Deal of the Century - Two Sable for Two Hunters

Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.

What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.

21 January 2011, 08:58

NitroX

quote:
Originally posted by SBT:
Thanks Martin.

Bouna, please list the names of the properties, the directors and the owners.

Yes please, an answer to this is needed.

21 January 2011, 20:09

Larry Sellers

Bouna - A little more info if you would?

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

22 January 2011, 02:08

Nitro Express

My son and I hunted in the Gwayi Conservancy in 2002, on land owned since the 1940's by the Chatham family.

Six weeks after we left the Chathams were arrested, imprisoned, and their land confiscated.

I understand they are now living in the UK.

I could never in good conscience hunt on what was previously someone's land that was seized by the government, no matter how great the deal, nor how "legal" it might be, either in Zimbabwe or under U.S. law.

22 January 2011, 17:49

Saeed

"This is not available anymore and thank you for the PMs, support and candid comments. Apology to those offended, will not happen again"

I think it might be a good idea for you to answer the questions asked, and clear this up.

Because I can assure you that many people will stay away from Bouna Safaris in the future.

What you were offering did not sound right, which might be due to some misunderstanding..

But leaving it hanging like this - and I see that you have edited your signature and removed all the contact details of your company as you posted on your first post - might leave a very sour taste in members mouths.

Temporary website (New one under construction) Bouma Safaris

BOUMA SAFARIS
+27827084169
+27125467179
versterm@telkomsa.net

22 January 2011, 18:20

mho

quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
...I see that you have edited your signature and removed all the contact details of your company as you posted on your first post - might leave a very sour taste in members mouths.
...
BOUMA SAFARIS
+27827084169
+27125467179
versterm@telkomsa.net

Saeed,

There is still a website listed under Bouma's AR public profile:

http://forums.accuratereloadin...profile&u=3201051731

http://boumasafaris.yolasite.com/

Seems to be a South African Company. From the website...

quote:
Contact Us

Theo Verster
Phone:+27827084169
Phone:+27125467179
Email:versterm@telkomsa.net

Francois Scholtz
Phone:+27761103241
Email:fscholtz28@gmail.com

Kevin Brits
Phone:+27828384005
Email:kenmin@vodamail.co.za

208 Kalipie Street
Pretoria North
0182
South Africa

I don't want to be unfair to anybody, but I can't help notice the prevalence of South African operators in what are often shady deals in Zimbabwe in the last decade or so.It seems that the land grab in Zim opened opportunities for operators outside Zim to offer hunting on confiscated lands. At times with problems for the participating hunters (trophy export etc), and certainly ethically questionable when considering the circumstances under which the land was acquired by their current "owners".

- mike

23 January 2011, 01:02

Lhook7

quote:
Originally posted by Bouna Safaris:
2011 BOUMA SAFARIS – ZIMBABWE –

7 DAY SABLE SAFARI TWO TROPHY SABLE 2 HUNTERS 7 Days

RATEs:
2 x 1 Sable Hunt Package @ $15,250

Hunting Dates:
Contact us for dates available

Area: Matetsi or Gwayi

OFFER IS OPEN TO BOTH RIFLE AND BOW HUNTERS

Other Plains Game Available

TROPHY FEES (Plains Game – COMPLETE LIST ON REQUEST)

NOTE: PLAINS GAME AS AVAILABLE AT THE TIME OF SAFARI

Packages Booked includes:
• Services of Professional Hunter, Food and Drinks and Lodging
• Laundry
• Field preparation of trophies; All hunting licences
• All transport to and from Hunting Area

Packages Booked excludes:
• International and domestic flights
• All gratuities for safari staff
Dipping and packing of trophies:
Up to 10 trophies - $800/shipment
Over 10 trophies - $1000/shipment
Over 15 trophies - $1500/shipment

2 percent Government Levy on trophy fees (subject to change without notice)
2 percent Government Levy on Daily Rates.
2 percent Parks Levy on trophy fees

