Speer 500 gr. AGS

09 August 2013, 07:10

Joe from So. Cal.

Speer 500 gr. AGS

First let me say I don't hunt, rather I shoot for fun, although books about hunting are exciting to read, for sure.

Speer quit making the tungsten core .458" bullets. I was wondering why? I've read comments that, being short for their weight they were a good choice for cartridges like 458 Win Mag where space isn't the most generous.

I've shot them through 40" of Doug Fir 6 x 12 laid end to end. They traveled straight and put a hefty dent in the plate I placed at the end. I can make a guess at why but I'm hoping the real experts here can enlighten me.

I also noticed Barnes doesn't offer the 600 gr. soft point anymore either. Lousy performer?

09 August 2013, 08:03

buckeyeshooter

Can't say anything about the Speer product as I don't use them.
As far as the 600 grain Barnes. It was one of the 'original' designs. Meaning cup and core. It was a bit too long for a 458WM using lots of powder space in a factory length cartridge. It worked just fine, especially in Lott or Weatherby versions as long as it was not pushed too fast. It still have 5 full boxes of these bullets squirreled away in the basement.

09 August 2013, 21:47

Rub Line

I wish they still made the AGS, I recently found a box of 338 AGS's. I just don't want to burn them up because you can't replace them. They cost about $4 each and that was new old stock so it was probably sitting on the shelf for ten years at that price, they'd probably cost $6 or more at today's cost.

I'm actually surprised they aren't more popular, I'd think for DG they'd be good preferable. I wonder if someone like Barnes or hornady marketed a version of the tungsten core solid if they'd have a better following. I've always liked Speer bullets but I think they need better marketing and updated bullet designs. It would be fun to do some penetration testing with the AGS compared to some of the other solids.

10 August 2013, 05:14

RIP

I tested the .416/400-grain Speer AGS against 3/4" mild steel at 100 yards, long ago.
The tungsten rod inside penciled through.
The jacket surrounding the tungsten bounced off the plate.
Not a perfect outcome.
I lost interest.
Monometal brass or copper solid would be more reliable in game.

10 August 2013, 14:32

buffalo

quote:
Originally posted by Rub Line:
It would be fun to do some penetration testing with the AGS compared to some of the other solids.

Michael458 did that on the Terminal Bullet Performance thread.. - cause I sent him a few in .416"/400 grs to test..

The AGS did fairly good, but not as good as the new design solids with 65-70% meplat like CEB and North Fork...

10 August 2013, 21:05

RIP

The Speer AGS Solid: There have been some field reports of failure when the sub-caliber tungsten penetrator rods are shed through the nose of the bullet.
Like on my steel plate test.
That is the only fly in their ointment.
They did great at MIB:

quote:
Originally posted by michael458:
Well today I have my head stuck up the goats ass!!! Yep, that's right, you heard it here first! The other day, building a new box of print for this test, I built it in the old box, with the 2X6 backside. Oh well, it's fine, that small meplat Grand Slam is not going to go that far anyway!

I want everyone to take note of this, I said the other day when I posted this photo of the loaded test that I did not think the 416-400 gr Grand Slam would do well, it's meplat is too small! Remember that? I said it would veer off course!

Well I need that photo that someone had a few pages ago with the guy with the foot stuck in his mouth---THAT"S ME!!! Foot in Mouth-head stuck up a goats ass! That's what I get when I open my big mouth WITHOUT TESTING FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I WAS WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I did shoot two of the 3 bullets I had on hand from Buffalo, all the way from Denmark--Thank you Buffalo for providing these for the test. As you see both bullets gave 100% dead straight line penetration right to the end! Bullet #1 EXITED the back of the box after driving straight through 64 inches of new very tight and tough medium!

Lost in the impact boxes! Bullet number two damn near exited the back of the box too and was nearly lost! But it managed to stick out the back and stop, or it would have been gone too!

Both were tested in one of my Winchester M70s in 416 Remington. Twist Rate? I figure standard 1:14, but could be wrong about that??? I suppose that the length of this bullet, being short, obviously allowed it to be very stable out of that twist, even with a small for caliber meplat, which was a great surprise! However, we have already proven, if you are in that just a bit too small meplat, say 50-60% of caliber, it better be stable and have the right twist rate, or a fast twist rate to be stable! I suppose the weight and compactness of the Grand Slam assisted in making it stable so that it could penetrate well!

The 400 gr African Grand Slam passes the test with Flying Colors! It's a deep diver!

10 August 2013, 21:17

RIP

A photo of the 400 Barnes Banded and the 400 African Grand Slam

[/QUOTE]

Doc M's photo above shows the short overall length of the AGS .416/400 versus a Barnes Banded Solid of same caliber and weight.
Short length helped it overcome the small meplat.

Great bullet except for the structural integrity thing of a two-piece bullet that utilizes a harder-and-denser-than-lead cylinder inside a soft brass jacket.
Let alone any concentricity issues of mating a tungsten "pencil lead" to a brass jacket.

12 August 2013, 11:07

Ganyana

They were too expensive to make

industry inside news...swift is bringing out an improved version

11 September 2013, 12:39

LV Eric

quote:
Originally posted by Ganyana:
They were too expensive to make

industry inside news...swift is bringing out an improved version

That's if you dont hit the first shot nicely

Therefore I found them to be very economical

I have ~300-400 stored away, I'm ready! Almost. Still have health issues, other than my back. I'll be back one day, I didn't forget how to shoot.

Long lost Brother Ron how ya doin?

Miss you guys here please say hello for the crew.

Best
Eric Petersen