Has anyone got a custom reamer made by Pacific Tool and Gauge lately?
How is their service?

I would call Dave Manson for a custom, jmho...

quote:

Originally posted by Brian Canada:
Has anyone got a custom reamer made by Pacific Tool and Gauge lately?
How is their service?

Brian,
After my last experience with PTG all I can say is, never again. Major fuck up that cost me about $500. I did get a call from Dave, and he did apologise, but no offer to compensate me for his screw up.
I ordered my 318 WR reamer from Dave Manson and had it sooner than promised, so he gets all my business now.
John

quote:

Originally posted by Gundog 64:
I ordered my 318 WR reamer from Dave Manson and had it sooner than promised, so he gets all my business now.
John

I have only dealt with Dave Manson once but I can say, without reservation, Dave Manson provided me with the BEST customer service I have ever received from any business. He is A+++ in my book!

My experience mirrors John's. I used to order from PTG when Dave Kiff answered the phone himself in the early morning hours, and had control of things. Got some good reamers and good service. Last two reamers I sent to them for customs, they redrew wrong, one I edited twice before they got it right, the other I gave up after 3 edits and bought from Dave Manson, who delivered flawlessly. I still occasionally ordered standard list reamers from PTG; the last two were real bad experiences, so I quit. The second to last, I ordered a custom neck and throat reamer which they used to offer at a reduced price, and they charged me the full price for a custom chamber reamer! Wouldn't adjust; they said that custom neck and throat meant one they had on hand. I would have bought a full custom reamer for full price, not a custom n&T. Last reamer I bought was supposed to be an ely .22 rf with custom pilot precisely sized to a particular match barrel. I had it shipped to a gunsmith for use on my barrel. When I got it and the barrel back, I found that they had shipped some goofed up solid pilot thing, that had a weird spiral grooved solid pilot. The throat on the barrel was scarred up slightly from the goofy pilot snagging chips, so an expensive match barrel, reamer cost, and gunsmithing cost was all to waste. Their position was: Yes, they shipped the wrong reamer, but sorry, but I should have examined the reamer for the mistake and returned it before using it.

So, I'm done with them.

On the other hand, I've had nothing but excellent service with Dave Manson. He's professional, responsive, and most importantly, delivers exactly the reamer I spec, after verifying a dimension he might question with me. I've had excellent luck with his reamers. I just looked at his list a couple of days ago, and he doesn't offer a custom .22 lr reamer for specific match ammo. I own his match .22 rf reamer; it works well, but I wish he offered custom throats for specific match ammo also.

Dave Manson is the way to go. I have used PTG in the past, but no longer. I would just be repeating everything that was said above if I went into details.
Good luck with your project.

Every reamer i own came from Dave Manson. Not a fan of PTG not after similar experiences. Delayed shipping for in stock product. Cheytac farming out it custom dies to PTG only to have them foul it up horribly. No sorry. never again will PTG get a dime of my money.

I will say that JGS is produces quality stuff but I've yet to use them. I do need a new .308 match reamer though..

Thank you to everyone for your candid and forthright response.

I actually asked a leading question to see if I was the only one having trouble with Pacific Tool and Gauge.

I have had a full six months of bullshit from PT&G on my custom reamer order and I wanted to see if I was alone in my experience. To this day I have not received a reamer from them that was made correctly. I am now working on getting my money back.

Since you folks responded I took your advice and sent my drawings and dummy round to David Manson. They are professional, quick to respond and genuinely interested in providing good service.



Thanks again for your help. Brian

If ordering anything custom, I'd look elsewhere.

That said, last Spring I ordered a 2-piece Model 7 bolt with a couple other bottom metals. It came as ordered, eventually.

Their products work, but buying from one of their distributors (e.g. Browells) or paying with a credit card is another layer of insurance when they deliver you something wrong or they try to double bill you. I've contested CC charges before and was refunded my money for PTG botch-jobs.

jpl, Thanks. Good to know.

I have also had consistent fine quality and excellent service from JGS. They even re-did a PTG reamer once for me so that it would work. That is over the top customer service if you ask me. They are a little more expensive but with them you do get what you pay for.
I see nobody has mentioned JGS so far, and I thought their name should be in the mix. I've also used Manson with complete satisfaction. But PTG? For me in the last several years, they've screwed up just about everything they've touched.

I'll second the Manson/JGS endorsement. JGS was started under the Keith Francis label and Keith stayed on a long time after the sale.

Way back when..he was considerd the very besy

I live within driving distance of PT&G so I USED to order reamers and go pick them up and save a week or so of delivery time...NOT ANY MORE...THREE times in the past year I've email them requesting specific information on wildcat reamers and three times I NEVER heard back and was put on hold when I called without anyone answering the hold.

I emailed Dave Mason a couple days ago about my latest 500 S&W project and received a reply THE NEXT DAY with all the info I needed, prices and some extra info I didn't request that gave me some insight in another area I was needing.

Within the next week or so...as soon as I get some dummies made up and checked out...I will be ordering that reamer from Mr. Mason...PT&G is no longer on my radar...WHO????!!!!!!

