The Accurate Reloading Forums
35-7.62X54R
28 January 2004, 13:59
C.S. Justice35-7.62X54R
I had a 26" Douglas #4 .358 barrel left over from another project I never got around to and a Siamese Mauser action.....according to a article in Handloader 7.62X54R brass is one of the three used to make 8X52 brass for the Siamese Mauser.
So I had a 35-7.62X54R reamer made.... rifle is almost finished.... I've bought a box of 225 gr. Sierra SBT's and a 100 Laupa 7.62X53 brass.... any ideas on where to start as far as loads??
28 January 2004, 14:06
jeffeossoWOW!!!
now THAT is a cool idea for a nagent!!
let's compare cases for suggested loads
the 30-06 has ~68 grains
the 35 whelen has bout 70.50
the 7.62x54r, also called x53
has 64
(so does the 7.62x53 fin)
I would GUESS that it would be about 65.5 grains fired in 35.
start with the BOTTOM 35 whelan loads, reduced 15% ??
jeffe
28 January 2004, 14:19
C.S. Justicejeffeosso,
Thanks, that is is exactly what I needed was something to compare to...... I put a lot of time and research into getting the right case to start with .... never thought a lot about a load until now. CSJ
28 January 2004, 15:58
jeffeossosure thing, you're welcome
Email me a request and a pressure ceiling.. i'll profile it for you in quickload.
i'll need barrel length and bullet.
you should be able to BEAT the 358 win, and then match the federal 35 whelen load (it's light, to me)
a 225 at 2500 is wicked on game, let me tell ya
don't loose the reamer
jeffe
29 January 2004, 04:12
<eldeguello>Interesting experiment. I think the Russians have a 9mm on this case.
(The "Medved") a brown-bear load.....
Let us know how it works out for you.
29 January 2004, 04:30
fish280the finns are the kings of jacking the 7.62x53R up and down. one of the most popular was an 8mmx53r, if i remember correctly. i have two sporterized m44s (one's polish and the other hungarian). both very good shooters with tweaked triggers. i'm thinking maybe lapua's web site has loads for some of the 7.62-based wildcats.
29 January 2004, 08:32
carcano91Right, Eldeguello. The Russian 9x53R, loaded by LVE, is identical to the Fnnish 9,3x53R, loaded by Sako (same bullet diameter, slightly different bullet weight). It is used in bolt-action rifles, self-loaders (rather popular in russia), and combined guns.
Regards,
Carcano
29 January 2004, 17:06
C.S. JusticeWhen I called about ordering the reamer they thought it was a interesting project also...... they sent me an E-mail later just to be sure about my "oddball" reamer.
Where can I find some load data for the 9X53R.... I thought I had an orginal idea, thanks all CSJ.
30 January 2004, 06:59
NordicUse the starting load in vihtavuori manual for 7,62*53r and work up!
30 January 2004, 09:06
C.S. JusticeNordic,
I downloaded the Vihtavuori manual and I think I'll cross reference burn rates with some of the powders I have on hand and go from there, thanks CSJ
30 January 2004, 23:35
jpbIf you write Vihtavuori via their website, with details of case capacity, etc. I'll bet they would send you some starting loads.
I've done this for "odd" loads in standard cartridges (e.g. 125gr pistol bullets in my .358 Norma Magnum!). They are very obliging! (and so is Norma, but they are slower to reply).
Vihtavuori's website and
Norma's web page HTH
jpb
31 January 2004, 16:54
C.S. Justicejpb, thanks, I'll give them a try. CSJ
01 February 2004, 08:35
carcano91Quote:
Use the starting load in vihtavuori manual for 7,62*53r and work up!
As jpb wrote, don't.
Rather use the 9,3x53 R starting load in the Vihtavuori manual, it's much closer. The velocity specs of the Russian sister cartridge (which has a lighter bullet) can be found on LVE Novosibirsk's ammo website, and Sako's factory velocities are also indicated on their website.
