in the past couple years many have said the market is "soft" for them: I don't know. Talking about the pre-64 model 70, and more specifically the actions. I'm mostly a user of the factory pre-64s but always seem to have a hunting application in which I'm somewhat looking for another: and just cannot find what I'm looking for at what I think is a reasonable price. The drill is always the same: for example: have looked for many months for a factory .375 "using" rifle: beat up is OK but only gad offers for $2,000.+ rifles: or perhaps a good working .220 Swift standard barrel. Same thing. In the case of a .375, you think perhaps it would be less expensive to re-barrel a .300 H&H, but gosh, even them it's hard to find under maybe $1100. or so plus a $500. re-barrel. Between the custom builders and us users and maybe the horders, don't think it will ever end.

Realistically, the actions you mention were never made in the numbers like 30-06 based actions...Fewer parts, higher prices

If I'm not mistaken, pre-64 Model 70 actions only came in one size. The magazine was tailored to accommodate the Magnum length cartridges. I have seen standard actions altered by judicious milling of the receiver bridge and the magazine well, and they seemed to function just as well as the Magnum actions. The bolt face would have to be altered as well, of course.

Adding one of Duane's bottom metal works of art should obviate any feeding problem.

quote:

Originally posted by xausa:
If I'm not mistaken, pre-64 Model 70 actions only came in one size. The magazine was tailored to accommodate the Magnum length cartridges. I have seen standard actions altered by judicious milling of the receiver bridge and the magazine well, and they seemed to function just as well as the Magnum actions. The bolt face would have to be altered as well, of course.

Adding one of Duane's bottom metal works of art should obviate any feeding problem.

True enough but then you need to add the price of the conversion. I have both a 300 and 375 but not at those prices quoted.

Tom Burgess claimed that the 375 actions were heat treated differently. There DOES appear to be a change in metal "textrure" about half way, which he claimed was the "quench line" for the additional heat treat. I got the feeling he was not delighted with opening up a 30-06 ac tion

I too, have made 375 actions out of 30-06 actions.. could only test with hottest available commercial ammo.

The 375 is not a particularity high pressure round.....but of course, there's always someone who is going to see if it can be MADE to fail

Just passing along information.

Duane,

Did Tom Burgess maintain that the .300 H&H actions were similarly heat treated, or just the .375 H&H ones? I wonder if his claim had to do with greater bolt thrust based on a larger head size cartridge.

Funny that question was on my mind...it SEEMS to me the same applied

quote:

posted January 25, 2019 5:23 AM Hide Post
Duane,

Did Tom Burgess maintain that the .300 H&H actions were similarly heat treated, or just the .375 H&H ones? I wonder if his claim had to do with greater bolt thrust based on a larger head size cartridge.

That wouldn't seem to make sense, the 338 and 264 both were introduced in 1958.

338, 264 are not "long" magnums

Bolt thrust shouldn't be any different. Never mind, action not cut away for standard magnums.

I'm getting old. I can remember when the 264,300,338, 458 win mags were called the "Short Mags"

quote:

Originally posted by setters5:
Bolt thrust shouldn't be any different. Never mind, action not cut away for standard magnums.

Not looking for debate, just reporting the views held by Tom..Take it or leave it

quote:

Originally posted by devere:
...I'm somewhat looking for another: and just cannot find what I'm looking for at what I think is a reasonable price.

Between the custom builders and us users and maybe the horders, don't think it will ever end.

"reasonable price?" We all have choices--you can wait (sometimes for years) until one comes along dirt cheap, or you can pay the going rate and have it now. There sure are a lot of guys who won't buy anything unless they think the price is "reasonable" by their standards, i.e., dirt cheap. That's their choice. I have always thought that a few bucks either way don't make much difference in the long run.

Regarding Pre-64 Model 70 actions, I've dealt with them since before they were discontinued. Over the decades the price of Model 70 actions has steadily increased. Why? Simply because they are so damn good and because there are limited numbers of them. Personally, I've never found a better action. And when I've found them in good condition priced at the going rate I've never regretted buying them.

Will the competition for them ever end? I doubt it.

If they are so darn good, why didn't Winchester continue making them like they did prior to 1964?

quote:

Originally posted by lindy2:
If they are so darn good, why didn't Winchester continue making them like they did prior to 1964?

Simple answer: Because it cost too much to make them the old way. Take a look some time at the Model 70s that came out in 1964-1967 and you will see how inferior they were to the earlier ones and how many changes they made to reduce the cost of manufacturing. None of the changes resulted in a better product, functionally or esthetically.

Buy a new model 70 or a Ruger MKII and have just as good rifle.

Buy them in stainless and have better ones.

problem solved.

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:
Buy a new model 70 or a Ruger MKII and have just as good rifle.

Buy them in stainless and have better ones.

problem solved.

This is a crock of Chit!

Agreed Jim...maybe we both have bad eyesight?

Most newer guns (and M70's) are assembled kits.

Dave

quote:

Agreed Jim...maybe we both have bad eyesight?

No, your eye sight is too good.

Dave

Started to question my eye sight too for a second or two...

Lee

It is most interesting that most of the so called customizing of Mausers is to make them function like an old model 70.

That would be a step backward..The only thing that is changed most often is to go to a horizontal safety. While adequate, still does not provide the engaging surface of the original flag safety.

There's a Pre-64 375 H&H action on gun broker right now starting at $1,250.
If you're ever going to go for it there's your chance at a true magnum instead of a conversion action.

Well Guys there's a pre-64 Model 70 in .300 H & H and a Lyman 2.5 Alaskan 'scope in Holt's Spring 19 March 2019 Sale. Lot 1105.

It was previously listed, but didn't sell. This link is to that earlier listing:

https://auctions.holtsauctione...o=++128073&saletype=

Drilled for a side mount, valued quite a bit less