Observer fees

Observer (non Hunter) $275

Terms and conditions:

* 50 percent deposit of any package will secure.
* All Airfares for Client’s Account.
* Balance to be paid in FULL on arrival in camp before the hunt commences (Zimbabwe)
* Animals may not be substituted
* If the hunter does not get an opportunity to shoot a certain animal,
he will be refunded the trophy fee in full (Zimbabwe)
* Wounded animals will be charged in full
* Animals taken outside the package, will be charged as per the
general price list (Available on request)
* Daily rate charged per night on safari
* Extra days may be added as per price lists.
* Excursions can be arranged to visit National Parks, boat Rides,
and canoe safaris, payable separately.
* Dipping and crating done by an independent company.
* Laundry is done daily
* Camouflage is not allowed in Zimbabwe
* Temperatures around 30 - 40 degrees Celsius
* Additional air travel and accommodation is not included
* All deposits, less expenses will be refunded provided the safari is
fully re-booked.
* All payments either in CASH or TRAVELLERS CHEQUES
before commencement of hunt.

Liability:
Every effort is made to ensure the safety of the hunting client, no responsibility is accepted
for any illness, accident or loss. It will be expected of hunting clients to sign an indemnity
form before commencement of the hunt.

Temporary website (New one under construction) Bouma Safaris

Here is the edited version captured for posterity.

23 January 2011, 01:19

Mike_Dettorre

Sure glad nobody jumped to conclusions...

A lot can be learned by the way people respond to questions.

Often more information than whether someone has been charged, tried, and found guilty.

After all John Gotti was charged and tried a lot of times but rarely convicted.

Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.

23 January 2011, 04:54

Oryxhunter1983

quote:
Originally posted by Nitro Express:

I could never in good conscience hunt on what was previously someone's land that was seized by the government, no matter how great the deal, nor how "legal" it might be, either in Zimbabwe or under U.S. law.

Well I hope you dont hunt anywhere in the UNITED STATES...cause there were some people here a long time ago who got their land jacked and put onto reservations if my memory serves me correctly!
haha

23 January 2011, 05:58

Jerry Huffaker

quote:
If the hunter does not get an opportunity to shoot a certain animal,
he will be refunded the trophy fee in full (Zimbabwe)

Does this mean you will be refunded in Zim dollars?

23 January 2011, 09:16

Bouna Safaris

quote:
Originally posted by Jerry Huffaker:
quote:
If the hunter does not get an opportunity to shoot a certain animal,
he will be refunded the trophy fee in full (Zimbabwe)

Does this mean you will be refunded in Zim dollars?

No Sir, US$, that is the currency Zim uses

23 January 2011, 22:14

Matt Graham

quote:
Originally posted by Oryxhunter1983:

Well I hope you dont hunt anywhere in the UNITED STATES...cause there were some people here a long time ago who got their land jacked and put onto reservations if my memory serves me correctly!
haha

Do they still have the titles??

24 January 2011, 05:29

martinbns

quote:
Originally posted by Oryxhunter1983:
quote:
Originally posted by Nitro Express:

I could never in good conscience hunt on what was previously someone's land that was seized by the government, no matter how great the deal, nor how "legal" it might be, either in Zimbabwe or under U.S. law.

Well I hope you dont hunt anywhere in the UNITED STATES...cause there were some people here a long time ago who got their land jacked and put onto reservations if my memory serves me correctly!
haha

I was wondering if anyone else thought of that one.

24 January 2011, 17:08

Bouna Safaris

quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
"This is not available anymore and thank you for the PMs, support and candid comments. Apology to those offended, will not happen again"

I think it might be a good idea for you to answer the questions asked, and clear this up.

Because I can assure you that many people will stay away from Bouna Safaris in the future.

What you were offering did not sound right, which might be due to some misunderstanding..

