This is the fourth year of the antler restrictions in Pennsylvania - much of the state is 3 pt/side for a legal buck, some of it is 4 pt/side.

The area I hunt in (McKean County) has never seemed to produce bucks with any significant antlers, though a few appear every now and then. I have been used to seeing quite a few spikes and smaller basket racks, but this year I saw 8 bucks in three days, with 5 of them legal branch antlered bucks.

I do believe that the antler restrictions are working, at least in this area. Any one else have an opinion?

PS - here's my archery buck - 7 pt. - 125 lb. field dressed - not the biggest buck in the world, but it's the biggest buck taken in 30 years at the camp that I'm a guest at every year. Mathews LX, Whisker biscuit rest, Carbon Express Arrows, Easton fletches, Rocket 85gr. Sidewinder broadheads, Scott rope release. Shot at 19 yards broadside - clean double-lung hit - ran about 90 yards.

I'll be hunting in PA for the first time this year, rifle , Pike. I'd be happy with a deer like ours. The comments I've heard are that the new rules seem to be helping.

Nice deer, but the antler restrictions you mention will result in a big increase in genetic spikes after a few years.

Eric-

Congrats! Nice buck!

I agree, the restrictions are helping. We see better bucks every year in the areas we hunt (NW PA). Not as many total deer, but that's OK. We had an artificially inflated herd for way too long.

The guys that just want to show up at work on Tuesday morning and say "Got my buck!" (even though it was a spike, forkhorn, etc first year antlered buck) aren't happy, but guys that actually want a little better animal are starting to see the results....

I think Don is right. This is the 7th year farms around me have had a voluntary 8 pt or better limit and last year we had a less than good year for big bucks. Maybe it averages out at some point, but so far it may not be what we expected. This year we have alot of forks and 6 pts and I've seen one hugh 11 pt this year, but not many other nice bucks. DNR is confused too. We've only shot does so far. It will be interesting to see what the rut brings out of the back woods.

I hunt mostly Huntingdon County and the antler restrictions are working well here too. Too bad we can't convince the rest of the guys that the new program is working. I get tire of hearing the complaining. BTW, that is a very nice buck, particularly from MkKean County. That area is not really known for big antlers. Nice to see what we can have if we only let them grow up.

Antler restrictions work great. There will always be a arguements that they do or don't.

Every one I know that follows antler restrictions closely has built better heards, better ratios, and much happier hunters.

There are some that say it goes backwards after several years but, that's not the case I've witnessed from many of the Throphy management clubs. It takes years to get it going succesfully and then there will be years of reward.

I've heard some people talk about the reverse effects of it but, their results were very skewed and did not include things such as nutrition due to rainfall and availability of good food sources which, has more of an effect than anything. The size of deer and numbers of quality deer goes up tremendously in the places that have pt restrictions from the results I've seen.

I do believe in the Cull Buck rules that some clubs go by that allow them to take one mature cull buck per season.

Reloader

Another big disagreement is the Spike and 4pt srguement that many states have. Many think you must shoot all small yearling bucks but, that's absolute Horse Puckey.

The Buck Erict killed could have very well been a spike his first year, then a six, and now a nice seven. Spikes can become nice bucks and Throphies by many standards. They may not be 150 inch deer but, around here a deer over 100" is a nice buck and I'm betin' many of them began as spikes and 4s .

I see too many 80pound spikes w/ little 2-3" spikes to think they need to be shot. Those are just babies heck, you can look at them and tell they are very immature. If you are going to shoot them you may as well shoot every button head you see too!

It also has alot to do w/ the area you hunt. In Texas alot of their 1.5 year olds are sporting nice little 8pt racks but, that is very rare in most parts of the country.

Reloader

As an example of applying one rule too strictly, British Columbia has a 6 pt restriction on elk.

After 12 years there are a growing number of "5 point forever" elk out there. Now that one is hard for a hunter to tell for sure how old the animal is, but it's usually easier on deer to tell if they are genetically limited.

I think there should be some sort of reward (special access hunt, extra ticket, etc.) for taking a three-year old spike (as an example)out of the herd.

Here in Ohio almost nobody shoots does, even where the herds are over-populated. You should be required to take a doe before a buck in those areas.

We were taking about going back to PA but when the restrictions went in we said the heck with it.

quote:

Originally posted by Savage99:
We were taking about going back to PA but when the restrictions went in we said the heck with it.

Don't worry Savage99, we won't miss ya.

Go on and keep killing your yearlings and be happy...

Cold Bore,

I know that one or two hunters will not be missed. My point is that if there are places to hunt that don't have such restrictive rules then thats the path of least resistance.

Not only the common sense of it for me but as a non resident in PA I face the fact that some residents may have doe tags as well which increases their chances many fold.

I am just making a observation. I know that some want to shoot deer with big antlers in lieu of getting anything at all. As for myself I am usually out to get a deer that I can eat. I really don't care much it has large antlers, small antlers or no antlers.

Here in my home state of CT we can take two deer each with a bow, firearm or muzzleloader. That's six deer but on each of those methods or guns as you will it's only one buck (no AR) or two does.

I always liked PA. Lots of deer, nice land and good people.

More older deer are taken with the point restrictions but there is no factual info that a spike last year won't be a spike this year.Now that you can shoot does and bucks on the opening day more button buck will be killed also. Different states use point restrictions and some states use antler spread restrictions. In a story I have in front of me right now from Bowhunter magazine(I don't believe everything I read either)research was done at a Texas ranch it seems that older bucks breed more succesfully than younger ones I hope this isn't plagerizing

Age Percent of population fawns produced
1.5 44% 11%
2.5 26% 22%
3.5 30% 67%

I know its only one place but its amazing to me that older deer have alot more success breeding. Most of the buck in Pa now being killed are older deer lets hope the spike we pass on have the balls and antlers next year.
Remember deer management also reduces the herd size. If you want big deer with racks the only thing to do would shoot 4 pointers and below and let the big boys breed another year that way you would have less chance of an entire herd of buck with spike antlers

wannabee -

Antler restrictions allow more bucks to become older. As they become older, they also have longer to establish "hierarchy" or dominance. In theory, the most dominant bucks (the older ones) then get to breed the most, spreading more of the dominant "seed". The more years these bucks are allowed to live, the more breeding they do and less breeding is done by subordinate bucks.

Prior to antler restrictions, the average buck taken was 1.5 years old. With so many young bucks afield, the chances of a doe being bred by a buck with dominant genes may have been 50/50. Now that there is a viable population of older 2.5 and 3.5 year old bucks, there is a much better chance that the does will be bred by an older, dominant buck with dominant genes.

Yes, deer management can mean reduced herd size, but where I hunt in McKean County the effects of overpopulation for many years past is evident everywhere (browse lines). The reduction in herd size will allow the habitat to recover, leading to increased average deer weights and better herd health.

I understand that everyone hunts for different reasons, but if I'm looking for meat I'll gladly take a doe. I prefer to shoot only nicer bucks and let the smaller ones walk.

I caught picture of a spike buck in my trail camera and that thing was MASSIVE! I'd have shot it over any of the 6 pointers i saw. My husband also shot a heavyweight spike last year.

Penny

I live in Potter County and hunt on a lease, I do believe the antler retrictions are working, I have seen bigger bucks. What upsets me the most is the two weeks of doe season and all the years they had bonus tags. I used to be able to go on our lease and see 15-20 deer, this year I have seen three. If thet dont do something about this soon, then we will see the next generation of deer hunters not going out and that will be another way for the tree huggers to win.

Mike V