recently had a new 1-12" twist .220 swift douglas installed on a M70 action. i've started load development with one bullet: 50 Nosler BT. have been using primarily 2 powders: imr 4064 and H414. been seating the bullets approx. .010-.015" off the lands. with both powders, I get heavy, sometime really heavy bolt lift when the powder charges are well below max listed in a couple different manuals: for example, the Sierra manual I'm using lists 40.2 gr. of H414 as the LOWEST charge for a 50 gr. bullet. At 39 grains I'm still getting sticky bolt lift. They don't say which twist they're using: probably 1-14". I don't have a chronograph so don't know the velocity. Some of the higher charges I tried there was primer indication of high pressure, but not on the lower charges. I talked with douglas man: he said faster twist= higher pressure, and I think most factory swift barrels used 1-14". It seems strange that with THAT much lower powder charge that I'd still be getting sticky bolt lift. Any other likely causes of heavy bolt lift? Thoughts? thanks

It could be due to your rifle.

I have had European rifles that would blows primers on starting loads.

tight chamber, tight neck, no throat.
heavy cases.
a faster twist does give higher pressures but not 10-K worth, more like 3.
pick something...

what's your velocity?

How old is your brass? If the primers do not show signs of pressure, then you don't have high pressure, but some
brass can only take so much. Different lots of brass, and sometimes, old cases, do not have the elasticity needed.
Also, try another bullet.
Faster twist equals higher pressure? Not that much difference in 14 and 12.
I have had the same thing happen with other calibers; it is always the brass.
He has a throat, and a minimum headspace chamber. But yes, what is the velocity?
Hornady lists 38.4 grains of 4064 as max with a 50 grainer.

What bullet diameter are you using?

using winchester brass that I've annealed: I believe this is the 3rd firing with this brass. Can't remember how old the brass is, but not super old. Nosler bullets mic right at .224". Last load I shot yesterday using 37.5 gr. imr 4064. My speer #9 manual says 36-40 grains. Still very sticky bolt lift with that load but primer looks fine to me: nicely rounded at the outer edges. don't have a chronograph. I do have another batch of new brass that is probably newer-definitely different lot. Will try.

This might be relevant.

It could be the brass.

Just built a 30-223 - built several before and are very popular.

The owner brought Brazilian made 223 brass, once fired.

We formed them.

We had problems with every single one we fir4d.

The bolt had to be hammered with a rubber hammer to open.

Got Remington brass, same load, same bullets, and everything worked just fine.

Why did you anneal it? That might be the cause. It is the brass. Again, if the primer looks fine, then it is the brass.
Also, just because a load is in a loading manual does not mean it will work in every rifle on the planet. Hornady lists a max of 38.4 of 4064. All rifles are different.
You also need to check velocity; that is important data.

Tom: I've heard numerous folks talk about importance of annealing swift brass. both times I talked to Stan, when I was thinking about the barrel, and again yesterday, he emphasized importance of annealing. the speer data I mentioned is the only manual I have that shows 4064 with that weight bullet: however as I mentioned, the Sierra data shows the same issue involving both H414 and 4064. Am going to try new brass and then maybe different bullet. why would annealing the necks and shoulders be a problem?

Annealing would make them too soft and then might not spring back from the chamber. If you are annealing neck and shoulder, I suspect the brass is getting too soft farther down, and it's elasticity is destroyed. I never anneal until I start getting neck cracks. Which is almost never. Factory brass is already annealed to some degree and there is no need to do it again; not sure why everyone talks about annealing new brass. In most cases, (not all) factory brass is good but I always start with it as is. I know of no manual that says anneal before you do anything else. And load data does vary quite a bit among all creators; one book used one barrel which does not represent all barrels. It always irks me when guys ask for load data; each rifle is different.
It's a solution to a nonexistent problem, in my experience. Until the actual problem arises.
I even routinely make 400 Whelen brass from 30-06 without annealing. I don't anneal until evidence shows I need to.
Others might do it differently.
Also, Ken Waters shows 38.4 4064 as max, and a search showed that many guys use 38 as a max. Do not believe all the reloading data will work on all rifles.

With a new custom barrel and what is probably a minimal chamber compared to any factory rifle, you're going to get higher pressure. If I had to drop below the minimum powder charge with a powder to get rid of pressure signs, my next move would to be to go to a slower powder, like RL19 or one of the 4350's, and I wouldn't be opposed to some H4831 either. Going below the stated minimums has it's own problems.

I use the Nosler 50gr BT extensively, and I can tell you that you don't have to run it right up to the lands to get it to shoot. In my CZ.223, it sits .115 off, and is the most consistently accurate bullet in that gun. It may reduce pressures a little to back it off a bit.

There are plenty of good suggestions in this thread, but until you fire it over a chronograph, it's all really anyone's best guess as to the solution.

