6.5/284 vs 6.5/06

26 January 2012, 21:58

John S

6.5/284 vs 6.5/06

Thinking of putting together a rifle in one of these and would like some feedback on either or both. This will be mainly used for target and some light duty p'dog shooting as well as the occasional deer or antelope hunt. Barrel life, accuracy potential, and optimum barrel length all need to be considered. Brass cost isn't a big issue but it's life expectancy is. Any comments appreciated.

26 January 2012, 22:16

ramrod340

Performance wise flip a coin. Using a long or short action? The 6.5x284 brass will run about $1 each. 6.5-06 with headstamp more. 25-06, 270 etc will be cheaper.

As to life. Some say the less tapered 284 would give you more life. I've never seen enough to make a difference.

Barrel life, basic same charge of same burn rate powders can't see the barrel life as much different.

I had issues with a 284 wanting to always slip over the rim. Took a while to work that out.

Some say the 6.5-284 is more accurate. I could not see a major difference but I only have built and shot 1 6.5-284.

To me your action will make your decision.

27 January 2012, 00:44

D Humbarger

Some very good data to read.

6.5x284

27 January 2012, 04:49

SR4759

The 6.5-06 will feed smoother all things being equal. I think the .284 case will be history before long. Why bother with it?

27 January 2012, 07:46

tom holland

Well there is two 6.5x284. I had 6.5x284 Norma build which is the one that won most LR(1000yd) matches and the OAL 3.310".

Mine was set up for the 140/142gr VLD bullets and build by Mike Bryant.

Just about everyone making 6.5x284 brass from Lapua to Nolser and any good gunsmith know how to make one feed with no problems.

I'm not sure why the LR shooter picked the 284 case over the 06 case. I'm sure it had to do with the combination of the case/bullet/accuracy level it gave in a LR 1000yd match rifle.

If you look now the 284 in the f-class is winning and it's good case.

I really cann't answer anything about the 6.5x06 as I never considered having one build.

You might do better getting on the LR hunting site or 6br sites as they have guys shooting both and they can give you better information.

27 January 2012, 08:38

John S

Thanks for all the replies. I've talked to a couple of 'smiths that build long range target and hunting rifles and both had nothing but praise for the 6.5/284.

27 January 2012, 13:27

mho

... and you can get correctly head-stamped brass of great quality - e.g. Lapua - for the 6.5-284...

- mike

27 January 2012, 16:17

seafire/B17G

I've tested both of them side by side, 6 of one, half dozen of the other...

if you desire the maximum velocity and still have fairly good throat life?

consider using a 280 AI case...more capacity and better case life, all the benefits of the Ackley shoulder..

for my long range gun after testing a batch of different 6.5 mm guns loaned to me by friends... I ended up building a 6.5 x 57... on a long action..long throated... 28 inch barrel on it..

gave the same velocity as the other chamberings, much less powder ( 20%)...

if it didn't work out, I could always easily rechamber to the bigger cases...was no need to in the end..

only case that did show an increase in velocity was the 280AI case...

I chose the '6.5 x 57' as actually it was easier to find brass for it, than the 284 case.. and cheaper than the 6.5 x 55 brass..

just neck up 257 Roberts or 6mm Rem brass, or neck down 7 x 57 brass..

28 January 2012, 05:02

Barstooler

I have/had a 6.5-06 and loved it. A friend of mine built a 6.5-284 into an F Class type rifle and he loves it.

The "have/had" indicates that I spent 7 years building a sporterized 1903A4 Springfield initially into a 6.5-06. Started with rebarrel back in 2003 by a gunsmith in Texas. Finished it last year after modifying it with milled steel bottom metal, timney trigger, new scope, and built the stock myself. By the time I got it shooting, I discovdered that it shot very well, but that the chamber had s slight flaw in it probably caused by a bad reamer -- left a little "bump" in the fired case -- and the gunsmith had died leaving me little recourse to take it back to him. The fired brass resized OK but I defenitely did not like that bump.

