAR competition. I took it to a gunsmith today who works on these, and he said the HBARs are pretty good barrels.

I sort of decided on a new 2 stage trigger, replaceing the plastic collapsing stock with a competition adjustable stock, and replacing the AR hand guard.

The smith also said he should relieve the stress on the barrel..

So that said, does this sound like it will be a serviceable rig, or do you guys recommend getting a new match upper. The shop has a LaRue upper that is really slick (and expensive) but is it better to pony up for something like the LaRue, or give the HBAR barrel a try?

Thank you in advance...

There are so many things which can be done to an AR plaform that knowing your most intended uses for same will better enable a responder to give a concise answer.

The potential accuracy of the Colt will amaze you, and the freefloating of the barrel will help. The trigger will be a major part of the package regardless of your purposes. I myself prefer a Sierra precision grip as it fills the hand well and positions the trigger finger best.

308

Thanks for the reply

I will use it at the range, and try to get over to the 300 yd bench and plink away...

the one i had started pretty good, but went sour, i don't trust anything colt makes anymore.

Make sure to install the freefloat barrel. Use a rockriver trigger. Forget the issue sights. Try to mount an optic. On our rifle team we have 14 ARs. The worst accuracy of them all was the Colt until we put on a match barrel from rockriver.

quote:

Originally posted by butchloc:
the one i had started pretty good, but went sour, i don't trust anything colt makes anymore.

butchloc...I sure wouldn't base your theory on one Colt. If that was the case every gun brand in the world are junk. There's a bad one or more in every brand. I have a pre ban HBAR Colt. I also build many AR's in many different calibers. I can say my Colt is one of the best I have, meaning in being reliable, workmanship, etc.. With the right ammunition it will shoot some very small groups at 100 yards and this is basically a military configuration rifle with the Nato chamber. Much of Colt's parts in the early days was made by CMT (Continental Machine and Tool Company) and they still exist today and make good solid parts. There are only a few manufactures that make upper and lower receivers, it's not like all the AR companies on the map make their own parts.

404wJJeffery

I've had a Colt HBAR Competition for about 17 years. It still has the original 1-9" twist barrel and will still put 10 shots in 1" or less at 100 yards. The only thing I've done is replace the forend with a floating tube. The single stage factory trigger breaks very clean right at 3.5 lbs which is fine with me. Rember this; garbage in, garbage out. There is a lot of .223/5.56 ammo out there that is not capable obe less than 2 moa and some is a lot worse. Use quality ammo with quality bullets (or reloads) and you'll find the Colt will shoot quite well. I wouldn't worry about getting another "upper". Shoot the Colt and then when the barrel is shot out simply rebarrel the fine "upper" you already have.

Larry Gibson

Since when did the HBAR Competition have a collapsible stock as standard equipment. I have only seen them with an A2 stock. My HBAR will keep 5rds in an inch at 100yds. easily. I only replaced the original grip with a grip with an adjustable palm shelf. Works great.

quote:

Originally posted by Bob G:
Since when did the HBAR Competition have a collapsible stock as standard equipment. I have only seen them with an A2 stock.

Ditto!

When I switched from an M1-A to an AR 15 for High Power Competition, I shot a stock Colt HBar for a couple of years. The only thing I did was install a little thinner front sight.

It did have a good trigger out of the box.
The rifle shot real good, I shot several 199 and 200's at 200 yards sitting.

I would test it like it is first.

The above target was shot at 410 yards with a factory Colt barrel as seen below. Model CR 6724, the Accurized rifle version. 24" 1 in 9 twist. Load was 75 Hornady A-Max single seating length. The rifle has a Jewel trigger and Tubb Chrome Silicon springs and a carrier weight system. GG&G riser block and Leupold 16X-Mark4 in Leupold QRW 30mm rings. Round count is close to 4,000 as this was fired. 1/2 MOA is easy, and if I ever learn to hold for wind... better yet.

To turn an AR-15 into a tack driver..... (IMHO) I would recommend the following:

Re-barrel with a target quality barrel designed to shoot your preferred bullet.

Freefloat the barrel.

A nice trigger also helps...... but is not as important as the first two modifications above.

PS - The Colt HBAR barrel is not BAD...... it's just not the best.

Thanks guys

I did free float the barrel, but it turns out the two stage trigger I wanted could not be found by the gunsmith, as I have a 175 sized screws unique to Colt and he couldn't find any...bummer, I really wanted that trigger.

