Hi,

Just old discussion about this fine medium bore cartridge...
Time to put in some news!

Have played around with my Brno ZG-47 in 8x64S for some years.


To the left a 7x57 Mauser with 140grs Nosler AB and to the right a 8x64S with 200grs Nosler AB.
Compared to the 7x57 looks 8x64 very powerful!

The most accurate hunting load by far is just Nosler AB 200grs loaded to moderate speed.
First testing:

Bullet: Nosler 8mm Accubond 200grs
Cases: S&B 8x64S
Primer: Fed large rifle standrad
Powder: Norma 204, 57grs (Norma 204 slighty slower than IMR 4350)
Fps: 2611
Presents moderate pressure.

Have done some more shooting and the AB shine with Accurate 4350.
Five shoots from 100yds.


Done some bullets test.
Shoot the 8mm Accubond in wet newspapper at 2620fps from 10yds.
Holds together real fine and penetrate around 23 inch.

Nosler Accubond in the middle, left Laupa Naturalis 180grs (2670fps) and right Norma Oryx 196grs (2600fps).
The other bullets had around 2680fps.

Some more bullets test.

From left: NAT TSX REM BT GK WOOD

Laupa Naturalis 180grs, 2916fps
Barnes TSX 180grs, 2805fps
Remington SP 185grs, 2713fps
Nosler BT 180grs, 2926fps
Sierra GameKing 220grs, 2509fps
Woodleigh RN 220grs, 2490fps

The Naturalis and Nos BT are HOT loads!

Will under 2006 use 180grs bullets for my hunt loaded at around 2800fps, TSX for big game and BT for deers. These two has almost the same impact.

In the end a picture of the first game taked buy my "wonder rifle" and Nosler AB 200grs, a nice roedeer.

The bullet worked very fine and was gently at the short distance, around 40yds. After the hit the deer run 10yds before it gave up.

Now looking forward to see how the combination works for big game..

Thanks for posting that 280Swe, very interesting. I'm currenly waiting for word on the 8x64S R93 barrel I ordered from ALEKO @ Heritagearms. Now if only Aleko would read this, and get off his butt and get back to me....
- mike

That 8X64S has just got to be an excellent cartridge! How much more powder does it hold than the 8mm/'06?

The difference will not be worth worrying about. It is like comparing the .280 Rem to the 7x64 - peas in a pod, really. Technically, the 8mm-06 could be called the 8x63...

- mike

It is the ideal caliber for european - and perhaps northamerican(with exception of the big bears) - big game.
And 2900fps with a 180grs Bullet is in the range of a .300 Magnum! With much less powder!
I always got 2875fps with 196grs Woodleihgs and CDPs with safe and pressure tested loads!

The case capacity between 8mm-06 vs. 8x64S is not much, will do some testing in weekend.
The case body for 8x64S are longer and proberly kan hold some more powder.
The 8x64S case are little wider in in the downer case body and little smaller upper body, so this differens take out each other compared to 8mm-06, also just guess...
But to chamber and eject the 8x64S with it case design go very smooth.
Will also neck up a .30-06 to 8mm and take a picture with a 8x64S case.
But I guees the longer free bore in the 8x64S do greater powder handle before pressure goes up, like Weatherby cartridges.
This also do that you don´t need to set the bullets deep and stealing powder capacity from the case.

Case drawings compared.

8x64S


.30-06

280, that the same case with other older german calibers like the 8x60S with which you can double the power of the very simular and very effective old british .318 WR. Because you must not stick the heavy 225grs or 250grs bullets so deap in the case, you can get more power than with the .30/06, where the heavy bullets must go down deap in the case and reduce the case-capacity.

If reloading dies and properly headstamped brass didn't cost so damned much over on this side of the Atlantic, I'd own an 8x64 Brenneke!

It looks to be the equal of the 338/06 and even the 338WinMag when the 338WinMag is using lighter bullets.

quote:

Originally posted by Tex21:
If reloading dies and properly headstamped brass didn't cost so damned much over on this side of the Atlantic, I'd own an 8x64 Brenneke!

You should see the prices over here. I'll let you in on a little secret: they are NOT lower than in the States... But I guess being in Europe sort of gets you used to this stuff...

quote:

Originally posted by f224:
It looks to be the equal of the 338/06 and even the 338WinMag when the 338WinMag is using lighter bullets.