Took it to a new gun smith who said I could either cut some off the back of the barrel and rechamber, or just clean the chamber out by going to 6.5-06 AI. Decided on the latter and should get the rifle back next month to start load development.

I think you can do well with either the 6.5-06 or the 6.5-284. With US companies chambering the 6.5-284 and bost Norma and Nosler making brass for it, I predict it will be around for quite a while since it also dominates 1000 yard competition with the benchrest crowd. Doubt if the 6.5-06 will ever attain that type of popularity, but if you want a 6.5-06 it is easy to make brass out of 25-06 (neck up) or 270 Win (neck down and trim). The appeal of the 6.5-06 is that it is reminisint of the the old 256 Newton (which I also own but wanted to retire by building my 6.5-06). Either one will do the job you want it for.

Barstooler

28 January 2012, 05:23

bartsche

quote:
Originally posted by Barstooler:
I have/had a 6.5-06 and loved it. A friend of mine built a 6.5-284 into an F Class type rifle and he loves it.

The "have/had" indicates that I spent 7 years building a sporterized 1903A4 Springfield initially into a 6.5-06. Started with rebarrel back in 2003 by a gunsmith in Texas. Finished it last year after modifying it with milled steel bottom metal, timney trigger, new scope, and built the stock myself. By the time I got it shooting, I discovdered that it shot very well, but that the chamber had s slight flaw in it probably caused by a bad reamer -- left a little "bump" in the fired case -- and the gunsmith had died leaving me little recourse to take it back to him. The fired brass resized OK but I defenitely did not like that bump.

Took it to a new gun smith who said I could either cut some off the back of the barrel and rechamber, or just clean the chamber out by going to 6.5-06 AI. Decided on the latter and should get the rifle back next month to start load development.

I think you can do well with either the 6.5-06 or the 6.5-284. With US companies chambering the 6.5-284 and bost Norma and Nosler making brass for it, I predict it will be around for quite a while since it also dominates 1000 yard competition with the benchrest crowd. Doubt if the 6.5-06 will ever attain that type of popularity, but if you want a 6.5-06 it is easy to make brass out of 25-06 (neck up) or 270 Win (neck down and trim). The appeal of the 6.5-06 is that it is reminisint of the the old 256 Newton (which I also own but wanted to retire by building my 6.5-06). Either one will do the job you want it for.

Barstooler

X 2

roger

28 January 2012, 05:52

MileHighShooter

quote:
Originally posted by SR4759:
The 6.5-06 will feed smoother all things being equal. I think the .284 case will be history before long. Why bother with it?

HAHA. Good one, that is a good one. Lets see....the 6.5-284 used to be a very popular wildcat, and it is now being chambered as a factory round, with proper headstamped brass from several manufacturers, including Hornady. If the 284 case was going to be "history" it would have happened by now. No way its going anywhere anytime soon. .284 WINCHESTER brass? Sure, maybe, but 6.5-284 brass? Nah, I mean if its become popular enough for Savage to chamber what, 4 models, its going to stick around a bit.

Feeding is such a moot point in certain platforms it doesn't even begin to value merit for discussion. For a target and light p-dog rig, its going to be fed singly, feeding has nothing to do with it.

They were BOTH wildcats, one became a factory cartridge adopted by several manufacturers, the other will be hooked up to life support forever due to being branded an A-Square cartridge.

I'd go with the 6.5-284

28 January 2012, 22:32

Jerry Eden

You know it really cracks me up how Wild Catters all of a sudden worry about "Head Stamp". My attitude is who cares. Oh but when we look for an advantage, even if it is minute, I guess we have to use it.

For a hunting rig the 6.5-06 on any number of long actions is just as slick as can be, and if that's what you re looking for, a slick hunting rig go with the 6.5-06.

