50 cal bullets for soft skinned game?

23 January 2002, 08:44

Paul H

As my 500 Jeffrey is going to be in shootable form in the not so distant future, Me thinks some bullets ought to be ordered. It's built on a P-14 action, so the magazene will be long enough for 500 NE bullets. I'm thinking of trying a box each of the 535 and 570 woodleigh softs, with muzzle velocity in the 2200-2400 fps range.

23 January 2002, 08:53

<Rune>

I have tested 750 grain Woodleigh softnoses for the Nyati. I have been shooting at a rack of wet phonebooks and found that they will have problems holding up beyond 2200fps. I guess they are made for 577 nitro velocities.
I suspect that is the case for the .50 cal Woodleigh's also.....

23 January 2002, 08:53

<500 AHR>

Paul,

You had better take a look at the Woodleigh vs. Tanzania Buff thread. JohnS and GeorgeS have both gone on record stating the Woodleighs are crap. They have provided suggestions as to better bullets to use in a .510 bore.

Todd E

23 January 2002, 10:32

<BMG>

I hate to be the Devil's advocate, but Paul H is asking about 'thin skinned' game and bullet performance. Mabey I am wrong, but isn't a Buff a 'thich skinned' animal?

I think the Woodleigh's would work well for deer, moose, elk, bear, etc. For 'thick skinned' game, a sturdy soft or solid would work the best, especially when shooting at thick bone mass like the spine.

23 January 2002, 10:39

Paul H

quote:
Originally posted by BMG:
I hate to be the Devil's advocate, but Paul H is asking about 'thin skinned' game and bullet performance. Mabey I am wrong, but isn't a Buff a 'thich skinned' animal?
I think the Woodleigh's would work well for deer, moose, elk, bear, etc. For 'thick skinned' game, a sturdy soft or solid would work the best, especially when shooting at thick bone mass like the spine.

BMG,

You're not being the devils advocate, just the only guy who bothered to read the the title of the post!

I did get the entertainment of reading the Tanzania Buff thread, as I hadn't read it yet.

23 January 2002, 11:20

John S

Paul-
If I were pointing that cannon at brown bear I wouldn't have it loaded with Woodleighs. Not if you're going to load it to 2300-2400fps. For the rest, well go shoot something and then come back and tell us!

23 January 2002, 12:26

Paul H

John,

So the X is the only option? Who knows, with the recoil what it will be, I just may keep to 2100 fps!

23 January 2002, 12:53

John S

Paul-
I would say it is at this point in time if you're loading to full potential.

I sold my 500 A-Square for a number of reasons, not the least of which was this very topic- lack of good bullets. There were good solids to be sure, but the soft points that I totally favor for first shots on buffalo were/are just non-existant. The X was not accurate in my rifle, and it's size really intruded on powder space in that "small" 460Wby case!

23 January 2002, 14:02

<500 AHR>

Paul,

I am sure many may disagree with me but an Alaskan moose is as big or bigger than most cape buffalo. The bone of the buff may be a bit tougher but it matters little if the bullets are kept to reasonable velocities.

I have never had problems with 535 grain woodleighs loaded to around 2400 fps. I haven't experienced any issues with 570 grain Woodleighs to about 2350 fps. Now in both cases expansion is complete. I mean these bullets are close to coming apart. I don't like the X bullet as they lose their pedals and become nothing but light weight solids!

Something to consider here as well. There is absolutely no reason to drive a 570 grain bullet 2500, 2600, or 3000 fps. At those velocities all you are doing is punching huge holes clear through the animal (if you expanding type bullet stays together that is). Something else to consider is if that bullet punches clear through what is left to stop it. This can be a very bad situation if you are picking an animal out of a herd.

I assure you that a 600 grain solid at 2450 fps will punch clear through a cape buffalo stem to stern. Been there done that. Heck I have had soft points do it!

I guess all I am trying to say is that a Jeffery was designed to push 540 grain slugs around 2400 fps for a reason. If I were you I would use the 535 Woodleigh at 2350 - 2400 and not look back.

Todd E

[This message has been edited by Todd E (edited 01-23-2002).]

23 January 2002, 15:41

470 Mbogo

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Todd E:
Hi Paul,
I think Todd has given you the best information. With 535 grain bullets at 2400 fps the Jeffery is still very managable but with a 570 at 2500 your taking the shootability of the cartridge out of the equation for the majority of shooters.

