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What is the best way to store guns underground ?
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Picture of Concho42
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How deep and what to put on them for years of storage ?


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Posts: 578 | Location: PA | Registered: 21 March 2007Reply With Quote
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Picture of Alberta Canuck
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I suspect this to be a very complex problem. Though it may appear simple at first, the more one considers it, the more convoluted it gets.


First, the easy parts....pick a container that prevents the influx of ground water. Next, talk with some local geologists to find out how deep you would have to go to keep seasonal weather changes from causing "sweating" of water condensation out of the air already WITHIN the container when it is first buried.
Third, figure out how to remove as much air from the container as possible without breaking the waterproof seal...basically, we are talking "vacuum-packing" here.

Then pick a really sticky protectant coating. The original military Cosmoline is about the best I can think of, and is still available some places as military surplus. The problem with ANY protective coating is that it can't be allowed to "float" on top of any condensation which occurs, if it is going to protect the metal. Most oils and greases DO float on water, at least eventually. If it does, it will just be holding the condensation against the metal, and accelerating any rusting problem.

As no coating is forever, you will also have to set a schedule of how often you need to dig them up, re-inspect, re-coat, and re-vacuum pack, then re-bury.

Then you have to put the scheme you come up with next to the reasons you are burying the guns to vbegin with. To make them invisible? Ain't gonna happen with ground penetrating radar at hand.

To keep them invisible just from human eyesight, but still where you can get at them for use when you need them? Well, that sorta limits how deep you can put them, which in turn makes condensation induced by earth temp changes more of a problem.

And, of course all of this has a lot to do with where you live to start with. Southern Louisiana? Not too likely. Ground water level is way too high in many places. Anything buried may well float itself to the surface over a relatively short time.

Central Alberta? Problems again. Plenty dry, but in Edmonton, the capitol city of Alberta, they have to bury the utilities (like water and sewer pipes) 8 FEET under ground to keep them from freezing solid every winter. Ever try to retrieve anything from 8 feet down under frozen solid earth? Me neither.

Anyway, the list of things to consider goes on and on. Many folks finally conclude that burial of firearms is not a good hiding plan for something they may really, really, need in a hurry.


My country gal's just a moonshiner's daughter, but I love her still.

 
Posts: 9685 | Location: Cave Creek 85331, USA | Registered: 17 August 2001Reply With Quote
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Picture of STINGER
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Sealed PVC pipe would probably be best. then place them in a shallow flower bed outside the house.

The Russians did this and some were able to save their private weapons. They didn't have PVC though so the flower beds had oil slicks and no flowers. Rather conspicuous.

I guess we will have to wait this out and see what happens in the long run.

Best wishes, Bill
 
Posts: 479 | Location: MINOT, NORTH DAKOTA | Registered: 24 January 2005Reply With Quote
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Picture of Concho42
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Thanksguys for the help , Sch 40 pvc and a small candle inside to burn a vacume after sealing ! as for flower bed ? diggin I will be putting it very deep where no body will ever find it !


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Posts: 578 | Location: PA | Registered: 21 March 2007Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Concho42:
Thanksguys for the help , Sch 40 pvc and a small candle inside to burn a vacume after sealing ! as for flower bed ? diggin I will be putting it very deep where no body will ever find it !




I hope you consult a chemist (or at least a heating/refrigeration guy) before burning a candle in there to remove the "air". First off, I suspect that may remove the oxygen in the air, but not the oxygen in the water vapour which is also in the air. Water doesn't usually burn very well.

It is the oxygen in the water vapour which is the primary enabler of rust.

That water vapour condensation fear of mine may not turn out to be true, but I would be concerned until I KNEW burning the candle in the tube wouldn't simply cause the water vapour to condense on the rifle inside the tube.

Again, I suspect that might well happen. The warmed air (heat from the candle) may hold the vapour in suspension until the candle goes out, but then afterward as the temp falls inside the tube, I suspect you'll be almost sure to get condensation....just what you don't want on a gun you won't see again for a long while.

Also, I repeat, it doesn't matter how you do it, you will have to dig it up regularly for periodic maintenance unless you are burying a really simple gun (such as an M-3 "Grease-Gun). Otherwise, you can almost count on getting some rude surprises when you DO dig it up.

Good luck.
 
Posts: 9685 | Location: Cave Creek 85331, USA | Registered: 17 August 2001Reply With Quote
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I found bags for guns at http://secure -armorholdings.com/kleen-bore/product396.html
won't need a candle when using these .


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Posts: 578 | Location: PA | Registered: 21 March 2007Reply With Quote
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#1). The inet is public and monitored by the government, so guess who is on the list of hidden guns -???- now???
#2). I have read that the old cosmoline formula was a mix of lanolin and vaseline. Heat to liquid. Dip the weapon. Let cool. You could almost store these under water without further prep.
#3). As said, today we have much better tech. PVC is helpful and the rust proofers. WD40? Break Free. I have also read that ground pentrating radar can find iron/ferrous metals easily. Now if you find the corner of a pasture of dog pen where the animals have deposited much urine full of salts, much hinders radar... luck.
 