As Barstooler did, I built mine on a 1903 Action, can't ask for anymore IMO. And if you look at my little ditty below my name, you'll see I have spent some time with the 6.5-06

Jerry

29 January 2012, 02:09

gumboot458

6.5/06 A I. Would be my choice .

29 January 2012, 22:27

larrys

I have both a 6.5-06AI and a 6.5-284, among my 6.5s and if I had it to do again I would skip the AI and go with the regular 6.5-06. Of the two in question, since they are both most appropriate in long actions, then take your pick. Personally, I take more of a liking to the 6.5-284. I refuse to pay $1 per case, so I just neck down standard Winchester cases and get along just fine.

In reality I like my 264 WM better than either.

29 January 2012, 23:08

SR4759

quote:
Originally posted by MileHighShooter:
quote:
Originally posted by SR4759:
The 6.5-06 will feed smoother all things being equal. I think the .284 case will be history before long. Why bother with it?

HAHA. Good one, that is a good one. Lets see....the 6.5-284 used to be a very popular wildcat, and it is now being chambered as a factory round, with proper headstamped brass from several manufacturers, including Hornady. If the 284 case was going to be "history" it would have happened by now. No way its going anywhere anytime soon. .284 WINCHESTER brass? Sure, maybe, but 6.5-284 brass? Nah, I mean if its become popular enough for Savage to chamber what, 4 models, its going to stick around a bit.

Feeding is such a moot point in certain platforms it doesn't even begin to value merit for discussion. For a target and light p-dog rig, its going to be fed singly, feeding has nothing to do with it.

They were BOTH wildcats, one became a factory cartridge adopted by several manufacturers, the other will be hooked up to life support forever due to being branded an A-Square cartridge.

I'd go with the 6.5-284

Don't hold your breath. I think the 6.5X284 rebated rim case will die like so many other fads. It is not a hunter's round and that is the market that keeps a case in production.

30 January 2012, 06:10

WESR

quote:
Originally posted by SR4759:
The 6.5-06 will feed smoother all things being equal. I think the .284 case will be history before long. Why bother with it?

Are you being serious? People have probably been predicting the demise of the .284 Win case since its introduction in 1963. That is almost 50 years of production! I would just about guarantee that there have ALREADY been more 6.5-.284s made than there will ever by 6.5-06s made.

Will the case hang around as long as the .45-70? Likely not. I doubt any of us alive now will ever have to worry about finding brass though.

Wes

30 January 2012, 20:13

Stonecreek

If you already have an action which you intend to use, then that will (or may) dictate the better choice.

Clearly, if your action is something less than the "standard" .30-06-length action (magazine about 3.35"), then you will want the shorter 6.5/284 -- but be advised that it can work, but doesn't work well, in a 2.8" magazine for a .308/.243. It needs something like the magazine for the WSM series at 3-3.1".

If you have a "standard" action, the either cartridge is a viable choice. If your primary use is more game hunting than target shooting I would suggest that since you will have one more round of magazine capacity with the more slender 6.5-06 that you consider it first.

31 January 2012, 05:18

John S

Thanks for all the replies! I've decided on the 6.5x284, just like the short/fat concept and I already have a lot of rifles chambered to the '06 based case, so something different will be interesting!
Now that I have that decided, what barrel length and contour will be my next decisions. Likely go 24" or at most 26" in a #4 contour, with fluting a real possibility as I like the look and reducing the weight doesn't hurt. Brand wise, will just have to see who has something in stock or whose wait time is the shortest. I've had great luck with Krieger and Bartlein, and a friend has two of these made up with Lilja tubes.

31 January 2012, 05:41

TX Nimrod

quote:
I'm not sure why the LR shooter picked the 284 case over the 06 case.

The same reason the .308 performs better at long range than the .30-06 does, or the .300 Win Mag gives smaller groups than the .300 H&H does. The shorter powder columns gives less extreme spread of muzzle velocities, and this matters a lot at 1000 yards. For normal hunting ranges, their performance is virtually identical. Of course, knowing that they were shot with an obsolete rebated rim case will reduce the effectiveness of the 6.5-.284 on game.

