An industry colleague of mine is selling a couple 416 Rigby's. Both are new in box with nice wood, especially the CZ. I am thinking about buying one of these to take on a future buff hunt with my 450/400.

How do Ruger RSM and CZ generally compare?

Thanks for your help.

Go for the Ruger RSM 416 Rigby! Looks Great Shoots sub MOA. You wont look back.

Brad

RSM's in 416,458,500 Jeffery

Ruger RSMs are usually good to go out of the box, triggers are good, stock is already cross bolted. Some would recommend bedding, but it isn't always necessary.

CZ's, with a little work are good rifles too.

John

+1 RSM .416 Rigby, you will love it!

The RSM in 416 Rigby is a winner, good weight and balance out of the box ready to go.

Looks like I am the dissenter. I think the RSM has very poor balance. All the RSms are really barrel heavy. I have a CZ with a laminated stock. It was great right out of the box and a bunch cheaper. However, I do plan to send it off to Wayne at AHR for his one, two treatment.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
Looks like I am the dissenter. I think the RSM has very poor balance. All the RSms are really barrel heavy. I have a CZ with a laminated stock. It was great right out of the box and a bunch cheaper. However, I do plan to send it off to Wayne at AHR for his one, two treatment.

I've heard that before, and I could imagine that the 375 could be nose heavy, but I find that the balance on the 416 to be pretty good, the rifle seems to be built like a tank, and as such a little slow on the swing, but not a strain to keep on target.

John

I also will be in the minority and vote CZ (that's been sent to AHR though). The RSM is too heavy, IMO.

From all I read and hear, many like the CZ's after they are tweaked a bit. Not uncommon to have such work done to some rifles, but will say the RSM's I own as well as others are good to go out of the box. Action was as smooth as you could want from new, trigger fine for big bore sporting rifle, quality stock, excellent sights other than that tiny bead front which can be changed out easily and at low cost, plus very good shooter. RSM's are quality rifles for the dollars invested.

My CZ Safari Lott has 2 cross bolts and even a dab of factory bedding. Only thing holding it back is the 25" barrel but that can be trimmed back a bit.

I love my RSM. I like the balance and love the look. An excellent value for the $$ spent IMO.

No first hand experience with the CZ.

Doesn't "out of the box" carry little weight since practically all authorities recommend a DGR get looked at before it goes to face such situations?

Now here's the truth: I dont own a Ruger RSM but I do own a CZ. I've yet to hunt DG. However, I can say I've held re-stocked CZs and the clubbiness all goes away. I used to shoot a Ruger in 270 and v]never cared for the feel of the action "out of the box". But I did have the chance to buy eihter a LH Ruger 375 or a LH CZ 375 and I took the CZ based upon what I want to do with it.

Just my .02 cents.

Jeff

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:
Doesn't "out of the box" carry little weight since practically all authorities recommend a DGR get looked at before it goes to face such situations?

Now here's the truth: I dont own a Ruger RSM but I do own a CZ. I've yet to hunt DG. However, I can say I've held re-stocked CZs and the clubbiness all goes away. I used to shoot a Ruger in 270 and v]never cared for the feel of the action "out of the box". But I did have the chance to buy eihter a LH Ruger 375 or a LH CZ 375 and I took the CZ based upon what I want to do with it.

Just my .02 cents.

Jeff

"Looked at" vs "reworked" are two different things.

Which would you rather your gunsmith tell you?

"Looks good, have a great hunt"

OR

" It should be fine for your trip in 2011. That is, of course, after I restock it, re-do the trigger and bed it"

One point of clarification is that Ruger made three versions at (least) of the RSM. Version one 780-XXXXX or low 750-0000 big heavy barrels and sling swivel under the stock. Version two big heavy barrel + barrel mount sling swivel. Current version lighter barrel and + barrel sling swivel. Each of these feel a little different. The earlier rifles were a little barrel heavy but I like the extra weight, however, that said my 458 lott is as quick as could be and balances great with open sites. I would make sure you pick up the rifle and give it a feel. Rifles are like cars everyone has their own idea of what feel good. I can't handle the CZ stock too club like for me and the Ruger just looks like a safari rifle.

Brad

Ruger!

I will disagree also...my Ruger RSM 416 was horrible...feeding problems that were a nightmare to correct. Sold it after it was fixed, bought a CZ, installed a new trigger, will send to AHR for some other stuff and still be in it less than the price I paid for the RSM, let alone the extra I had to pay to get it to feed.

quote:

Originally posted by congomike:
I will disagree also...my Ruger RSM 416 was horrible...feeding problems that were a nightmare to correct. Sold it after it was fixed, bought a CZ, installed a new trigger, will send to AHR for some other stuff and still be in it less than the price I paid for the RSM, let alone the extra I had to pay to get it to feed.

