Ok I’d line to reblack my barrels. The engraving is very faint and was wondering if I should have a local Smith do the job and maybe mess up engraving or send it out to a dedicated double gun person? Suggestions? Thanks

I would say it depends a bit on the value/provenance of the gun. For example, I wouldn't worry much about a Merkel or Sabatti, but if it were an English sidelock, I wouldn't want it mucked up and would send to a specialist.

quote:

Originally posted by swoobie:
I would say it depends a bit on the value/provenance of the gun. For example, I wouldn't worry much about a Merkel or Sabatti, but if it were an English sidelock, I wouldn't want it mucked up and would send to a specialist.

………………….Why in the world would you even mention the MERKEL in the same sentence with a SABATI?????????

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by swoobie:
I would say it depends a bit on the value/provenance of the gun. For example, I wouldn't worry much about a Merkel or Sabatti, but if it were an English sidelock, I wouldn't want it mucked up and would send to a specialist.

………………….Why in the world would you even mention the MERKEL in the same sentence with a SABATI?????????

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

Why in the world would you even mention Merkel
AND Sabatti in the same sentence with English?
Just wonderin'
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Ok I’d line to reblack my barrels. The engraving is very faint and was wondering if I should have a local Smith do the job and maybe mess up engraving or send it out to a dedicated double gun person? Suggestions? Thanks

Have a good 'smith polish the barrels, then send to a good engraver to take up the lettering and numbers if they are faint, then do the rust bluing.
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas?
Have a good 'smith polish the barrels, then send to a good engraver to take up the lettering and nubmers is they are faint, then do the rust bluing.
Cal

What Cal said!

I have personal experience with:
Steve Bertram (ACGG) www.bertramandco.com
JJ Perodeaux jjperodeau.com

I now go with Steve Bertram because he is here in Colorado, and he has a personal affinity to British rifles and shotguns. He will do them right.
He does the correct job of HAND POLISH (no buffing wheels) and rust blue/reblack. Steve has a very good engraver that can pick up the engraving at a quite reasonable time line and will not break the bank.

- Mike

Ok thanks for the reply’s. I’ll inquire around. Trying to decide how much I want to put in it it’s a 98 year old english gun

It took 98 years to get the the way it is now, it’ll take two weeks to undo it all.

Thanks for the recommendation Mike. I will admit it, I do have a personal bias toward Limey guns and rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by swoobie:
I would say it depends a bit on the value/provenance of the gun. For example, I wouldn't worry much about a Merkel or Sabatti, but if it were an English sidelock, I wouldn't want it mucked up and would send to a specialist.

………………….Why in the world would you even mention the MERKEL in the same sentence with a SABATI?????????

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

Why in the world would you even mention Merkel
AND Sabatti in the same sentence with English?
Just wonderin'
Cal

Both Mack and Cal are correct.


Merkel and Sabatti do not belong in the same class of comparison.

And neither does Merkel and the fine English guns.

Three different classes of quality.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

Merkel and Sabatti do not belong in the same class of comparison.

And neither does Merkel and the fine English guns.

Three different classes of quality.

Sabatti: ....it can double as a jack handle!

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by swoobie:
I would say it depends a bit on the value/provenance of the gun. For example, I wouldn't worry much about a Merkel or Sabatti, but if it were an English sidelock, I wouldn't want it mucked up and would send to a specialist.

………………….Why in the world would you even mention the MERKEL in the same sentence with a SABATI?????????

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''

Why in the world would you even mention Merkel
AND Sabatti in the same sentence with English?
Just wonderin'
Cal

Both Mack and Cal are correct.


Merkel and Sabatti do not belong in the same class of comparison.

And neither does Merkel and the fine English guns.

Three different classes of quality.

I feel a bit like we're all in agreement on it, so bear with me. OP asked if he should have a local smith touch up lettering or send to a professional. He did not provide specifics for his gun. My response was - if you've got an inexpensive gun (ie Merkel or Sabatti) you're not likely to hurt the value too much with a local smith. BUT if you've got an English double, then please use an expert...

What about that statement is causing angst?

There is no angst.
Just banter all in fun from those who like vintage Uk doubles over the common and low priced stuff. No offense should be taken.
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:
There is no angst.
Just banter all in fun from those who like vintage Uk doubles over the common and low priced stuff. No offense should be taken.
Cal

Thanks Cal, was hoping that I hadn't inadvertently stepped in it.

Swoobie, no problems......all in fun bashing on poor Sabatti because of their appallingly bad decision to regulate by grinding the rifling at the muzzle. At least in the case of my “post Cabela’s” 9.3x74 they are a decent workmanlike product tho the brand has a permanent stain on its name.