Carcano
01 February 2004, 13:51
C.S. Justicecarcano91,
I checked the Vihtavuori Manual I downloaded..... no listing for the 9.3X53R....... maybe the listings are different for US manuals??? Haven't had any luck finding the LVE site. Thanks, CSJ
01 February 2004, 18:39
hornetguyhow funny is this??? I was sitting here tonight, looking over one of my loading manuals, and thought to myself that a 35 caliber "improved" case on the 7.62x54 would have to be quite a bit better than the 358 win.... and here you are already talking about it.... it would make a great "thumper" truck gun, using cheap Mosin Nagants... I have a Romanian that could be quickly done... I wonder if you could fireform brass by just firing regular 7.62x54 loads in it.....
01 February 2004, 20:14
carcano91Quote:
carcano91,
I checked the Vihtavuori Manual I downloaded..... no listing for the 9.3X53R....... maybe the listings are different for US manuals???
Here is the listed load (Manual, 3rd edition, p. 243):
255 gr Sako SP, COL 2.795, Propellant N 140, maximum load is 51,1 gr, at 2300 fps (710 m/s) at maximal allowed pressure (340 MPa / 49,300 psi).
The twist of the test barrel was 1 in 14".
Quote:
Haven't had any luck finding the LVE site. Thanks, CSJ
I will look up the site; it is temporarily not accessible (used to be www.lveplant.com ). They load a FMJ and a SP bullet, both with 232 gr weight. V-25 is 655 m/s.
Here are some ballistics from another source:
http://faq.guns.ru/rounds/hunting.html
Carcano
02 February 2004, 03:23
C.S. Justicehornetguy,
I formed my cases by running them just far enough in a 35-348 sizing die (Siamese project also) to expand the necks then loaded my 225 gr. SBT's ..... only loaded three (no powder) to check feeding. I think any .358 neck sizing die should work for this.....
After I have some fire-formed brass I plan on sending three to Lee and have a set of collet dies made.... 50 bucks, if I remember right....I'll post range results when I finish load development. CSJ
02 February 2004, 03:32
C.S. Justicecarcano91,
Thank you very much, the Siamese Mauser is a very strong action... should easily handle the pressures of the Sako load..... also gives me a good starting point if I want to work up a 250gr. load. CSJ
02 February 2004, 04:44
SabotFor future reference, this case appears to have a lot of room for improvement....at least 10% without moving the shoulder.
02 February 2004, 08:56
C.S. JusticeSabot,
I had considered this before I had the reamer made, but I thought I may have feeding problems with an improved case..... I have zero experience with improved cases, just based on what I have read Mauser type actions don't do well with them. CSJ
02 February 2004, 19:20
hornetguyCS... I'll be looking forward to hearing about your project.. although if I did rechamber my Nagant, I would HAVE to restock the thing... it's pretty brutal even with the heavy bullet loads in the "standard" caliber... 250gr 358's might just make me use bad language when shooting them....
03 February 2004, 00:53
C.S. Justicehornetguy, surely not....... what you need to do is get a #2 contour barrel about 18" long and stick in one of them cheap plastic sporter stocks...... ought to get more bang for your buck... CSJ
03 February 2004, 08:35
Paul HThe only problem with using the Nagant as a basis is, the magazine would require major re-work to accept either the larger dia bullet, or an improved case. That is the one major hickup against using the Nagant actions as basis for a variety of rimmed rounds. I'd picked one up with the intent of making a 480 Ruger carbine, but after looking at the magazine, scrapped the idea.
03 February 2004, 10:16
hornetguyI'll have to look at the Nagant when I get home tonight... I wonder if the receiver rails are far enough apart, or would they have to be relieved as well? This might be prohibitively complicated... sort of negate the whole "cheap and easy" concept... plus, I've already got a 35 Whelen.... this just sounded like a fun project..
21 February 2004, 14:11
747I'am new at this but when I look in the nagant magazine it looks like it would have room to neck up to 35 caliber it should only need 20 thousands on each side , they look pretty sloppy to begin with .