LUCK

I've never had a lot of trouble with any of the modern manufacturers. Guild, Hartford and Hendricksen are long out of business and I haven't bought a Clymer in donkeys years. But I don't order a lot of wildcat reamers either and PTG, Manson and JGS have never given me much trouble with off the shelf calibers. I prefer JGS and I generally order from them if I intend to keep the reamer. The only down side with JGS is that they cut very hard and you have to use sulfur based oil with them. In days past in other shops I was forced to use water based coolants and JGS reamers are not (Green Friendly People) and do not like that very much. They tend to protest loudly and get jerky on top of their hard cutting tendencies. They do however cut very smooth chambers and they don't chatter or leave rings.

I press oil thought he barrel as well WoodHunter. I use either Ridged Dark or Sulflo depending on whats available at the time. Same stuff I think. I true up the muzzle between centers so that I can hold it in an ER40 and float the threads on the steady rest and allow the reamer to become the tailstock center. The 60 degree center in the muzzle of the barrel mates up to a 60 degree center on the oil delivery which is held in place by one of my material stop collars. I gave up on using expensive rotating unions. They were also a time waster to set up and I just went to air chuck unions. You just insert the delivery into the headstock, tighten up the locking collar and plug in the oil line. The center of the barrel gets pulled up tight against the delivery center when you tighten the ER40 chuck. Nothing to dial in and takes 5 minutes to set up.

One thing is certain. I would never go back to chambering without forced oil flow of some type or another.

Gunsmith Rod Henrickson Sulflo Dark by Rod Henrickson, on Flickr

Gunsmith Rod Henrickson Oil2 by Rod Henrickson, on Flickr

Gunsmith Rod Henrickson Oil1 by Rod Henrickson, on Flickr

JGS Everytime I can. They want your business. They care about your business. Kiff wants your money, he cares about your money.

PTG, a company that thinks they are much better than they are.......

Funny thing was I was talking to the former CEO of Cheytac Dennis Omanoff (he bought into cheytac then quickly cashed out and bailed) he was telling me that David Manson's stuff was sub par would only cut on one flute and was not to the original Cheytac spec. Well when you talk BS you should know who's on the other line and what equipment I have at my disposal.

I fear what was going on was David Kiff had his ear and he was just regurgitating Kiffs BS.
Know being a former toolmaker and having access to proper measuring tools. I can tell you there was nothing wrong with the 408 CT reamer we ordered from Manson. I put it on the optical comparator at work, checked it for run out and any miss ground flute. lets just say the reamer was better than my comparator could discern. all dimensions were hit closer than .0002" DRO could discern.

The icing on the cake was when we received our Ultra Bitchin factory dies from Cheytac that were made by PT&G well they sent one in .375 and one in 408. colossal screw up and i was tired of it. not to mention other issues and a long wait and three or four missed dead lines that they promised to ship by.

I called David Veirs of Veirsco and had the dies in six weeks as promised. The cool thing was the Veirsco dies and the Manson reamed chamber match so well the brass is just barely being worked. resizing is supper easy. Oh and that reamer, It showed up in two weeks.

PT&G can go pound sand.

I'm surprised to see so much experience matching mine. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, a pattern is generally a pattern.

I had very good luck with PTG in the early 2000's. Good reamers, bought one of the 40x bolts, bought lots of their win supergrade sling swivels, plus some tooling. Then, about 2010 or 2011, it all deteriorated to this. Don't have recent experience, last one was about 2013 or so.

Is he aware of all this bad press?

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
Is he aware of all this bad press?

I think, he thinks he's above it.......

.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
Is he aware of all this bad press?

I think, he thinks he's above it.......

.

He didn't use to be, he was quite responsive, and answered the phone himself in the morning. I think the business just grew beyond the capability of one man to run it, and he's better at machine work than he is at running a successful business. A commmon ailment of successful tradespeople and mechanics.

I am waiting to get my money back. I will let you know.

Didn't one of the reamer places have a young lady that answered the phone by the name of Cheyenne or something that sounded like it was related to a Native American name?

Steve.....

My last go round with them, I got a different person each time I called. It was always the same, so and so I talked to last time isn't here anymore and I don't know what she told you.
My last call a grouchy prick answered the phone, in about 1 minuete I had enough and told him to send my money back.

Manson Reamers is sure on the ball!
The respond immediately with information like this:

"Dear Brian :

Your invoice appears below.

Your order is being processed!

Thank you for your business - we appreciate it very much.

Sincerely, Dara Stringer

dave MANSON Precision Reamers"

This is while they are busy preparing for the Shot Show. Impressive.

quote:

Originally posted by Brian Canada:
Manson Reamers is sure on the ball!
The respond immediately with information like this:

"Dear Brian :

Your invoice appears below.

Your order is being processed!

Thank you for your business - we appreciate it very much.

Sincerely, Dara Stringer

dave MANSON Precision Reamers"

This is while they are busy preparing for the Shot Show. Impressive.

