309 JDJ at Encore pressures

05 July 2003, 04:26

Maybe I should call it 308AIX444. Seems to me as if this would be the logicial step between a 308 and a 300 Win Mag, in a 15 inch Encore. I don't find any data at the 50-55 K pressure levels. Everything I find is at the Contender level, 40K.

Glad to see the mudslinging has dried up. My 15 inch VV chambered by Bellm 7-08X444 is awsume, MOA with about everything I feed it.

05 July 2003, 04:35

Magnum Mike

quote:
Originally posted by bsekf:
Maybe I should call it 308AIX444. Seems to me as if this would be the logicial step between a 308 and a 300 Win Mag, in a 15 inch Encore. I don't find any data at the 50-55 K pressure levels. Everything I find is at the Contender level, 40K.

I wonder how the brass would hold up to those pressures. The round was developed for the 1895 so pressures are a lil low. In an encore or similar strength pistol, you could run the pressures up. Brass life may be short though....

05 July 2003, 04:36

Jules

If I were looking for something between the 308 and 300mag I would go for a 30/06 or a 30/06imp.

05 July 2003, 04:43

Magnum Mike

quote:
Originally posted by Jules:
If I were looking for something between the 308 and 300mag I would go for a 30/06 or a 30/06imp.

With data here on the 300 Win Mag, 300 Rum, i am REAL curious how the 30-06imp compares in a 15-16" barrel. I gotta imagine that it would probably be the most effecient. The rimmed case of the 30x444AI would still be a major benefit in a encore or competitor though....

05 July 2003, 05:55

T/C Nut

OH hell I think a 300 H&H would be the best [Big Grin]

06 July 2003, 04:04

bsekf

I think the 300 Win Mag is overkill in a 15 inch barrel. Have been going round and round with PJ on GB board about it. Even the 30-06 is longer than 308X444AI, but about the same capacity. I want to leave the combustion volume of the barrel as large as possible.

Since the 309JDJ is really a "blown out" 308 AI, I figured sombody must have tried it in an Encore. I guess not.

TC Nut, be a man and go for a 375 H&H, boy I bet that would smart! [Big Grin]

06 July 2003, 04:06

Magnum Mike

That is one of the reasons that i created the tables at the yahoo group. We can the directly compare these various 30 calibers in similar lengths.....

06 July 2003, 04:11

bsekf

MSSmagmum, I understand the 444 brass is very strong in the web area, unlike 45-70.

In your 2nd post, I think you are getting my drift. I have a 30 Alaskan sizing die to make cases with.

It may not be enough of an improvement over a 308 to make it worthwhile.

How do I get to the tables you speak of?

[ 07-05-2003, 19:13: Message edited by: bsekf ]

06 July 2003, 04:45

Magnum Mike

quote:
Originally posted by bsekf:
In your 2nd post, I think you are getting my drift. I have a 30 Alaskan sizing die to make cases with.

It may not be enough of an improvement over a 308 to make it worthwhile.

That is one of the reasons that I started the tables. I am VERY curious as to just exactly can be obtained in the 15-16ï¿½ barrel length and what cartridges are going to provide the best overall performance/compromise. It REALLY matters not if your choice of cartridge is optimum, the 444 Marlin appears to be another cartridge that is too much in the 14-16ï¿½ barrels. The 445sm will provide the same velocities. I still like me 444 though! [Big Grin]

Another reason for the tables is reference. You want to have a barrel built in X caliber. The database should be a good point of reference to help you find the cartridge that fits your need/desire.

quote:
Originally posted by bsekf:
How do I get to the tables you speak of?

This is the link to the databases > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Specialty_Pistols/database

If you are not a Yahoo Groups member you will have to sign up. I set it up this way to avoid trolls.

[ 07-05-2003, 19:46: Message edited by: MSSmagnum ]

06 July 2003, 06:54

T/C Nut

quote:
Originally posted by bsekf:
I think the 300 Win Mag is overkill in a 15 inch barrel. Have been going round and round with PJ on GB board about it. Even the 30-06 is longer than 308X444AI, but about the same capacity. I want to leave the combustion volume of the barrel as large as possible.

Since the 309JDJ is really a "blown out" 308 AI, I figured sombody must have tried it in an Encore. I guess not.

Well,first off my 300mag is not 15" its 16.5" I loaded up some rounds and tested them in my 16.5" tube and in my Dad's 24.5" 300mag rifle.The load was a 165gr Speer Spitzer 61grs of IMR4064.In his rifle velocity was 2990fps my pistol was 2702fps!To me the 300mag in a 16.5" tube gives up little to a rifle.

TC Nut, be a man and go for a 375 H&H, boy I bet that would smart!

I'm not even going to reply to this your not worth it!

[ 07-05-2003, 21:56: Message edited by: T/C Nut ]

08 July 2003, 02:35

bsekf

I beg your pardon, didn't realize your barrel was 16.5. In my area that would have to be a rifle and we can't hunt with a rifle. NY makes you keep the barrel length under 16 inches for pistol hunting. Sorry about the mis-understanding, we are not on the same page.

08 July 2003, 04:56

<Paul Dustin>

bsekf I'm having Competitor make me a barrel action in 358 JDJ and I think I can get 2700fp+ out of this barrel with a 150gr bullet just about the same as my 358 Win. barrel.. Out of my Contender barrel I got 2665fps with a 150gr bullet and this would be pushing 50K from the Competitor barrel. With your 309 JDJ you should do about like a 308 Win. of a little better

11 July 2003, 06:41

bsekf

It appears that a 309jdj or 308X444AI is not enough of an improvement over the stock 308 or 30-06 to make it worth while in a 15 barrel. I hoped someone had run one of these wildcats up to max pressure in an Encore and had some data. I know of a 308X444 and will be interested to see if it is an improvement over the 308. Maybe I should be looking at 7mm? hm......So many toys, so little time!

15 July 2003, 16:03

Wildcat Crazy

Actually The .444Marlin was developed in a modified 336 Marlin.The brass used was 30-06 basic
pulled from the line before the rim was trimmed,the extractor groove was cut or the case necked.I remember the first writeups on the .444 Marlin.I owned one shortly after they were introduced.

WC

16 July 2003, 02:08

Rich Jake

bsekf
I was looking at SSK's website & they show the JDJ's on the 30-06 case & claim to be able to compete with belted magnum velocities.I don't think this is what you were asking but it sounds like you might be able to run the 309 JDJ close to the 300 Win mag velocities. That is of course, you believe JD Jones velocities that he advertises.
Rich Jake