Posts: 519 | Registered: 29 August 2007Reply With Quote
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To quote another visitor, to this forum, "When it's time to bury your guns, it's time to dig them up".


NRA Patron Life Member Benefactor Level
 
Posts: 1248 | Registered: 15 December 2008Reply With Quote
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I have not hidden anything yet ! am waiting for march and the new rules that are in pelosi's hands for voting ! as for a list of hidden anything they already know what we all have ! as of now mine are legal ! after march some may not be ? I like boys scout modo [ be prepaired ]


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Posts: 578 | Location: PA | Registered: 21 March 2007Reply With Quote
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Concho.....I wouldn't worry about burying any guns. Because once we turn THAT corner, there will never come a time when we can dig them up and use them again.
Better to fight,(and win), that battle now.
Grant.
 
Posts: 336 | Location: SE Minnesota | Registered: 15 December 2003Reply With Quote
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Well we lost the election ! and we all know why ! I would rather bury mine for a time capsule than have them melted down for man hole covers !


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Posts: 578 | Location: PA | Registered: 21 March 2007Reply With Quote
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To absorb water? Desicant pack

to absorb water AND oxygen?

(This will be TOO simple for most of you....)

Use a couple of single use "hand warmers"

these contain salt (to absorb water and start the reaction)
and IRON POWDER (that absorbs oxygen)

Anyone who's ever noticed that disposable hand warmers really "Get going" if you exhale through them a couple of times will not need further explanation.


AD


If I provoke you into thinking then I've done my good deed for the day!
Those who manage to provoke themselves into other activities have only themselves to blame.

*We Band of 45-70er's*

35 year Life Member of the NRA

NRA Life Member since 1984
 
Posts: 4601 | Location: Pennsylvania | Registered: 21 March 2005Reply With Quote
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Posts: 554 | Location: CT | Registered: 17 May 2008Reply With Quote
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If you're planning on burying your guns, things in PA must be real bad.

Are you really afraid that they'll be taken?

If so, what's going on in this country?

I know if they try to get ours around here, it will be a very unhappy day for those that try to take them.
 
Posts: 3427 | Registered: 05 August 2008Reply With Quote
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Some testing might be advisable.

I'd start with some heavy PVC, add a refrigeration schrader valve, get a vacuum pump and gauges and make up a test model and see if it held a vacuum.

Other things would more than likely be needed, but that would not be a bad place to start.


Professional Hunter - Tanzania
 
Posts: 88 | Location: So. Cal & Tanzania | Registered: 06 February 2005Reply With Quote
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Picture of smedley
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Used to get "Gun Test" and they did an article/study on this. The best storage goo was plain ol Vaseline! Slobber the stuff on and pack it in to every nook and cranny.
A couple a heavy garbage bags, not the sissy ones from the grocery store, inside each other should keep the rest of stuff out and stay together until a later date.


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Posts: 3242 | Location: Cruising through the Milky Way at 98,000fps | Registered: 03 October 2005Reply With Quote
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When you use PVC pipe, bury the pipe standing up. Then park a car over the top. It defeats the ground penetrating radar.
 
Posts: 327 | Location: MiddleTennessee | Registered: 26 May 2002Reply With Quote
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I know for 5 years with the Birchwood Casey copper tect cover and wiped down with Vasoline they have kept like new under groung in pvc. but also other places without pvc
 
Posts: 67 | Location: Possum Hollow, IN | Registered: 09 February 2009Reply With Quote
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You may want to consider setting up an Argon purge. Dry argon, the only kind available from a compressed gas cylinder, is heavier than air. Cap one end, stand it upright and fill, cap the other. Put three coats of primer on the pvc cap and pipe. Liberally apply glue. Avoid cleaner, use the primer.
 
Posts: 275 | Location: UP of MICH (for the good times) East Central Wisconsin (by mistake) | Registered: 05 March 2007Reply With Quote
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Really, you gotta be joking about this thread.


This is why the Left thinks we're Gun Toting Wacko's


Believe me, if they come for my guns, we'll all be banded together (us) and they will be overthrown (Left-wing, Democrat, Socialist, Anti-gun, Commie, Deviant-loving, Obama-voting Morons)

I Hope
 
Posts: 3427 | Registered: 05 August 2008Reply With Quote
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Why not just vacuum seal 'em with your food saver? The plastic comes in long enough tubes, and in several widths. You might have to remove protruding parts like pistol grips, or scopes. Seal them up & into the pvc they go!


It's the little things that matter.
 
Posts: 353 | Location: East Texas | Registered: 22 January 2003Reply With Quote
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