Brian,
I was extremely pleased with the service I got dealing with Daves shop. I spoke with my gunsmith yesterday and he stated (without me asking) how well Dave's reamer cut the chamber for my 318 WR. I'm sure you will be happy and Dave will get all my orders from now on.

quote:

Originally posted by ssdave:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
Is he aware of all this bad press?

I think, he thinks he's above it.......

.

He didn't use to be, he was quite responsive, and answered the phone himself in the morning. I think the business just grew beyond the capability of one man to run it, and he's better at machine work than he is at running a successful business. A commmon ailment of successful tradespeople and mechanics.

You're painting a broad stroke.

Update.
At Pacific Tool and Gauge it has been about two weeks since Kelly said she would refund my money. Today, I phoned them and was forwarded to a nice new lady looking after this sort of thing. She said she would find the file and call me back. And so it goes at PT&G.

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:

quote:

Originally posted by ssdave:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
Is he aware of all this bad press?

I think, he thinks he's above it.......

.

He didn't use to be, he was quite responsive, and answered the phone himself in the morning. I think the business just grew beyond the capability of one man to run it, and he's better at machine work than he is at running a successful business. A commmon ailment of successful tradespeople and mechanics.

You're painting a broad stroke.

Over my 36 years in business I have come to the conclusion that no matter how good you are, you are always going to have the occasion job go south. The more you do and the bigger you get, the more often you get these cluster fucks. Also, the more people you hire, the more often these cluster fucks happen as well.

I have also learned that the less of a product that you use, the less of these products that you will find defective. As you grow and begin to use more of a certain item, you will get more and more defective ones.

And of course there are people who simply seem to be a magnet for problems. Don't ask me why. Some people are jinxed. I'm that way with space. It doesn't matter where I rent or buy. No matter how well I check the place out. 2 months later there is always a wailing, screaming crack whore with 40 kids or a rock band living next door to me. NEVER FAILS ! As soon as I move into an area the property values PLUMMET! As soon as I leave, a convent of Nuns and a troop of monks move in and a big, glitter rainbow glows over the place and it becomes a sanctuary of tranquility.

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:



You're painting a broad stroke.

You're right, I am, Butch. That doesn't apply to all good artisans, tradespeople and skilled workers. Some do well both at their trade and at running a business, even if it grows.

But, statistically, 7 out of 10 are bad at it, enough that they fail the business.

I won't type the saga that was my last reamer purchase from PTG. It took over 3 years to get the correct reamer from them. This included several phone calls speaking directly with Mr.Kiff who is VERY difficult to get a hold of now.

I used a friends reamer the other day, it was a PTG, and I was amazed at how nice it cut. 4 out of the 6 flutes cut nice chips, the other two fuzz. I noted it was from 2010. The last reamer I received from them cut on one flute, and one flute only.

I will not use any of their products.

I have spoken with Mr. Manson on the phone several times over the last few years. He is very helpful, extremely knowledgeable, and responsive. Reamers I have received are excellent and quickly made. To sum it up, Manson is everything PTG is not.

Still working on getting my refund at PT&G.

So, my Pacific Tool & Gauge saga is coming to an end after more that six months.
I found a nice new lady there that went to bat for me and says she got my refund processed. Her name is Sarah. I am grateful for her help.

Pacific Tool & gauge is not a good company to get a custom reamer made. Buyer beware.

Wow! Glad I came across this thread. I am in driving distance of PTG and had good luck with them a few years ago, but I will definitely steer clear now. Kevin Wyatt is in the same neck of woods, and Kevin’s service still seems good.

INTJ, Good to know. Thanks.

All's well that ends well.

I finally got my money back from PT&G.

Meanwhile, I ordered the custom reamer from Dave Manson. He finished it ahead of time with no fuss.
My gunsmith said the Manson reamer is perfect!

I recommend Dave Manson. Professional service and perfect product.

In February, I ordered some SAAMI floating-pilot reamers and gauges and coordinated a reamer to be sent in and modified by Manson. I had them them all back very quickly. I'm far more happy with my first ever Manson experience compared with my last PTG experience.

My experience with PT&G has been better than others.

I recently got three pieces of bottom metal (One Remington, and two Winchester). all three were a bit loose. i mailed them back with a note, and got them back in two weeks working perfectly.

My recent reamer, a 9.3 x 70mm, came from Dave Manson. It was perfect. My latest reamer, a C.I.P. reamer in 6.5 x 65mm RWS came from PT&G. It is spot on.

Trust but verify. I loved dealing with Dave Kiff back in the day. I love talking with Dave Manson nowadays.

Yikes!
I have mostly done business with Manson, but PT&G has never failed me, nor JGS.
Now I have been waiting about 2-1/2 mos for a reamer from PT&G.
I will have to do some checking on that one now, by telephone.

Rip ...

A couple of longtime accuracy gunsmiths have told me that the quality has been fine from PT&G, the wait times have become long. I am going to be in Medford for the NBRSA Long Range Nationals. If I get time I’ll visit the shop.