Rem 700 LSS: Free float or not?

30 May 2002, 07:57

So I've got a Remington 700 LSS in .300 RUM that shoots merely OK. With factory ammo, I get 2" groups at 100 yds, though I can get them down to about an inch with careful handloading. I feel that this is insufficient for shooting at longer ranges, and would like to improve things.

Furthermore, I've noticed that pressure on the forend definitely affects the groups. Shooting off a bipod, for example, scatters the shots-- even with loads that group nicely off bags. So I'm certain that things could be better.

Now, my local gunsmith tells me that free-floating this gun may make it shoot worse, because thinner barrels do better with some point of contact. Is he right? Should I free float it and/or bed the action anyway? Any other suggestions for improving accuracy? I'm not after a target gun, but it surely would be nice to shoot 3" groups at 300.

Pertinax

30 May 2002, 08:13

<Mike Brown>

Get on Brownells site and order up a set of pillars and some Accragel. The instructions are in there. You drill the screw hols out, screw the pillars to the action, and glue the pillars up with accragel and stick it into the stock(very simplified version). The barrel HAS to be freefloated. I have an ultralight 358STA that weighs only 7 pounds and if any gun has a whippy barrel, this one does. It is free floated, pillared, and shoots sub moa. Hits spraypaint cans at 700 yds most every shot.
Do it. You`ll be glad you did.

30 May 2002, 08:38

scot

Every rifle is an individual. It may be better or worse. I free floated my M-700 that has a Pac-Nor barrel. It is a big game rifle. It went from about 3/4 to slightly over one inch. So, it got worse, it also has held it's point of impact for many years. That is worth more to me than a trivial change in group size.

I would glass bed the action and put pads of glass out at the tip. Make them like "V" blocks. Maybe 15# of pressure. I like to put the black PVC pipe wrap tape around the barrel then cut away for the little "V" block pads. The tape leave a tiny gap and an even edge. Looks good. If you aren't happy then free float it after. It is harder to make a pretty job if you free float then put the pressure pads back.

30 May 2002, 09:28

<Mike Brown>

No argument that a pressurepoint up front can help sometimes, but by and far, the most accurate rifles in the world are freefloated and pillared. Metal gets hot and cold and expands and contracts, wood moves with temperature(moisture is not needed to move wood) change, and it`s a rare rifle that will shoot hot or cold without a POI change if it has something touching the barrel.
The action that sits on pillars, and ONLY pillars, has little or no change hot or cold. Much as benchrest shooting bores me to tears, the bench folks have the program to make any type of rifle shoot well down pat.
Like they say in Montana... "Eat more lamb- Ten thousand coyotes can`t be wrong."

30 May 2002, 10:06

Hot Core

quote:
Originally posted by pertinax:
...(#1)I get 2" groups at 100 yds, though I can get them down to about an inch with careful handloading. I feel that this is insufficient for shooting at longer ranges...

(#2)Shooting off a bipod, ...scatters the shots--

Now, my local gunsmith tells me that free-floating this gun may make it shoot worse, because thinner barrels do better with some point of contact. (#3)Is he right? (#4)Should I free float it and/or bed the action anyway? ...(#5)it surely would be nice to shoot 3" groups at 300.

Hey Pertinax, In regard to #1, have you tried shooting the rifle beyond 100yds yet? It is not a hard and fast rule that groups "open" in multiples of what was shot at 100yds.

#2 I agree that is generally the case. Changing from a bench to a bipod is not as solid.

#3 Maybe, it depends on the specific barrel as has been mentioned above. I'd agree that thin factory barrels "normally" shoot better with some upward pressure at the tip, but there are no guarantees.

#4 Maybe. Trial and error will tell you. You can "shim-up" the action with an equal amount of business card pieces under each end of the receiver and try it. Just take it up the same amount on each end. Normally 3 pieces will be enough to Free Float it.

#5 Yes indeed it would! [Big Grin]

30 May 2002, 10:09

Robgunbuilder

Unless you have a heavy barrel ( i. e. 1.000 at the muzzel) freefloating may indeed make the situation worse. I suggest you do the following ( It's worked on about 50 Remingtons for me). Accraglass the tang and the rear of the recoil lug as well as the first 1 inch of the barrel beyond the recoil lug. Use tape on the foreward part of the lug , bottom and sides to avoid this area contacting the glass-bedding. Pillar bed if you want, but it won't work any better than what I just described. Add a good trigger while your at it. My two 300 RUM's bedded as described shoot in the .3's. Send E-mail if you need more help!-Rob

30 May 2002, 14:15

markus

I have the exact same rifle by the sounds of things and had/have the same problems. I glass bedded the action and chamber which made it alot better. but its still not good enough. so i stuck a piece of .410 shell under the barrel like a bridge and sure enough it shoots better. So as soon as I get a chance I am going to put a Kleingunther style bridge in it. which is 2 little "nub's" at the fore tip which can be made by filling 2 straws up with bedding compound. it has been very successful on a Sako I know of. And I believe Kliengunthers were garrenteed to shoot 1/2 moa.

30 May 2002, 16:08

pertinax

Wow. Thanks for the suggestions. It hadn't occurred to me that I could try a pseudo-freefloated arrangement without actually doing it. That's easy, and worth a try. (Thanks, Hot Core.)

So is the suggestion to try pushing something in under the barrel. I'll try that too. And if those are inconclusive, I'll do what Rob suggests. .3s would be very, very nice.

Oh, and Hot Core: I have _not_ grouped it at longer ranges. I may get a chance to do that this weekend though. I'll post back my results.

A.R. really is the best gun forum there is. Unbelievable sigal-to-noise ratio here.

Pertinax