As for Merkel, not a thing wrong with them as a higher price point “entry” or hunting double and way nicer than a Sabatti (aside from some reports of doubling in the .470 and .500 chambering). The modern ones just are not yet what one would consider candidates for meticulous restoration.

- Mike

quote:

Originally posted by Redstone:
Swoobie, no problems......all in fun bashing on poor Sabatti because of their appallingly bad decision to regulate by grinding the rifling at the muzzle. At least in the case of my “post Cabela’s” 9.3x74 they are a decent workmanlike product tho the brand has a permanent stain on its name.

As for Merkel, not a thing wrong with them as a higher price point “entry” or hunting double and way nicer than a Sabatti (aside from some reports of doubling in the .470 and .500 chambering). The modern ones just are not yet what one would consider candidates for meticulous restoration.

- Mike

This exactly.

Any details? Don’t keep us in suspense

Well it’s not a merkel or a sabatti LOL. One interesting comment that seemed to imply to leave it alone. That is another option. The recoil pad is in poor shape and the finish on barrels is mostly gone from too much time in India. It’s missing the rear hook mount and a hole in stock where it should be. Other than that mechanically it’s in fine shape. Really a solid workhorse. Not a top tier but saw the sister gun one number remover go for what I thought was a large sum of money (for me) so I thought maybe it would be a good investment to put some coin into it. I could hunt with it right now but this is more of a longer term deal. Sending it away for a year sounds U.N. appetizing as well. Just looking for suggestions. Having it professionally done by an expert would be the best way to go which is what I probably already knew.

Also are there any 98 year old merkel or sabattis?

I can have that engraving re-cut and the barrels blued in 6-8 weeks. No problem to make a new sling stud and fit a fresh recoil pad in the same time frame. Anyone who takes a year for such a small jobs needs to manage the work flow in the shop better.

No 98 year old Sabattis but some 98 year old Merkels.

quote:

..... comment that seemed to imply to leave it alone. That is another option. The recoil pad is in poor shape and the finish on barrels is mostly gone from too much time in India. It’s missing the rear hook mount and a hole in stock where it should be. .........
.....Having it professionally done by an expert would be the best way to go which is what I probably already knew.

It is noted that many higher end British shotguns and rifles were sent back to the makers after a season or two to have the guns cleaned, inspected and refreshed. As in re-black/brown the barrels and refresh the stock finish and checkering.
This makes a much better looking gun, and if well done does not hurt the resale value.
I would go for it.
-Mike

Before 1920s an engraver was just an average craftsman on standard low wages. Today a good engraver is an artist. $$$$$

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:
Before 1920s an engraver was just an average craftsman on standard low wages. Today a good engraver is an artist. $$$$$

Some are, others work for the trade still and do simple restoration work reasonably. I think the two guys I use are very affordable and the quality is superb.

I would get it refinished. As Redstone mentioned, many guns and rifles were returned for refurbishment. Well used guns in Britain may have been done yearly.

I think it was a Purdey article in the Double Gun journal where the Purdey person said there was not a necessity for it to be sent back to the OEM, and I am sure many weren’t.

Happy hunting with it.

Glad to hear about that timeframe. I’ll get in touch I might just send it in and have you decide if engraving needs recut. In any case the hook mount and recoil pad will be a must. What about bigger front sight? The one it has is tiny and the leafs out to 400 yards very optimistic. Disabling the auto safety might be an option as well. As you are in Colorado I might drop it off depending. Sounds like the way to go thanks!

quote:

Originally posted by skb:
I can have that engraving re-cut and the barrels blued in 6-8 weeks. No problem to make a new sling stud and fit a fresh recoil pad in the same time frame. Anyone who takes a year for such a small jobs needs to manage the work flow in the shop better.

No 98 year old Sabattis but some 98 year old Merkels.

I can do all of the above. You do have to be careful with a larger bead as it can change POI.

Steve

Yes understood. It shoots high for me so may solve that problem but that’s lower on the list

In the final analyses, any double rifle is worthy of improvement by cleaning it up to make it worth owning. I have English, Italian, even one made in Japan, and German double rifles and sensible sprucing up is worthwhile.
However regardless of make or country of a double rifle they are still double rifles, and are unique in the hunting world, and if can be put back into working and saving order, then that is the choice only the owner can decide.

However there are very few smiths who are qualified to work on any double rifle, regardless of make!

Take no offence, no matter the make you own, because if they have two barrels and work properly, you have a unique hunting rifle, be proud you own it, and let others be proud of this choice as well!

This thread is not named English, or Italian, or Japanese, It is the DOUBLE RIFLES forum, and all makes are welcome!


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