What was wrong with the single set trigger? I love that trigger. 3 pounds normal, or a little less, and ounces in set position...???

I have had both. I traded the CZ in on the RSM, both were .416 Rigby. I like the Ruger much more than the CZ. It has less felt recoil and is more accurate, both due to the better stock. Never had feeding problems with either. The Ruger cost more and will continue to be worth more. I'm not a big Ruger fan but do like the RSM's. I still have a CZ in .458 Lott that I am going to restock to make it shootable for me. Pick the Ruger......Tom

quote:

Originally posted by congomike:
I will disagree also...my Ruger RSM 416 was horrible...feeding problems that were a nightmare to correct. Sold it after it was fixed, bought a CZ, installed a new trigger, will send to AHR for some other stuff and still be in it less than the price I paid for the RSM, let alone the extra I had to pay to get it to feed.

Usually the difference in rifles is personal preference, but sometimes its just plain bias. One advantage to Ruger is their lifetime service policy, if you have one that fails to feed, you can call them, send it to them, and have them fix it at no cost to you.

CZ USA has pretty good service as well; however, since most people modify them once they receive it, they are reluctant to send on back to the factory.

Either rifle has a good reputation for reliability in the field and either should do well.

John

Dave, can you give me AHR's telephone #?

GS..the factory set trigger had too many moving parts and small springs and such for my taste. I put in a Timney in about 30 minutes and am very happy with it.
Big Bore Boar Hunter....I have posted this before on the forum, so I will give you the condensed version:
I called Ruger and the first person I talked to asked if I was using an after market magazine, because that is the most common problem. I informed her that I was not and as far as I know no one makes an aftermarket magazine for the RSM..her reply? "Aftermarket magazines are made for EVERY (my emphasis) firearm that Ruger manufactures, rifle or handgun." I knew I was in trouble. I said no. The next question was whether I had modified the gun. I replied honestly that I had put a better recoil pad on and a buffalo horn forend tip (at least I think it was buffalo horn). Her next reply was that those alterations probably caused the feeding issue. Wow. After a bit more conversation I was told that the only way they would do any work on it was if I bought a new stock ($470 back then). I said I would just send the barreled action..same answer, fine, but we will put a new stock on it and charge you for it. At this point (for those old enough) I started to look for Alan Funt or Durwood Kirby to jump out and yell Candid Camera. I politely declined the offer and took it to a gunsmith about 100 miles from her. It worked fine after that, but I had lost interest in it by that time.

The CZ rifles that I have handled have been very crude compared to a much more refined RSM. Rugers customer service is very accomadating. I have killed cape buffalo (3) with two differant Rugers. Life is far too short to hunt with an inferior or ugly gun. Buy a Ruger and you will have a superior product. Ths thread seems to lean in this direction. Dr.C

quote:

Originally posted by gbanger:
Dave, can you give me AHR's telephone #?

AHR Contact Page

Sounds like you definitely got a bum CSR, they have some good ones though.

John

Not enough has been said about the feel or balance and pointability of the Ruger.I sometimes feel that it can put much more expensive rifles to shame in this department.The more I shoot it,the more I want to have it as my only rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by gbanger:
Dave, can you give me AHR's telephone #?

406-363-8033

Why don't you ask your friend to try out both see for yourself and buy the one your like the best? Every rifle is test fired from the factory so it should loose much value in that regard. ( Just an Idea )I'm happy to see so many RSM supporters a few years back I was given a lot of heat over my choice of the RSM.

Brad

I received a little more info on the rifles. The Ruger RSM is an older model that has never been fired. He bought the Ruger about 15 years ago for a brown bear hunt. Eight months after he bought the rifle his wife gave birth to triplets. His hunting budget shrank considerably and the bear hunt never happened. The Ruger weighs 10.7 pounds, and the sling attaches on the forearm, not the barrel. Is that a problem????

The CZ is a Safari Classic in 404 Jeffery, not a 416 as I had originally posted. It has really nice wood, and weighs 9.9 pounds. It has been fired about 20 times. He bought it a couple years ago for about $2500.

As far as calibers go, the 404 Jeffery would be really cool.

His prices are a bit ridiculous on the low side, $1200 for the CZ or $1000 for the Ruger. I can only buy one of the rifles. Another mutual friend of ours is getting the rifle that I do not select.

