At first let me state - I haven't got a clue about gunsmithing at all - so my nickname "Daydreamer" speaks for itself!

I have a pair of O/U Tikka Doubles in 7x65R and 9.x74R which I'm very happy with.

I was playing around with the idea of getting a real safari rifle in 416 Rigby, considering a CZ550 with a little bit of exstras done. Nice thing - but a double would make me realy happy - if only I could afford a new Krieghoff classic...

Recently I found that the max pressure of the 470 N.E. is about 2400bar, my Tikkas are capable of 30/06 pressures (3.400bar?).

Because I like my doubles, I also want a DGR gun that handles the same way. Practicing with my lighter guns would then also help accuracy for the heavy one.

My gunsmith says it will cost between $2.000 to $2.700 to make a barrel-set in a DGR caliber, maybe a bit less because he can use a 12/76 shotgun barrel-set I already have.

Knowing O/U doubles are not supposed to be the rigth thing on DGR, I am doing all my hunting with these, and I don't see an elementary drawback in using the O/U setup there also.

My questions:

1) Technically feasable?
2) Is it all about max pressure?
3) What caliber would fit pressure wise? 450NE 470NE 500NE or the new 500/416NE of Krieghoff (on 416 Rigby level!)?

Thanks in advance!

Franz

[This message has been edited by Daydreamer (edited 11-23-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Daydreamer (edited 11-23-2001).]

Daydreamer, what you want to do is feasable, but I think you would be better served by barreling the Tikka (VALMET 412) to either the 450/400 NE 3" , or the 450 NE 3 1/4". The 450 Ne uses a .458 bullet which is as common as dirt, and the selection of bullet types, and weights is endless. The 12 ga barrel blocks are large enough to give plenty of barrel meat around the chambers and the 450 NE is a very low pressure round, and easy to load. The 450/400 3" is a little less easy because of the .411 dia bullets, but they are available as well just not as many places. The 470 case is made on the 500 case, and starts to make the chamber walls a little thin. The 450 NE 3 1/4" would be my choise. I had a Valmet 412 12 ga ext gun with a set of rifle barrels that were origenally 375 Win, but are now 375 JDJ, and it was a shooting dude. Of course the adjustable regulation feature was retained on the barrels from the 375 Win, and once I found a load that shot good groups in both barrels, I re-regulated the barrels for that load, and was off to the bush. If you can find a set of 375 win barrels, this is an option. I did NOT use this rifle on Cape Buffalo, however, you may do what ever suits you!

As you say the O/U isn't the top choise for a DGR, but will do if that is what you want.

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..Mac >>>===(x)===>
also DUGABOY1
DUGABOY DESIGNS
Collector/trader of fine double rifles, and African wildlife art

Cheers MacD37!

I was thinking about the .458 caliber too, and the 450NE 3 1/4" would be the classic joice for this, better SD than a 470, and plenty bullets available.

I'm leaning towards the GS FN 450gr, it will do it all in that combination and only requires 2000 fps minimum vel.

Do you know the max pressure for the 450 NE 3 1/4"?

The 500/416 NE would also be nice, but this won't be a long-range rifle anyway.

Franz

[This message has been edited by Daydreamer (edited 11-26-2001).]

Franz, who in Vienna would undertake such a project?

BTW I had similar ideas and did a lot of posting about it. As it comes more clear to me, that doubles are for close range work, because of technical reasons, and because that�s where two quick shots are advantageous, the double should be the "heavy".

So i�m now leaning more to the .450 NE ( 3 1/4" ), as bullets are plentiful, even cast ones to use on our smaller pigs, and it is a real, proven, big bore.

For Europe I would consider the 9.3x74R still to be tops. If I would visit Africa more that once ( sigh! ) a double in .450 or .470 with a separate set of barrels in 20/76 ( loaded with el cheapo 20/70 ammo ) to use on a pheasant hunt, in fine weather only, would be my idea. Gives me practice, shotgun barrel set is cheaper than second double rifle set, and a justification for that expensive system ...

If it definitely has to be one big bore for Europe and Africa there�s 9.3x74R ( lower limit ), the .375 Flanged and the 450/400 3".

Would be interesting how the recoil of that rifles compares to a .450 or .500/416

Good shooting! H

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aHunter

My Gunsmith in Vienna is Martin Kruschits, on of the good old experienced smithes in Austria. He works hand in hand with the guys from Ferlach. So I trust him a lot.

The Tikka 512S is quite flexible, I have two of them with 7x65R and 9,3x74R, and the 12/76 shotgun barrels.

The 7x65R is capable of 2" at 100 meters with 4 shots and standard Blaser CDP amo.
But the Gun is quit heavy approx. 10 pounds, so this is nothing for stalking.
The 9,3x74R is much lighter, 8 pounds or so.
The barrels are interchangeable, so if something is wrong with on action, switch to the other on and go on.

For Africa I want to try the GSC HV 230gr and the FN 270grn in the 9,3x74R. Should be the right thing up to Eland, even Buff could be taken with the FNs.
I know this is not possible in some countries, the reason for getting an extra barrel with DGR caliber.
Regarding long-range shooting, I think a first shot out to lets say 150 meters with the 450NE should be fine, depends on the rifle if the second will be OK also.

If I could afford it, I would definitely get a Krieghoff in .500/.416NE with a shotgun barrel set in 20/76 - even I didn't had a chance to lay my hands on one so far.

Good shooting! Franz