What is the case length of the Rem. Ultra-Mag cases? The reason I am asking I had the idea for a wildcat round on the .404 case. It might be easier to do it on the U-Mag case.

Thank You,
WyoJoe

The .300 UltraMag is 2.850".
Bill

Bill,
Thanks. What I had in mind was something along the lines of the .404 case cut to 2.5" and necked to 9.3 mm. The rationale behind this was to to get the 9.3X64 (or better) balistics on a more readily available case. The .450 Vincent Short necked to 9.3mm seems ideal.

WyoJoe

We were discussing the same thing a couple of weeks ago since we have a couple of hundred cases laying around. Let me do a drawing and some case work. There may be another way also.
Bill

WyoJoe,

Take a look at the Dakota line of cartridges. Don Allen and Pete Grisel put together several cartridges on the 404 Jeffery both in the 2.5" length for the smaller calibers and full length for the larger ones. There is a Canadian company named Imperial Magnum that has created a similar line along with an American group that has come up with the HE (Heavy Express)line. I have to do some more checking on the HE's since it's been a while since I did anything with them.

If you take the .330 (.338) Dakota and neck it up to 9.3 (.366) and load a 286 grain bullet with a 24" barrel it appears to be possible to achieve 2600 fps. without really trying hard. But to the same extent, there is a .375 Dakota available with excellent statistics so the 9.3 as with the .270 Win. is a hair splitter albeit one that I think is interesting. Then too, you could go the other way and create the 8MM Dakota as well. Life is only limited by funds and desire. I know that Dave Kiff could make up a terrific reamer and gauges and I think that we have the barrel tooling but I'll have to check. I'll keep working on this for a bit.

Bill

Bill,
Thanks for the information on the 9.3. I will have to keep my eyes on things. It may be a hair splitter but I think it is interesting and has possibilities. I could go the .375 Dakota but I don't do normal. I would like the 9.3/.404 to easily fit a 98 action. If you do this kind of work do you have a website? Is the .450 Dakota built on the full length .404? I thought I heard somewhere it was on a shortened .416 Rigby case.

WyoJoe

Joe,

I've been thinking of something similar, but in 35 caliber. My goal for that round is a 280 gr a-frame @ 2700 which is utterly reasonable, and your 9.3mm version pushing the 286 gr @ 2700 would be essentially the same thing.

There is no problem with a 2.5" 404 in a mauser, some work to the feed rails, magazene box and follower and opening up the bolt and extractor, fit and chamber the barrel and away you go. All things possible with time and $.

The big cost will be the custom reamer and dies. Then again, you could find a gunsmith with a floating pilot 330 Dakota reamer, have him put a 9.3mm spud on it, cut the chamber body and shoulder, then go back with a throater/necker to finish the chamber. Will save you the $ for the custom reamer.

Paul,
That sounds like a good idea. Sounds like you are wanting to build a brownie thumper. That should come pretty close to the .358 Norma at lower pressure. What action are you going to build your .35 on?

WyoJoe

I'd likely build it on a VZ-24, or whatever mauser 98 I come up with. Actually I was thinking more along moose for it.

I'm conservative when it comes to dangerous game, while I have no doubt the 35 would be entirely adequate, my comfort level with dangerous game starts at 40 caliber. Actually I'd really like to take a brownie with my 500 Jeffrey when its finished, as well as a moose.

WyoJoe,

I checked with Dan (our barrel maker) and he does have the tooling for the 9.3's.
Yes, you caught me not reading the blurbs correctly, the .450 Dakota is based on the Rigby.
My comment on splitting hairs was just that, a comment, mostly because people start to look for easier ways to do things when a process is explained to them. But I followed it up by saying that I thought your idea was interesting.
We talked about this at lunch today and arrived at the same conclusion that Paul did, use a body die and then go to the neck and throater. We've done this with other large cartridge reamers specifically the .585 basic necked down to .375 and then each step up through the .585 full length and the Nyati length. We also took the .300 Ultra Mag. brass as soon as it came out and did the same thing with reamers and dies.
Anyway, yes it can be done and is worth while from the brass availability standpoint. We use Dave Kiff's reamers almost exclusively and yes we have the .330 and .375 Dakota reamers.
Sorry this is long.
Bill

Wells Sports Store www.cutrifle.com

The 450 Dakota is based upon the full length 416 Rigby case.

Bill,
I went to your website & checked things out. Maybe we can get something going in the spring.

WyoJoe

Paul,
Let us know if you ever get a brown with your .500 Jeffrey. There is no such thing as overkill. I am the guy who likes to shoot prairie dogs with a .300 mag. I used to live in Dutch Harbor and was thinking if I move back that the 9.3/.404 X 2.5" would be an ideal round for there. I could go a .375 but I don't like to do normal.

WyoJoe