The Accurate Reloading Forums
The AR15/M16 gas system problems
16 November 2007, 01:41
EdmondThe AR15/M16 gas system problems
and the Rhino system, the Rhino solution.
Walt Langendorfer is probably unknown to most of the shooters. He designed a very good system to overcome the problems generated by the carbon fouling due to direct gas impingement.
Many of my rifles have been converted to his system.
A tribute to an american patriot for his contribution to a great rifle
16 November 2007, 01:42
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:43
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:43
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:43
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:44
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:44
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:44
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:45
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:47
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:49
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:50
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:50
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:51
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:51
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:52
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:52
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:53
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:53
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:56
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:56
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:57
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:57
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:58
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:58
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:59
Edmond
16 November 2007, 01:59
Edmond
16 November 2007, 02:04
EdmondThe last two pictures show two bolts wiped after shooting 1340 rounds of high quality manufactured ammunition. One is the bolt with the gas rings as used in the regular rifle, it is completely gunked with carbon, the second one without gas rings used in a Rhino converted rifle.
16 November 2007, 02:37
DaManEd, I'm a fan of the Rhino and also the Leitner-Wise short stroke piston systems.
Only thing wrong is the price of the conversions!
16 November 2007, 02:49
EdmondMy only regret is not having bought some more.
16 November 2007, 03:28
DaManquote:
Originally posted by Edmond:
My only regret is not having bought some more.
Ed, the Leitner Wise conversions are still available..... are the Rhino units?
PS - Leitner-Wise conversion is $850!
16 November 2007, 10:53
EdmondNo. Walt went out of business a few years ago. Last I heard from him, he had serious health problems when I could get some news from his last employee. He was right too early with his conversion. Retail price range was between 200 and 300 $ according to quantity purchased 20+ years ago.
18 November 2007, 07:22
Frank FisherWhat are a couple of Liberals like you two doing with ASSAULT rifles! I'm gonna tell Hillary!
18 November 2007, 08:03
starmetalEdmond,
I have a friend that had a Rhino setup. No matter what he done, it kept searing the key screws and yes he did have that pin that goes into the key/carrier too.
Ares has a system out that is better then the Rhino.
Joe
18 November 2007, 10:15
DaManstarmetal, the Ares GSR-35 Black Lightning conversion looks interesting. $400 is better than $850!
A couple questions.....
I checked the Ares website....... they say the GSR-35 Black Lightning uses "the standard" forward handguards. The ones shown don't look "standard" to me. They may be "standard" outside dimensions....... but they are constructed differently. Is this because the gas is vented under the front handguards? Do they get pretty hot?
What kind of adhesive do they suggest to hold the guide rod bushing in the upper receiver?
And last question....... what the heck is that little doughnut shaped o-ring (shown next to the extractor spring) do?!!!
TIA!
PS - Another "last" question...... is this conversion only available for the "shorty" (carbine length) AR/M-16s?!!!
18 November 2007, 12:28
EdmondStarmetal, thank you for your input. I think it is very interesting to see what is out now, Rhino is a kind of dinosaur and never had a chance to improve.
One of those Rhino I know had this problem you describe and the reason is unknown, the owner installed it himself and I suspect the key screws were not Mil Spec or equivalent quality. Last I could hear of the very first one I had installed on a Colt SP1 type rifle, it was still working like a swiss clock after 22 years and two barrels.
ARES bolt carrier is milled in one piece, sure no problem.
I have the same questions Da Man has.
Keep them coming, guys. I would like to discover other systems as well.
PS: is the O ring used behind the extractor?
18 November 2007, 20:24
starmetalThat bushing in held in by tension and nobody had has any problems with it. So far the kit is made for the carbine only, so maybe thats why the handguards don't look standard size.
What's neat about this system is you can switch back and forth from it to the DI system.
18 November 2007, 20:26
starmetalquote:
Originally posted by Edmond:
Starmetal, thank you for your input. I think it is very interesting to see what is out now, Rhino is a kind of dinosaur and never had a chance to improve.
One of those Rhino I know had this problem you describe and the reason is unknown, the owner installed it himself and I suspect the key screws were not Mil Spec or equivalent quality. Last I could hear of the very first one I had installed on a Colt SP1 type rifle, it was still working like a swiss clock after 22 years and two barrels.
ARES bolt carrier is milled in one piece, sure no problem.
I have the same questions Da Man has.
Keep them coming, guys. I would like to discover other systems as well.
Edmond,
I suspect the Rhino system would work even better with Ares carrier being the key is integral with the carrier. Probably would have to modify the rod length then, but would be a better system.
PS: is the O ring used behind the extractor?
Yes the O ring is used on the extractor to give it more force.
18 November 2007, 21:19
EdmondThe attachment to the front sight assy is the weak point, that is probably the reason there is one for carbine only. A longer rod for the rifle size barrel would have serious problems. But I see a very simple modification to make it better for a longer rod.
Btw, since there is a bushing, the diameter of the rod must be really small.