There will be little difference between an 8x64S, an 8mm-06 and a .338-06. Apart from nostalgia, the reason I'd like to get an 8x64S is twofold: 1) R93 barrels can be had in this caliber, and 2) the caliber is legal in France (which my beloved .30-06 is not). So in spite of the high prices and spotty availability of components and ammo, that makes it worth it to me.

- mike

The cases from Sellier&Bellot are not expensive, only 57Euro/100. And they are much better than in earlier times, good european cases in .30/6 have the same price or are more expensive(RWS,Norma).

Hi again,

I use most S&B 8x64S cases and they have good price and works fine so far.
Have also don some reforming job with RWS and Norma 7x64 cases, but it´s not worth it.

A picture of a 8x64S (left) and a 8mm-06.

quote:

Originally posted by Monastery-Forester:
The cases from Sellier&Bellot are not expensive, only 57Euro/100. And they are much better than in earlier times, good european cases in .30/6 have the same price or are more expensive(RWS,Norma).

Thankfully, it appears the S&B cases are semi-affordable (a .30-06 case in the States sells for about $.27 or the approximate equivalent of about Euro 0.21). Apparently, they are also semi-decent cases, in fact some people claim the super expensive Brenneke cases are S&B with a different headstamp.

Factory ammo is not widely available - in fact I know of 2 brands: a mega-expensive Brenneke load, and a more reasonable S&B. Don't know about the quality of the S&B bullets??

Dies now. The only 8x64S die I have come across is from RCBS. I have seen prices in Europe around Euro120 for a die set containing a standard FL and a seater. The same set can be had in the States for about $100 (~85 Euro). These are bog standard dies, which for a common caliber like the .30-06 or .270 Win would cost, maybe, 25-30$...

So, the 8x64S is not the cheapest of calibers to get into...

- mike

quote:

Originally posted by mho:
Dies now. The only 8x64S die I have come across is from RCBS. I have seen prices in Europe around Euro120 for a die set containing a standard FL and a seater. The same set can be had in the States for about $100 (~85 Euro).

Well, C H Tool & Dies also offer one for 72.45 $.

Carcano

quote:

Originally posted by carcano91:

Well, C H Tool & Dies also offer one for 72.45 $.

Carcano

Carcano, pointers, links?? That might be an interesting option for me.
- mike

P.S. Ah googled myself to: http://www.ch4d.com/

What is wrong with just using a cheap & plentiful 8x57 die as a neck sizing die?

Doug, I have never really considered that option. I'm not so worried about the sizer, as Hornady will make you a custom sizer from fired cases for about $75 (I always try to avoid sizng without an expander). But the seater... I wonder if you are not using a "chamber type" seater (like the Forster BR seater), whether it matters that the seater is somewhat shorter in the body?? The case body is probably not really supported by a conventional seater anyway, in which case you might get away with a shorter die??

- mike

quote:

So, the 8x64S is not the cheapest of calibers to get into...

No, but a 8x64S is the caliber for the geek that want something specialy that nobody else have and also a culture heritage that hold the spirit of Mr. Brenneke himself.
With a "pure vanila" hunting performance for most big game/deer and very fun to reload by the way...


A nice article:
http://www.brenneke.de/web/text/8x64.pdf

quote:

Originally posted by 280SWE:
No, but a 8x64S is the caliber for the geek that want something specialy that nobody else have

Ah. He got me. ;-) Since I already have a Swedish 8x54, I must probably now upgrade to a 8x64S in order to uphold geek status...

Carcano

Yeah, I was wondering about that comment as well. In fact, I thought I had perfectly rational reasons to want an 8x64S (France does not allow my .30-06), but now I realize that subliminally I was really aspiring to "geek" status...

- mike

So does my desire to own an 8x60S make me a super geek?

Nawww... a super geek you are if you insist on a 8x60 I. :-D

Carcano

Hi again,

Forgett to put in some pictures of my rifle...
Here is my geek gun

Excellent cartridge! Good load. Back when H205 was available, I was able to get 2620 from my 8X60RS double with 200-grain Nosler Partition bullets with pressures that were low enough. But now, I have to be satisfied with 2450 FPS in order to keep pressures low enough for that action. But it stll shoots acceptably.

This pattern was fired at 100 yards, shooting the right barrel, then the left, etc. with 200-grain bullets and 58 grains of RE 22 powder in reformed RWS 7X65R cases with Federal 210 primers.