If I am correct the diameter of the 45-70 is 0.458”
Has anyone heard of, known of, or considered loading a 450 grain Barnes Banded Solid in 0.458” into a 45-70 cartridge? I don’t know that much about bullets, twist rate, reloading, etc., but wonder if the bullet would be too heavy for the cartridge caliber. I only need to shoot it relatively flat for 40-50 yards at the most. Thinking that if it worked what a great short range bear over bait cartridge it would make. It would put a hurtin on a bear.

Thanks

BHW,...You dont want to use a solid on bear. Get some 405gn woodleighs a pound of rl-7 and winchester brass and you'll put a big hurtin on any bear over a bait-pile....Good Luck

A 45-70 single shot will work with most any bullet.
If it is a lever gun with a tube magazine it will need a flat nosed bullet.

No solid ! Good light bullets are 300 Nosler [Winchester Partition] and 300 Barnes all copper [Corbon DPX].I assume you're talking about Black bear.

I have not looked at the profile of the flay nosed solid. To be safe in the tube magazine, the profile should be wider than just the primer pocket. My guess it would be fine. As far as a 450 grain bullet. I get 2000 fps with max loads out of a 22 inch barrel. So, my guess is you should be easily able to get 1750 to 1800fps in a lever action. the ruger single shot would do a bit better.

I have shot a few black bears and you do not want a solid in my opinion.

My brother killed a black bear with his 45/70 using a Hornady 350gr FN. Worked perfect.

We use IMR 3031. Start with 50 grains. We load 53gr for his Marlin Guide Gun.

It is a very accurate load.

Thanks to everyone who posted a response.

Currently I am shooting 300 grain Barnes TSX and it sounds like what I am currently using is adequate and that a solid is not as good an idea as I had hoped.

I think the Barnes Bullets in general are too long due to the bullet design for the .45-70 case.

If I was going to use a Barnes bullet in a 45/70 for black bear I would use the Barnes 300gr XFN designed for the velocity of the 45/70.

Which 45/70 rifle do you have?

quote:

If I was going to use a Barnes bullet in a 45/70 for black bear I would use the Barnes 300gr XFN designed for the velocity of the 45/70.

NE450

X2--That will turn a black bear inside out!

Michael

NE 450 No2: I have a Marlin GLS

A Marlin in 45/70 is a great bear over bait gun.

And for a lot of other stuff as well.

Isn't some very hard cast bullets just like a solid? I have heard good things about them. All the same I would use the 300x or anything else but Remington 405's

I shot a black bear once with a 45/70. I was using a 405 Rem at 2000 fps and it hammered the poor bear, but the problem is that is about 500 fps more than what a 405 Rem can deal with. While I had a dead bear, the bullet was a total failure breaking up in pieces.

This was long ago, and long before we really started getting some great bullets designed for 45/70. A great common bullet is 350 Hornady! It will hold up way past 2000 fps. Various Barnes and especially the 300 FN X which is just wicked. I really like the 405 Woodleigh, nearly the perfect bullet in that weight class!

Most of the various cast bullets do act more or less like solids, but the flat nose versions hit hard up front. Watch the size of the meplat and the hardness, I have had several of the very large flat meplats shear off on impact, I don't much care for that.

Michael

Mike458 is spot on. The remington is a bit soft at high velocity. The 350 grain hornady is very good and the Barnes 300 or the now discontinued Nolser 300 are great. I have not tried the woodleigh. Cast are praised by the 45/70 mafia but I've never been fond of 1800's technology when better, modern technology was available.

quote:

Originally posted by buckeyeshooter:
Mike458 is spot on. The remington is a bit soft at high velocity. The 350 grain hornady is very good and the Barnes 300 or the now discontinued Nolser 300 are great. I have not tried the woodleigh. Cast are praised by the 45/70 mafia but I've never been fond of 1800's technology when better, modern technology was available.

Cast bullets work fine if you know how hard to make them. Not all technology comes ready made in a box. Ask 30,000,000 buffalo.
BTW smokeless dates back to about 1885....
Center fire cases date to 1869 or so.

quote:

Originally posted by SR4759:

quote:

Originally posted by buckeyeshooter:
Mike458 is spot on. The remington is a bit soft at high velocity. The 350 grain hornady is very good and the Barnes 300 or the now discontinued Nolser 300 are great. I have not tried the woodleigh. Cast are praised by the 45/70 mafia but I've never been fond of 1800's technology when better, modern technology was available.

Cast bullets work fine if you know how hard to make them. Not all technology comes ready made in a box. Ask 30,000,000 buffalo.
BTW smokeless dates back to about 1885....
Center fire cases date to 1869 or so.

Amen to that!

I have shot several deer with the 350 Hornady RN from a Ruger No1 at 1890fps.

I have also shot several deer and several wild pigs with the same bullet at 2330fps in my 450 No2 double.

It is my favorite 458 bullet in that weight range.

A 400'ish grain bullet cast from wheel weights and air cooled will be than satisfactory.

The 350 gr Hornady--Flat or round--the round version being designed for 458 Winchester and will hold up nice right up to 2400 fps impact velocity. Hornady being pretty sharp just flattened the nose of that same bullet making it a perfect lever gun 45/70 bullet--very nearly a premium bullet! At the time Hornady did this they did it for the 450 Marlin--or they came out about the same time. I started using it because at the time it was the best bullet for 45/70 on the market-all others being too soft like the 405 Rem and some of the various HPs.

So one had the big flat nose cast bullets or the 350 Hornady--this was not all that long ago, around 2000 or so. I had tried nearly everything I could get my hands on for 45/70s and the Marlins. This was a big break for 45/70 at the time. Since then we have some really great bullets, the 405 Woodleigh being a fantastic bullet at 1800-2000 fps, it's a big hammer! I love the 300 Barnes FN X, but have never had the opportunity to use it in the field. But I am very sure of what it would do on black bear, deer sized animals, pigs.

During a period from about 1998-2002 I used the 45/70 quite a bit. In some cases I was a little disappointed with animal reactions, but it always left dead critters laying about! With todays bullets far better than what I was using I am sure that business is far better now than it was then. Good bullets are the key to it's success!

Michael