470 Mbogo

23 January 2002, 19:08

Nitroman

I had sent a letter to the owner of Swift discussing this very same problem. I told him he would really make a bunch of people happy.
I never got a response so I called about a month later. The lady who handled the phone listened to me explain what I had written, she even remembered giving him the letter! Don't you just love small companies? She asked me to hold on, I did for about few minutes, about the time I thought they were starting to be rude she came on and told me she spoke to the owner. She named him but it was a while ago so I forget. He too remembered my letter and apologized for not writing me, he was getting his Scirocco line up at the time and there were problems. The gist is he isn't going to make 50 caliber bullets. I do not know if he thinks I meant BMG or not. With A-Square's Deadtough out of the picture I do not know of a bonded, supertough .510" out there.

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24 January 2002, 05:52

500grains

I think I would give the 500 grain Woodleighs a try. Neither a brown bear nor a moose is as heavily armored as a cape buffalo, although they may be similar in weight. If Swedes can kill moose with a 6.5 x 55, I have trouble believing that a 570 grain Woodleigh would not stand up to the challenge.

But if in doubt, use GS Custom FN solids!

24 January 2002, 07:19

RIP

Paul H,
Me thinks the Barnes XLC of 570 grains is the Cat's meow with ReL-15.

The GSC 570 grain FN and HV would take care of anything else.

I load to 2450 fps. No worries.

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Happiness is a warm double and a bloody spear, but a 375 or a 416 will do just fine!
RAB

24 January 2002, 07:31

Paul H

Ron,

I'm kinda leaning that way, and that was my original plan, but I suppose what I should do is get a box each of 535 and 570 X's and woodleighs, and see what they all do.

So when you going to be visiting again? I just might have something fun to shoot Just plan your layover day on a wed, thur or fri so we can head to the range.

25 January 2002, 09:24

Wildcatter

I'll tell you what guys. I'm about to buy a machining setup when I get my shop cleaned out and organized. I have a design for .510 caliber bullets that will make your mouthes water. I am going to turn naval bronze down to .510 and machine a truncated cone on the stem and a bonded lead core in the stern for the solid at 600 and 650 grains. The soft will be similar to the old Trophy Bonded but with a smaller core, a higher ballistic coefficient, a round nose, and weighing between 570 and 620 grains. I am making these bullets for a rifle that I want to build chambered for my wildcat 500 Dark Continent cartridge. Max velocity will be the 650 grain at 2500 fps but I will load mine to about 2250-2300 fps.

When I get to producing bullets for this round I'll offer some to all those 510 buffs on the forum. Most of my ideas reguarding bullet design are not original and I really don't want to do it for a living so nobody ask if they are for sale. I would like to just do some tinkering and see what works best. Mabye after I do some testing I'll send the data to some bullet manufacturers and see if they want to finally give us what we want.

Thus starts a many year project,

-Catter

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Shoot the largest caliber you can shoot well, and practice , practice, practice.

[This message has been edited by Wildcatter (edited 01-24-2002).]

28 January 2002, 12:11

RIP

Paul H,
I'll call you when I get there. I have to play on my days off. You get to play on work days?

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Happiness is a warm double and a bloody spear, but a 375 or a 416 will do just fine!
RAB

29 January 2002, 06:17

Paul H

quote:
Originally posted by DaggaRon:

You get to play on work days?

I wouldn't have it any other way! Folks ask why I love Alaska. One of the best answers is, I have managed during a lunch "hour" to ski, rock climb, hike, fish and shoot, though not all on the same day I can think of few other major cities in the country that would allow the same opportunities

29 January 2002, 08:33

Atkinson

Woodleigh bullets have been the most popular bullet in Africa for about the last 50 years or so, then all of the sudden their crap?? I doubt that seriously...

I have never had a Woodleigh fail at the velocities they are designed for and since your driving them at a respectable 2200 FPS then they will never fail you....

I have shot a lot of game and I have seen a ton of game shot with them including the 50 calibers..I used them a lot in a 505 Gibbs at 2300 FPS on Buffalo and never had a failure..

As usual, if you abuse, them by driving them at velocities they were never designed to deal with then of course your going to have failures, common since tells you that. that applies to ALL bullets....

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com