I’ve loaded the 220 swift for 35 years. I use IMR 4064 powder and 50 gr ballistic tips, in a 1:14 twist barrel. I don’t have access to my data at this time so can’t share the grains of powder. I’ve never annealed any brass. Wish I could offer a solution.

I did a test on annealing, and frankly, found no difference in the life of the brass.

I think we took a lot of brass, annealed half of it, and left the rest as is.

We shot them all many times, they started cracking roughly at the same time.

I gave up annealing.

My own hunting brass - Norma 404 Jeffery formed to our 375/404 - has been to Africa at least 15 times, never been annealed.

But the sizing die is made to fit the chamber.

Sometimes a case neck, or shoulder, will crack.

thanks for your input guys. I will try new brass, and non-annealing. It is confusing to me however about this annealing thing. I guess its not unusual to have credible, experienced folks who completely disagree on issues. I just now looked at several well respected sources on-line: Sinclair International, Handloader article by John Barsness, a gun digest article that I did not read- and then douglas barrels as well, all stating the benefits of annealing brass. So I just scratch my head a bit. But neither do I question your experience re: annealing. I'm sure you guys have a lot more experience on re-loading than I.

Actually, I know of no one who ever anneals brass. When they crack, they throw them out. Like Saeed said. Maybe some brass benefits, but I have never had any. I have had soft brass from the factory that stuck in the chamber though. But for sure, I wouldn't anneal it before I ever tried it as is.
All reloading information is confusing; to those just starting. And that also applies to someone reloading for a new rifle. Every book is different. Every rifle is different, and every shooter has different ways of doing things. That is what makes it interesting. It is not like baking a cake.

Brass for some of the cartridges I load can run 3-5 bucks a piece. Annealing makes them last two-three times longer, at the very least.

220 swift cases?

No. I said, some of the cartridges I load.

My bet goes with DPCD's idea of the brass being too soft from annealing and probably the case being annealed down too far towards the head.

Annealing doesn't have to leave the brass dead soft,,though it easily can.
Better to just take the work hardening out of it that has been placed in it from repeated neck and shoulder sizing.
To do that you don't have to get it to red heat.
No need to get any of the case below the shoulder hot.

If it does, and it softens and looses it's elasticity as pointed out, the greater portion of the case will expand and grip the chamber walls instead of expanding and then slightly contracting allowing easy extraction.

I anneal some brass so as to extend the case life. The frugal being that I am.
My annealing process is to simply hold the case in fingers and twist/rotate the neck in a propane torch flame quickly as I count to '3'.
Then I either drop the case into a pan of water or usually just place then on the concrete basement floor...nice and cold.
If I can feel the case in my fingers getting warm, I figure it's been in the flame too long.

It goes pretty fast. I use it for the 'spensive brass.

Just a thought.
Unloaded, is your bolt lift snug?
If so, lap the lugs.

devere:

Please describe how YOU anneal brass.

Seems like everyone does it differently.

How hot and what color, and how do you cool it.

With this info we might get a better idea.

Before I learned of all this "must do brass
care". I full length resized everytime and
reloaded Rem 222mag cases over 60 times without ever trimming, or cleaning. The barrel gave up on my Sako L461. Then I had the new tube chambered for .223 because there's lots of such brass. I only had 100 222mag cases.

At the end: I had 95 cases left, two lost in the field, two mashed in the press, ONE split neck. I sold what was left and the guy was happy after his second loading.

George

Georgeld: good question on how I annealed. Chucked the base of the case in electric drill: rotated case slowly while putting propane torch flame tip on juncture of neck/shoulder till that area started turning darker color. Darker color on case moved down case body about 1/3rd to maybe 1/2 of the way down.

Now a update: yesterday I loaded up 5 new cases (Win) that were NOT annealed. Using H414 again, load started at 41 gr. and went up to 43 gr. in 1/2 gr. increments .020" off lands. No heavy bolt lift. I could see slight change in primer appearance as I increased powder charges, espec. in the 2 highest powder loads, but outside edge of primer still slightly rounded at outside and no cratering. It sure appears that I over-annealed and thru softened.

I would like to know how far down the body is darkened from annealing before having an effect on softness of the case. thanks much.

I stop when color change is slightly below the neck.

Good! As I suspected.
How far down discoloration?
Look at any military ammo; they do not polish off the annealed part and as Craig said, it is just barely below the neck. Do not anneal the body, any. Lesson learned.
But really, stop doing it altogether. Work up loads as you are, using the primer as the gauge. If you start getting split necks, then anneal. The Hold it in your fingers method is good because you have to drop it in the water before any damage is done.
To me, everyone who says to anneal before you start loading, is misguided. Only because I have never done that and didn't start loading last week. Maybe last week of 1967.