strength of barrel inserts? (45-70 in 12ga)

24 September 2002, 16:41

the444shooter

Well, I've got an EAA side by side 12ga on my wish list that comes with 45-70 barrel inserts...It'd just be a fun gun to have. But I was wondering about putting "hot" loads through those barrel inserts, like Garrett's Hammerhead or Corbon cartridges...anyone have any clue as to whether those inserts could handle those loads?

26 September 2002, 03:24

the444shooter

btt: someone's gotta know?!?!?!

26 September 2002, 05:45

TGetzen

The real question you should be asking, I think, is not the strength of the barrel inserts but the lockup strength of the action itself. I'm no expert and can't give you an expert answer, but I would not fire hot loads in it -- just the plain old safely loaded 45-70 rounds, as intended for any gun so chambered.

I'm betting those hot-loaded 45-70 rounds are many thousand PSI higher than even a magnum 12ga. load.

Todd

26 September 2002, 14:53

<Axel>

If I remember correctly a 12 gauge produces around 3800 pounds of thrust. The hot 45-70 loads generate about 25% to 35% more thrust than this. I would not recommend these loads in a cheap shotgun action.

Axel

28 September 2002, 07:36

MacD37

I don't know about Axel's 3800 lbs "THRUST", but
a 12 ga produces about 11,600 PSI chamber pressure. This compared to the 28,000 PSI in the light loads for a trapdoor 45-70, or 38,000/40,000 Psi for a lever action load, or 50,000 PSI on up for a Ruger No1 45-70.

I personally would not use anything over standard factory 45-70 ammo in a liner equiped 12 ga shotgun! [Eek!]

[ 09-28-2002, 04:39: Message edited by: MacD37 ]

28 September 2002, 10:52

Judy

Check out Hodgdon's reloading pages on their web site. They say a 12 gauge operates at 11600 psi. I think it's www.Hodgdon.com.

28 September 2002, 11:20

<BMG>

Mabey I am missing something, but I own a Harrington & Richardson (NEF) Buffalo Classic break open .45-70 with a 32" barrel. I do know that it's a 'Break Open' design identical to the break open design of my single shot NEF Survivor 12ga shotgun. I have not measured the outside of the .45-70 barrel to give the exact .???", but it should work well in a 12ga. I have thought of getting one myself but needed to wait for available new gun $$, in the meantime I'll listen to results from actual users. Regulation of the barrels for point of aim is my only concern. If the inserts can be 'spun' in the 12ga barrels so the gun can be regulated to a 4" group at 50yds, sign me up. What a fun time on deer/rabbits that would be!

I wouldn't be worried in the least about backthrust or pressure up to 29,000 PSI in that setup. But a .500 A2 in a Rem700... [Wink]

28 September 2002, 13:45

MacD37

quote:
Originally posted by NRAChick:
Check out Hodgdon's reloading pages on their web site. They say a 12 gauge operates at 11600 psi. I think it's www.Hodgdon.com.

NRAchick, I edited my post to reflect your pressure for the 12 ga, but it makes little difference, the 45-70 is far above that! P.O. Ackley didn't reccomend liners for anything larger than .22. I wouldn't go that far,but I think with factory ammo from Winchester, or Remington, would be OK, but I have my doubts about some of the SO-CALLED "NEW" hot 45-70, even in the new lever actions!

28 September 2002, 15:20

jeffeosso

quote:
Originally posted by BMG:
Harrington & Richardson (NEF) Buffalo Classic break open .45-70 with a 32" barrel. I do know that it's a 'Break Open' design identical to the break open design of my single shot NEF Survivor 12ga shotgun. )

In this case, it's more of heat treating than anything else. The NEF/TOPPER is a switch barrel, but they will NOT barrel a shotgun SN action with a rifle, but they will do either on a rifle SN action. They told me (and I knew the answer) was that their shotguns are heattreated (invisable) differently.

Now, to address some "i think's" out there, the same company makes those inserts for the shotgun in 45/70 also in 308, a decidely high pressure gun. Now, before you start bawling your head off about bolt thrust, TrollE, let's look at other actions that fu***ing ignore bolt thrust in the classe.

The contender, loads in 45/70 as hot as you want, BUT WILL NOT LOAD IN 308 due soley to pressure. Look in your reloading books, and the higher pressure loads are reserved for contenders.

So, in all honesty, does any THINK that a company, in today's lawsuit happy, jury adjusted remington trigger world, would put out a high (308 not 45/70) pressure cart on a soft shotgun action?

anyone .... anyone... beulher?

And, if you scratch the surface, you find out that this shotgun is an A&D action, milled from a great alloy, and then heat treated.

And, for TrollE, go to EEAcorp.com and have a peak around and read the specs.

pretty simple..

now, do I think it can be accurate? minute of basketball at 50 woudl tickle me in that config.

jeffe