But leaving it hanging like this - and I see that you have edited your signature and removed all the contact details of your company as you posted on your first post - might leave a very sour taste in members mouths.

Temporary website (New one under construction) Bouma Safaris

BOUMA SAFARIS
+27827084169
+27125467179
versterm@telkomsa.net

Herewith answers and rectification. Not of what you had to say saeed. I can assure you that what we do is legit and I for one will not get anybody into trouble over anything. What I offered is/was legit the only thing is some of the guys cannot handle it that people can sell trophy class animals at these rates, secondly there is/was no misunderstanding.

The only reason for leaving it hanging like this, as you put it, is at the time I did not feel it was necessary to post the names of the property owner and director of the Safari company here. To the contrary believe, we in South Africa are educated and can read and write. I checked the US Banned List, I did research all avenues and list available, checked the JAg list of land allocated to VIPs etc. None of the names appear however we felt that it was easier to stop this bickering was to post the names.

For "changing" the signature no need to get uptight about, as it was proven by one of the members the contact details remained the same.

Safari Company - we have access to:

Blazing Star Safaris - License number 255 (not 225 - my typo) registered with ZTA under category HOP.
Director: Colin Siziba

Property Owner: Ruben Makandla

Thank you for an otherwise good forum, you have a large number of opinionated memmbers but most sounds and act like gentleman, the gentleman I am refering to Bill C and Larry Sellers and the 2 wisemen martinbs and Oryxhunter1983.

24 January 2011, 19:25

Jarrod

quote:
Originally posted by martinbns:
quote:
Originally posted by Oryxhunter1983:
quote:
Originally posted by Nitro Express:

I could never in good conscience hunt on what was previously someone's land that was seized by the government, no matter how great the deal, nor how "legal" it might be, either in Zimbabwe or under U.S. law.

Well I hope you dont hunt anywhere in the UNITED STATES...cause there were some people here a long time ago who got their land jacked and put onto reservations if my memory serves me correctly!
haha

I was wondering if anyone else thought of that one.

Yep

24 January 2011, 19:32

smarterthanu

quote:
Well I hope you dont hunt anywhere in the UNITED STATES...cause there were some people here a long time ago who got their land jacked and put onto reservations if my memory serves me correctly!
haha

Nope. It doesn't.

24 January 2011, 21:28

Aspen Hill Adventures

quote:
Property Owner: Ruben Makandla

Who did Mr. Makandla buy the property from? How long has he owned it?

24 January 2011, 23:29

Bouna Safaris

quote:
Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
quote:
Property Owner: Ruben Makandla

Who did Mr. Makandla buy the property from? How long has he owned it?

Ann,

Will be glad to ask and find out for you.

As I said in a previous post this hunt is not available any longer.

24 January 2011, 23:39

Oryxhunter1983

quote:
Originally posted by smarterthanu:
quote:
Well I hope you dont hunt anywhere in the UNITED STATES...cause there were some people here a long time ago who got their land jacked and put onto reservations if my memory serves me correctly!
haha

Nope. It doesn't.

I'm not following this one....

25 January 2011, 02:44

Buddyboy

quote:
I'm not following this one....

It is not always easy to follow the thinking of someone who has been shown the error of their ways.

Those who would not hunt on a suspect land are free to not do so. That they must attack someone else with no proof to make their point only shows their immaturity.

25 January 2011, 03:49

Muvhimi

Hi

I am just curious - are you BOUMA Safaris or BOUNA safaris? Your post shows both spelling?

25 January 2011, 06:54

jdollar

quote:
Originally posted by Oryxhunter1983:
quote:
Originally posted by Nitro Express:

I could never in good conscience hunt on what was previously someone's land that was seized by the government, no matter how great the deal, nor how "legal" it might be, either in Zimbabwe or under U.S. law.