(Oh wait, most of the modern cartridges introduced in the past 14 years have rebated rims. Maybe the .284 isn't so obsolete afterall.)

.

31 January 2012, 08:07

bartsche

[QUOTE]Originally posted by TX Nimrod:
"The same reason the .308 performs better at long range than the .30-06 does,"

Does anyone besides me find this hard to believe??

roger

31 January 2012, 09:30

Dr. Lou

6.5-284 is a cool round, but the 6.5-06 is much more practical and will get you to the same place.

31 January 2012, 15:47

mho

quote:
Originally posted by John S:
...#4 contour
...I've had great luck with Krieger and Bartlein, and a friend has two of these made up with Lilja tubes.

Sounds like you have good taste!

- mike

31 January 2012, 17:35

John S

Well, I give the credit for using these barrels to the 'smith who buit the rifles...That's what he uses so that's what I got!

31 January 2012, 22:29

Stonecreek

quote:
Originally posted by bartsche:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by TX Nimrod:
"The same reason the .308 performs better at long range than the .30-06 does,"

Does anyone besides me find this hard to believe?? roger

Yes, El Guapo. Such statements emminate from the keyboards of the uninformed or misinformed.

01 February 2012, 00:24

larrys

John, mine has worn both a MRC barrel and now a Shilen. I would go with any of the barrel makers you suggest and you will be fine. I have a 264WM with a Lilja and it is great. But then again are my 6.5-06AI and 6.5x55 with Douglas barrels. As to length, I like 24" since I do not shoot long range matches. The 6.5-284 is the only 6.5 barrel I have that is a 1:8 twist. The others are 1:9.

01 February 2012, 04:10

John S

Larry,
Since this project began I have had one hurdle after another to clear. First was determining which cartridge to use, then it was on to the action, barrel, stock, etc. It seems that designing and planning what to build is much easier than coming up with the components to build it! I got lucky and found an action w/o a wait, but the barrel and stock are proving to be a real problem in getting, unless I want to wait 4 to 6 months. My 'smith has a line on a Bartlein barrel with a 1x8.5 twist but it's in a varminter contour so he is going to contact Bartlein and see how long and how much to recontour it to our specs...will likely be our only route short of ordering the barrel directly and then waiting for 6 months. Stocks are another story!

01 February 2012, 20:54

larrys

John, I hear you! I got lucky and Jim Kobe happened to have the barrel I needed in stock, or I would have waited months. The stock I did myself, so I still waited months.

13 February 2012, 00:58

Tapper2

quote:
Originally posted by John S:
I got lucky and found an action w/o a wait, but the barrel and stock are proving to be a real problem in getting, unless I want to wait 4 to 6 months. My 'smith has a line on a Bartlein barrel with a 1x8.5 twist but it's in a varminter contour so he is going to contact Bartlein and see how long and how much to recontour it to our specs...will likely be our only route short of ordering the barrel directly and then waiting for 6 months. Stocks are another story!

John, have you tried Midwayusa.com? They have 16 .264 barrels available. Mostly Shilen and some Krieger, but all good barrels. I'm sure they will have what you want....Tom

22 February 2012, 08:14

John S

No, I didn't think to check Midway but I got the Bartlein barrel I mentioned earlier. It's already on it's way back after being recontoured.

23 February 2012, 23:06

Clem

Both rounds seem nearly identical in performance. It probably comes down to tossing a coin. Lapua, Nosler, Hornady and Norma make excellent 6.5-284 brass. Only A-square, as far as I am aware, makes 6.5-06 brass - if having the head stamp match the chamber matters. You can load the 6.5-06 very cheaply by renecking the 06 based cases up or down as appropriate.

I have a Cooper JGR chambered for 6.5-284 that is quite spectacular.