Mod 70 Push Feed. Why Not?

25 January 2002, 11:11

<gone hunting>

Last Summer I bought a Winchester Mod70 Black Shadow 300WM push feed for my first over 26cal rifle. While not perfect buy a longshot it was a start. I replaced the stock with a Boyds Walnut JRS, and instaled a Burris 3-9x40 Fullfield II Ball-plex in burris mounts & rings. I love it! $650 total. It'll shoot 7 differnt bullets into less than 1" @100 anytime, under 5" @ 500yds with 180gr Hornady SSTs.
It never jams or fails to extract. Not once in 683 rounds! Barrel is easy to clean and walks vary little when HOT, less than 1/2".
For a rifle to hunt nothing more dangrous than a Black Bear or WhiteTail with, Why not a Mod70 Push Feed?

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Death Before Dishonor

25 January 2002, 15:29

<Don Martin29>

I broke the extractor on one. It was a M-70 featherweight in 30-06. I have 3 or more 06's at any one time and I fed a reload into the chamber that was too tight. I could not close the bolt from my siting position so I stood up and lifted the bolt. It was already very tight so I closed it and fired the round.

When I opened the bolt the broken extractor, plunger and spring fell into the magazine. That extractor is only .050" thick on the part that goes into the dovetail in the bolt. That's the same thickness as a 30-06 brass rim by the way. But I think that extractor is made from powdered metal!

So I contacted USRAC and they sent me a new one. I put it in and it worked fine. I sold the rifle as fast as I could.

I don't own any push feed M-70's. I live in CT where they are made, I was around in 1964 when they screwed up the product line. I know many of the people who worked there. I have a really bad feeling about those rifles.

25 January 2002, 16:42

JAB

I've got two Model 70 push feeds and they have been great. One is a 308 which had a youth stock that I replaced with a featherweight stock. The other is a 300 win that I glass bedded two weeks ago. Took it out last Sunday with three different loads and two groups under an inch...the other at 1 1/3". I'm sure it will do great when I get to fine tuning loads for it.

I see no reason to not get a Model 70 push feed unless your just set on the CRF. The few I have been around shoot as well as any "out of the box rifle" you'll find.

26 January 2002, 01:45

<gone hunting>

quote:
Originally posted by Don Martin29:
I broke the extractor on one. It was a M-70 featherweight in 30-06. I have 3 or more 06's at any one time and I fed a reload into the chamber that was too tight. I could not close the bolt from my siting position so I stood up and lifted the bolt. It was already very tight so I closed it and fired the round.
When I opened the bolt the broken extractor, plunger and spring fell into the magazine. That extractor is only .050" thick on the part that goes into the dovetail in the bolt. That's the same thickness as a 30-06 brass rim by the way. But I think that extractor is made from powdered metal!
So I contacted USRAC and they sent me a new one. I put it in and it worked fine. I sold the rifle as fast as I could.
I don't own any push feed M-70's. I live in CT where they are made, I was around in 1964 when they screwed up the product line. I know many of the people who worked there. I have a really bad feeling about those rifles.

i've seen the same thing with Remington and Savages. i've also seen SAKOs with broken extractors, i've also seen the rim ripped off of a case by a Mauser Claw. the round then had to be driven out of rifle with a brass rod and a hammer.
i can see the need for CRF in a DANGROUS GAME rife. but not for a rifle used to hunt deer.
Must be the reason they make so many differnt styles of rifle.

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Death Before Dishonor

26 January 2002, 02:28

Terry Blauwkamp

I had "push feed" M 70's way since '65 when they first came out.

Always had good luck with them. Even have a DGR made out of one that has never failed.

BUT, I just got a new Black Shadow for Christmas, and it is already back at Winchester.

When I attached the one piece scope base, I noticed that upon tightening down the front two screws, the base had "day-light" under it in back.

I had to put a .040 shim under it to get it level.

I installed the scope, and after lapping the scope rings, so I know they were aligned properly.

The gun shot "ok", but the trigger sucked.

I took the gun to my local Winchester repair station and asked him about it.

He just said he was going to remove the scope and base, and send it back to Winchester for a replacement gun. Said he could do a trigger job on the new one when it came in.

Plus the ejector on the bolt face was bad too.

When I took the gun apart, that cheap assed stuff they put in the recoil lug for "glass bedding" peeled right out with the action.

Winchester certainly has a bargain gun there, but it needs a lot of tweating before it is right.

Not sure what I am going to do with the new one when it comes back, shoot it or sell it?

[This message has been edited by Terry Blauwkamp (edited 01-25-2002).]

26 January 2002, 03:21

<gone hunting>

was your gun new when you got it?
mine and 4 others just like it i've seen have not had any bedding compound at all.
no problems with the scope mounts eather.
i have had 2 Remingtons with off-center screwholes for the mount base over the years.
Monday morning rifles!

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Death Before Dishonor

26 January 2002, 07:41

<Don Martin29>

gonehunting,

I would choose the extractor that tore the rim off the 30-06 and not the other!

There is a logic to my thinking.

26 January 2002, 07:55

Terry Blauwkamp

Yes, my M 70 was NEW.

It is now back at Wincheser awaiting it's fate.

26 January 2002, 09:07

<gone hunting>

quote:
Originally posted by Don Martin29:
gonehunting,
I would choose the extractor that tore the rim off the 30-06 and not the other!
There is a logic to my thinking.

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Death Before Dishonor

26 January 2002, 09:16

<gone hunting>

quote:
Originally posted by Don Martin29:
gonehunting,
I would choose the extractor that tore the rim off the 30-06 and not the other!
There is a logic to my thinking.

i'm sure the logic is there if hunting Dangrous Game. i don't.
i like the CRF 70, got a nice one for Christmas, a 300WSM feather wt.
i've got rifles that cost over $4000 that won't shoot any better than this el-cheap-o waiting to fall apart push-fed mod70, their just not as bad as people say they are.