Well I hope you dont hunt anywhere in the UNITED STATES...cause there were some people here a long time ago who got their land jacked and put onto reservations if my memory serves me correctly!
haha

and now between casino and oil/gas revenue, they are doing better than the rest of the average Americans. karma i guess

25 January 2011, 07:58

Saeed

quote:
Originally posted by Bouna Safaris:
quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
"This is not available anymore and thank you for the PMs, support and candid comments. Apology to those offended, will not happen again"

I think it might be a good idea for you to answer the questions asked, and clear this up.

Because I can assure you that many people will stay away from Bouna Safaris in the future.

What you were offering did not sound right, which might be due to some misunderstanding..

But leaving it hanging like this - and I see that you have edited your signature and removed all the contact details of your company as you posted on your first post - might leave a very sour taste in members mouths.

Temporary website (New one under construction) Bouma Safaris

BOUMA SAFARIS
+27827084169
+27125467179
versterm@telkomsa.net

Herewith answers and rectification. Not of what you had to say saeed. I can assure you that what we do is legit and I for one will not get anybody into trouble over anything. What I offered is/was legit the only thing is some of the guys cannot handle it that people can sell trophy class animals at these rates, secondly there is/was no misunderstanding.

The only reason for leaving it hanging like this, as you put it, is at the time I did not feel it was necessary to post the names of the property owner and director of the Safari company here. To the contrary believe, we in South Africa are educated and can read and write. I checked the US Banned List, I did research all avenues and list available, checked the JAg list of land allocated to VIPs etc. None of the names appear however we felt that it was easier to stop this bickering was to post the names.

For "changing" the signature no need to get uptight about, as it was proven by one of the members the contact details remained the same.

Safari Company - we have access to:

Blazing Star Safaris - License number 255 (not 225 - my typo) registered with ZTA under category HOP.
Director: Colin Siziba

Property Owner: Ruben Makandla

Thank you for an otherwise good forum, you have a large number of opinionated memmbers but most sounds and act like gentleman, the gentleman I am refering to Bill C and Larry Sellers and the 2 wisemen martinbs and Oryxhunter1983.

You certainly did NOT have your contact details in the post I have quoted above.

I made a mistake by pressing the EDIT bottun rather than the QUOTE button, so your post appeared as being posted by me.

You obviously removed your contact details for some reason on that message.

Then you asked me by PM to delete this thread.

Why?

To remove any evidence that there is something wrong being offered here?

25 January 2011, 08:50

Mike_Dettorre

I haven't priced a sable hunt in years...but lets say trophy fees are $4500 each total $9000 that leaves $6250 in daily rates for 7 days for two hunters that means $450/day per hunter for a 2x1 plains game hunt.

Tough for me to imagine that is the "Deal of the Century" but I could be wrong.

Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.

25 January 2011, 14:29

mho

quote:
Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
I haven't priced a sable hunt in years...but lets say trophy fees are $4500 each total $9000 that leaves $6250 in daily rates for 7 days for two hunters that means $450/day per hunter for a 2x1 plains game hunt.

Tough for me to imagine that is the "Deal of the Century" but I could be wrong.

Mike, to be fair to Bouna, the situation regarding sable has actually somewhat changed in Zim.

Before the land grab of Mugabe and his cronies, it was quite common to see sable offered on plains game only hunts in Zim. A lot of these hunts took place on game farms, and these hunts could be had around the prices you cite - or perhaps cheaper, as the trophy fees were modest in those days.

Alas, after the land confiscations the private game farm industry in Zim (with a few exceptions) pretty much ceased to exist. It was still possible to hunt sable in Zim, but most licenses were now offered on concession and Camp Fire land. Sable became a pretty rare commodity, and was largely offered on longer hunts with daily rates around $1K - or higher.

You can always argue with wording such as "deal of a century", but in particular sable from the North West corner of Zim don't come cheaply these days. Together with areas such as Chobe in Botswana, Caprivi in Namibia and parts of Zambia, North West Zim still offers some of the prime sable trophies today.

- mike