I will sight it in and shoot it a bit tomorrow if the weather holds, and report back.

Thank you to all posters

The large pins still have quality triggers available. Mine has the Jewell.

I've got a pre-ban HBAR 1- 7" twist that I picked up around 1990. I worked with it for some time years ago with heavier bullets and got it down to 2" or 3" groups at 100 yrs. I could outshoot it with my Rem. 511 22RF and LW Colt AR15 sporter in the same session so it wan't my shooting. Put it back in the safe and never fooled with it since.

Should I throw in the towel and buy a new barrel or is there something else worth trying first? I went to the 68 and 69 gr. bullets - they were the heaviest I could find at the time and tried a number of powders etc. I can usually get a gun to shoot resaonably well but this one left me baffled.

I have a pre ban HBAR from the early 80's and it certainly shoots under an inch at 100 yards easily. I've used it to hunt prairie dogs and had no problems hitting them at up to 400 yards. This is one Colt I'd never sell.

Colt some time in production switched to hammer forged barrels. Their barrels are not that bad. The thing is they have the NATO chamber which includes the long long throat. If you load your bullets out far, especially the heavier ones which you can use in the 1-7 twist, and single load it improves the accuracy.

Rock River Arms at one time made their National Match trigger for both large and small pin. I don't see them available for the Colt pins any longer. You may find one on the gun auctions thought.

Just FYI - Geissele makes some great 2 stage triggers for the large pin Colt. Three different variations. Brownells carries them.

quote:

Originally posted by tvfinak:
I worked with it for some time years ago with heavier bullets and got it down to 2" or 3" groups at 100 yrs.

Should I throw in the towel and buy a new barrel or is there something else worth trying first?

I'd make sure the gas key is tight first. Then try it without the muzzle brake. After that, I'd look for a new barrel. You should be able to get pretty good $$ for the original barrel from the high-speed/low-drag types.

I just came on this thread, but if I were you, I'd sell the HBAR and get a RR Predator for basically what you can get for the HBAR and you'll have what will almost certainly be a more accurate rifle. Depending on how lucky you get you might or might not need a new trigger.

Fired this past Saturday with 2 witnesses at 405 yards:

It's tough finding a good trigger for the Colt. Some companies make them, but not often enough for most people to get them.

If it is a 1/9 twist, you will be limited in your bullet choice which won't help your 600 scores.

You'd be better off selling it and buying a Rock River National Match model. It has everything you need to win the National Trophy.

quote:

Originally posted by 404WJJeffery:
is it better to pony up for something like the LaRue, or give the HBAR barrel a try?

Depends upon if you want to shoot Match Rifle or Service Rifle. You can shoot NRA Highpower with a Match Rifle, but not CMP Highpower. You can't earn a Distinguished Rifleman badge with a Match rifle.

If you go Match Rifle, you will need a flat top upper plus you will have to buy match sights like a set of Warners. Plan on spending about $500 for the rear sight and about $200 for the front.

If you want something more plug-n-play, Service Rifle is the way to go. Buy a RR National Match and you are good to go.

Today at 300 yards, this group same load different shooter, slight variable head wind. The high round caught a different condition.

[quote]Posted 11 December 2008 01:29 Hide Post
It's tough finding a good trigger for the Colt. Some companies make them, but not often enough for most people to get them. /quote]

Geissele and Jewell make good two stage triggers. I put Jewell's in my two Colt's and will not look back. One has a custom Accuracy Speaks varmit upper the other is a stock H-Bar competiton. The stock model shoots just under 1", the custom model a bit better.

ive got a match hbar that shoots 1/2 inch with hornady 60 grain vmax bullets and ww748

quote:

Originally posted by jkingrph:
[quote]Posted 11 December 2008 01:29 Hide Post
It's tough finding a good trigger for the Colt. Some companies make them, but not often enough for most people to get them. /quote]

Geissele and Jewell make good two stage triggers. I put Jewell's in my two Colt's and will not look back. One has a custom Accuracy Speaks varmit upper the other is a stock H-Bar competiton. The stock model shoots just under 1", the custom model a bit better.

I just put a Timney in an old SP-1 and like enough that I ordered another for my Elite HBAR. Not saying they're the best but they're damn good, easy to find and I could not out-shoot it, much less a Geissele.