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Death Before Dishonor

26 January 2002, 13:25

Major Caliber

I have a push feed Model 70 featherweight in 7x57, I really like the rifle, the first 2 bullets always touch, then the 3rd opens the group to an 1".

28 January 2002, 18:04

rembo

"gone hunting", are you sure that your new Model 70 Featherweight 300 WSM is a "push-feed"? I'd be willing to bet that it's a controlled feed Model 70.Nothing wrong with push-feed M70's, I've owned a few and know a few people who have them as their primary rifle.

29 January 2002, 00:51

<gone hunting>

i like the CRF 70, got a nice one for Christmas, a 300WSM feather wt.

yes it is CRF! Controlled Round Feed and i like it fine. i just don't see the problem with all the people who Piss on the Non-Controlled Round Feed!

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Death Before Dishonor

29 January 2002, 07:41

Shane in WI

I have a push feed 30-06 and a controlled feed 22-250 and 338 M70's. Never had a problem with the push feed, in fact it's my most accurate gun. The 338 had feeding problem out of the box and the 22-250 has feeding trouble as well, I bought that used. Gunsmith replaced the spring and altered a few parts and now the 338 works great. I'll have to have the 22 cal looked at. Never had a problem with the pushfeed 30-06. I can understand the advantages of CFR, but in reality they both work well.

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Shane Marquardt

10 February 2002, 08:53

South40

Ordered a new M70 Stealth push feed in 22-250. When the rifle arrived last week I was immediately dissapointed. The barrel grove on the stock was way out of line with the rifle barrel. There was five thousands clearance on one side and an 1/8th inch on the other. When I tried to insert the bolt, it wouldn't go into the action. It seems the bolt stop/release lever was stuck, and would not operate freely. I then installed a set of Redfield bases on the rifle, and based on one of the posts above, I put a straight edge accross the top of the bases. Low and behold, there was a 0.01 air gap at the front base. To check to see if this was common on M70's, I pulled the scopes off my other M70's and checked them --- no air gap. I have two other beefs about the rifle; the trigger was the roughest I've ever encountered on a M70, and the bolt was clearly only engaging the action on one lug.

11 February 2002, 14:29

KuduKing

I hate to turn this into a Winchester bashing post, but......

They have turned into a completely screwed up company. Nothing they produce is consistent. Two rifles of the same model and calibre...... one is perfect, the other a horror show.

A have a M70 Featherweight in .300 WSM. It took me a couple of weeks to properly bed and seal the barrel in the stock, as there were haphazard contact points and free-floats the entire length. I ended up with an even pressure point about a inch from the forend tip, and a consistent and accurate rifle.

Other new production M70s I've seen have knots in the stocks, filled areas, poor bedding. One stock with look spectacular, the next like a canoe paddle.

The triggers are all too heavy. Sometimes the bolt releases don't work and need to be polsihed. The stainless guns are rough, and sometimes don't extract well.

I had one new production M70 in .300 Win Mag that would not shoot under 2.5 MOA with any kind of ammuntion. Just a plain awful barrel.

Their Custom Shop is a huge joke. I ordered a simple .375 H&H M70. I have been waiting almost FOUR TIMES as long as they promised. They claimed to have no stocks, then they had the stock but installed the wrong barrel on it. I refused to accept the wrong barrel length, and waited another 4 months. Now they claim to have the correct barrel but "lost" my receiver. I'm sure they sold it to someone else after I refused to accept their mistake.

Someone needs to take charge there and kick ass. The company is an embarassment to American manufacture.

But maybe not. I think this all started after they were bought out by the FRENCH company that owns Browning. Browning used to be synonomous with Customer Service. Now they stink, plain and simple. Their customer service is dead last in my opinion: slow, unresponsive and contemptuous. They will repair your gun, or boots,or high-grade stock which has split from the poor curing process they use - - but you will wait endlessly. My shotgun was returned for split high-grade wood, and I didn't get it back for 6 months - - twice! How am I supposed to enter competitions with equipement and service like that? I've since switched to Benelli. My boots were sent back 2 months before hunting season for sole separation - - I received them the following January. Thye'll be my last pair from them.

Fortunately there are other choices.

11 February 2002, 16:34

downwindtracker2

I don't think Browning ever made rifles, only sold them.FN, then after the strike Miruko.

12 February 2002, 05:44

<Wapi-T>

Hey, fellas!

Just wanted to dump my $.02.

I have seen some poor workmanship on nearly every make of factory rifle. My Remington M700 came from the factory with a rolled crown that absolutely wrecked its accuracy. My A-bolt's factory stock fit poorly, touching barrel on one side with a 1/8 inch gap on the other. My Model 70 Stainless featherweight, however, is nearly custom grade. The stock is a piece of art. It carries like a dream. It shoots several 130 grain loads into less than 1". You could spend a LOT of dough on a custom and do any better than this.

So it comes down to this: Be discriminating when you buy a factory arm. Don't order one. Go down to the store where you can thoroughly inspect it, take it apart, and cycle the action, safety, and trigger. Every maker produces the occasional dog.

Back to the push-feed topic...I prefer the CRF, based on experience with 4 different makes of Mauser-actioned rifles. I also own some push-feeds, and have no problem with the actions (Remington's feeds a little rough for my taste). I have never personally experienced extracting failure with any rifle. IMHO, extracting failure is an issue that is usually blown out of proportion- it just doesn't happen that often. Feeding failure is a much more common problem in my experience, and when it comes to reliable feeding, the M70 CRF action is the champion in my corner.