Fire Lapping "New" barrel vs Breaking in the Barrel

14 March 2002, 13:28

<Chickencoop>

I just got a new rifle in .223 Remington. Could I fire lap the barrel by using fine grits and get the same results as in "breaking in the barrel"? I have never followed the present day method of shoot - clean etc. and have always had my rifles shoot well. Just wondering out loud.

Thanks,

Chickencoop

14 March 2002, 13:33

Brad

CC, "firelapping" is a last-resort if normal break-in and handloading don't give your required results. Firelapping will remove metal from your bore!

Brad

14 March 2002, 14:38

DB Bill

Take a look at David Tubb's "Final Finish" lapping procedure...Cabela's sells it and if you do a web-search you will find more info. It comes in a variety of fine grits and I recently used it to break-in a high-dollar custom barrel on the advice of the maker.

14 March 2002, 15:04

Zero Drift

First off, why do you think you need to fire lap?

The safest thing to do on a factory barrel or standard premium barrel is to shoot approximately 20 rounds following some shoot and clean method - 1 to 5 & then 2 to 10. Then shoot another 50 to 75 rounds. If your gun still fouls badly, then fire lap.

Fire lapping will most definitely push your throat forward, even with the finest grit. Clean your barrel very well before you start to ensure all the machining crud is out. Use Butches or Sweets to remove the fouling while you are breaking in the barrel.

DB - I am curious who manufactured your barrel and what caliber it is? If I were going to fire lap, Final Finish is the best way to go.

[This message has been edited by Zero Drift (edited 03-14-2002).]

26 March 2002, 03:22

rickt300

I always shoot 200 or so rounds through a barrel before I even consider any type of polishing. I usually clean with Hoppes benchrest and brass brushes every 35-40 rounds and I have some fine shooting and non fouling barrels. I find Speer bullets put less metal fouling in barrels than any other brand.

26 March 2002, 05:08

Robgunbuilder

Firelapping is a last resort method to deal with a bad barrel. Recognize that what it does is grind out the throat of the barrel and rifling. If your barrel won't shoot due to a high spot somewhere or rifling cutter chatter it might help otherwise you are in actuality causing to occur exactly what everyone else dreads, which is major barrel wear. It won't correct a non-concentric chamber, deep pits, etc. I have done such testing and cerrosafe chamber casts before and after fire-lapping and it does increase the throat dimensions considerably. I'd NEVER do it on a new barrel made by a high quality manufacturer. It is tempting to try it on a bad barrel, but in my experience it doesn't work all that well. Frankly, I've had much better results whacking off a thread or two from the breech as well as an inch of muzzel. Rechamber and re-crown and usually your back in buisness. By the time you get finished with the firelapping kit and three hours of time ( followed-by disappointment) the rechamber/re-crown approach starts to look real good.-Rob

26 March 2002, 06:31

<allen day>

In a nutshell, I agree with Zero Drift's points on this issue.

I came very close to fire-lapping a new barrel recently, by after researching things a bit, I decided against it. The more standardized break-in procedures have proven sufficient, and that' been good enough for me.

AD

26 March 2002, 08:00

<Chickencoop>

quote:
Originally posted by Chickencoop:
I just got a new rifle in .223 Remington. Could I fire lap the barrel by using fine grits and get the same results as in "breaking in the barrel"? I have never followed the present day method of shoot - clean etc. and have always had my rifles shoot well. Just wondering out loud.
Thanks,
Chickencoop

26 March 2002, 08:30

<Chickencoop>

Thanks for all of the honest input.

David Tubb's "Final Finish" seems to make a lot of sense. He has a product called TMS or Throat Mainteance System that appears to be the answer to my question. This product contains very fine grits inbedded on bullets with long bearing surfaces. The idea is to progressively polish finer and finer. David says that this process will in no way harm a barrel. He uses this product to break in new handlapped barrels. I trust what he says and does when it comes to the shooting sports. I guess that this is not firelapping per se, but a new and innovative method of breaking in new barrels! I got this information on the following site: www.zediker.com Again thanks,

Chickencoop

28 March 2002, 10:01

scot

Be carefull to confirm statements made by people with something to sell.

It most definately will push your throat foreward. If you like a free bore go for it. I am not sure what the more critical factor is in your bore. It might be a nasty rough spot. If that is the case then this may work. On the down side the bullet will get a running start at the rifling after you firelap it. That will hurt accuracy, all else being equal. Another thing that come to mind is the possible sand blast effect on the crown. On the plus side you will be putting a taper in the bore. I guess the best of all worlds would be to shoot your grit bullets then set it back an re-crown.

Think of this....how many top bench rest shooters use this system? That should say something.

As for me, I'll spend the extra bucks for a good barrel from a good manufacturer and let them install it. I have learned to pay attention to the winners. I am equipped and capable of installing barrels myself. But, if the manufacturer screws it up then I send it back. They will usually make it right for free. You are often money ahead to buy quality once. I got a Kreiger Stainless Heavy match tube for my match Garand in .308 1:11 twist. I let them install it, paid the bucks and waited the wait. I could not be happier with it. Food for thought.

quote:
Originally posted by Chickencoop:
Thanks for all of the honest input.
David Tubb's "Final Finish" seems to make a lot of sense. He has a product called TMS or Throat Mainteance System that appears to be the answer to my question. This product contains very fine grits inbedded on bullets with long bearing surfaces. The idea is to progressively polish finer and finer. David says that this process will in no way harm a barrel. He uses this product to break in new handlapped barrels. I trust what he says and does when it comes to the shooting sports. I guess that this is not firelapping per se, but a new and innovative method of breaking in new barrels! I got this information on the following site: www.zediker.com Again thanks,
Chickencoop

28 March 2002, 11:02

<Reloader66>

Weather you think the break in method works or not it is far better to try that than firelapping. Firelapping is far to agressive in my book, and I won't do it. Most rough bores will come around if you try the breakin method first. Shoot and clean after every round up to twenty rounds. Then after every four shot group until 100 rounds are reached. If your bore is so bad it still needs work it should be replaced. All my rifles shoot well and all have been subjected to a breakin procedure.

28 March 2002, 11:53

<Powderman>

An important step that is missed by some shooters is to thoroughly clean the rifle BEFORE you fire the first round from it.

Take your time, invest in a good bore guide first thing. Clean from the breech, always.

I use this procedure on a new rifle:

First, a patch dripping with Hoppe's. One time through from breech to muzzle. Pull it off, withdraw, and wipe down the cleaning rod.

Then, dry patches, at least four--first two go through once only; last two, at least five strokes fore and aft.

Then, clean with Sweet's, following the instructions on the bottle. Patch dry, and clean off all residue.

Finally, oil the chamber and lug recesses, wipe totally dry. Run an oil patch down the bore, and patch out using 3-4 dry patches, about four strokes each.

The reason to oil the chamber and bore before firing, and after cleaning with Sweet's, is because Sweet's will remove absolutely all traces of lube and protectant from anything it touches. Cleanup afterward, and cleaning during firing, will be much easier if you do the oil-patch, then patch dry.

28 March 2002, 12:11

Robgunbuilder

David Tubbs Final Finish- There is a sucker born every minute! Just go to a Benchrest match and ask anyone If they have used this MAGICAL METHOD. Doubt you'll see many hands raised. IT's your barrel, Time and Money. I hope your satisfied.-Rob