I am stumped. As far as rifle models go,...I think I would rather the Ruger. However as far as the caliber goes, I'd prefer the 404 Jeffery.

Thanks, Charles and Dave.

Even though I'm a very BIG RSM fan. Given those two choiced I'd have to say go for the 404 Jeffery if you don't like it you can sell it and buy a brand new ruger. I picked up my last RSM in 416 for $1250 with a Leupold scope Vari X III 1.5x5 used in fairly good shape. I haven't seen a 404 ever that cheap. However, at those prices you can't loose. Great find lots of luck.

Brad

twin pipes: sling on the forearm is perfectly ok the sling "will not hurt you". you will not find the Lott in this configuration, only .375 HH and .416 Rigby.As a plus, down the road the 480 prefix just might be a tad more collectable IMO. Dr.C

quote:

Originally posted by TwicePipes:
I received a little more info on the rifles. The Ruger RSM is an older model that has never been fired. He bought the Ruger about 15 years ago for a brown bear hunt. Eight months after he bought the rifle his wife gave birth to triplets. His hunting budget shrank considerably and the bear hunt never happened. The Ruger weighs 10.7 pounds, and the sling attaches on the forearm, not the barrel. Is that a problem????

The CZ is a Safari Classic in 404 Jeffery, not a 416 as I had originally posted. It has really nice wood, and weighs 9.9 pounds. It has been fired about 20 times. He bought it a couple years ago for about $2500.

As far as calibers go, the 404 Jeffery would be really cool.

His prices are a bit ridiculous on the low side, $1200 for the CZ or $1000 for the Ruger. I can only buy one of the rifles. Another mutual friend of ours is getting the rifle that I do not select.

I am stumped. As far as rifle models go,...I think I would rather the Ruger. However as far as the caliber goes, I'd prefer the 404 Jeffery.

How does the recoil compare between 416 rigby and 404 Jeffery? Is one "sharper" then the other? Just curious as just Friday night I looked at a CZ in 416 Rigby and was talking about how I have become interested in the 404 but have not had an chance to fire one. I am a big enough guy (6'1" 225LBS.) and I don't mind heavy recoil, that said I don't care for sharp recoil. I guess my example of sharp recoil would me my friends 340 weatherby as compared to my 338 win.
*Note: in the interest of saving time, I am not saying that the 340 was a bad gun or kicked to hard or anything else, just that type of "sharp" recoil I don't care for.
Sorry to hijack the thread, just odd seeing a CZ 416 thread 48 hours after you look at one.

Heck of a deal on the 404. I haven't found that cal. in the CZ that reasonable.

quote:

Originally posted by TwicePipes:
. The Ruger weighs 10.7 pounds, and the sling attaches on the forearm, not the barrel. Is that a problem????

Jeffery.

I am not a big fan of studs on the forearm, it can be a good way to chew your fingers if your not careful of where you place your hands. The 404 jeff is a great cartridge and gives you quite a bit of killing power for little recoil. I would grab the CZ, have it gone over, and you should be A-Ok.

John

Look at the physics. 400gr .423 bullet 2400fps vs 400grn .416 bullet 2400fps. The only difference at this point is stock fit and gun weight. I have a 9.3RUM wildcat which kicks at lot sharper that the 416. My advice after a couple of hundred rounds you won't even think its a big deal. I warm up with 20 rounds from my 458 Lott and then its all down hill from there.

Brad

quote:

Originally posted by Brad aka Pill Shooter:
Look at the physics. 400gr .423 bullet 2400fps vs 400grn .416 bullet 2400fps. The only difference at this point is stock fit and gun weight. I have a 9.3RUM wildcat which kicks at lot sharper that the 416. My advice after a couple of hundred rounds you won't even think its a big deal. I warm up with 20 rounds from my 458 Lott and then its all down hill from there.

Brad

The 404 loads can be loaded to 416 levels, but the standard load was pretty mellow, 400 gr at 2050 fps.

John

CZ

My .416 and .375 were both MOA guns and unlike many , I really had no complaints as to the trigger or machining.

Likewise ,I did not care for the Ruger's balance and heavy feel.

contact AR member GG375 and ask him for pics of his custom CZ 416 Rigby. It's a beaut!

For the prices mentioned, I'd jump on the CZ. If I didn't already have a 404 I'd recommend that you get the Ruger and give me your friends # so I could buy the CZ.

Hands down, the Ruger M77 Safari Magnum!! The Ruger Safari Magnum is the finest large bore factory rifle ever produced.