Classic - .458 Lott

17 October 2003, 04:32

475Guy

Nickudu

You have just made my day with this post. It's a stroll down memory lane as this was one of the first Jacque Lott articles I actually read and committed to memory on Big-Bores and African hunting. You must have a good G&A library at hand. Thanks

17 October 2003, 07:16

Gustavo

quote:
Originally posted by 475Guy:
Nickudu

You have just made my day with this post. It's a stroll down memory lane as this was one of the first Jacque Lott articles I actually read and committed to memory on Big-Bores and African hunting. You must have a good G&A library at hand. Thanks

Would you mind to post it again ?? I cannot see the full images of the article.

Tks in advance!

17 October 2003, 07:30

Steve

Nick,

Your article must be very popular. You've exceded your daily number of hits, per villagephotos.com.

This means we'll all be piling onto this thread at midnight to read the article [Big Grin]

.

Can't wait until then...

-Steve

18 October 2003, 08:54

Nickudu

I'll try again, leaving the photos "in the Village". Perhaps they'll go a bit further (?). I'll repost again tomorrow a.m., assuming "AR" is operational.

[ 10-17-2003, 23:57: Message edited by: Nickudu ]

18 October 2003, 09:15

Steve

Thanks Nick.

I was able to get them all this time. This info is very timely for me.

-Steve

18 October 2003, 09:28

Nickudu

You're welcome, Steve. I have many articles scanned and ready to go but file size is a real problem.

18 October 2003, 11:03

Will

Nick,

Thanks. His loads with IMR-4320 are almost identical with mine with a 22" barrel. I can easily get over 2300 fps, but it is about my abuse limit @ about 5800 ft-lbs at the range, shooting off-hand. Of course, when hunting it isn't noticed.

18 October 2003, 11:42

Nickudu

Yes, IMR-4320 has always been a must try in the Lott. With the new monolithics, things have changed a bit. I'm interested in that 3" .458 from Granite Mountain, mentioned in another thread. One might get those 500 monos to "loaf" at near 2,400 and still maintain top magazine capacity. Nice.

18 October 2003, 12:00

Will

The 3" version is the "Express" that has been touted in South Africa. The cheapest conversion is the CZ 550/458 WM but then it will probably require a new magazine box, since the 2.85" Lott pretty much eats up all the space in the current 458 WM magazine.

The 3"'s would be nice as my 4320 loads are heavily compressed. Maybe the new CZ Lott version will have a longer magazine box that can be used for 3" cases. As far as I know the Express cases are available from S. Africa, but I bet they are not as cheap as the Lott cases from Hornady!

18 October 2003, 12:16

Nickudu

If CZ was on the ball, that's exactly what they should do, come out with the Express. It's the inevitable conclusion. May as well do it now. Best all-round big bore casing, all things considered. Sort of a belted, smokeless .450 Nitro ... full circle ... end of story.

[ 10-18-2003, 03:26: Message edited by: Nickudu ]

18 October 2003, 12:35

Atkinson

Nick,
I still have that article around here someplace and another very good article is in Rifle Magazine #135 entitled "458 Lott, The Case That Jack Built"...Really good stuff but the part about lining the magazine with ebony to keep it together was taken out of context and isn't correct...It was a misprint I found out from D'Arcy..

I have had about 3 or 4 Lotts and with a 26" barrel and a big dose of IMR-4320 I got some velocities that were awsome, however I settled on 2350 FPS with a 500 gr. bullet...At that it was on the edge of my recoil tolerance from all positions except standing off hand....

18 October 2003, 12:57

510wells

Nick,

Thank you VERY much for posting the Lott article!

Roi

18 October 2003, 13:03

I have just recived my cz .458 win mag coverted a .458 Lott and i enjoyed the article, thanks Nik.

I really feel cz or someone should chamber the .450 Rigby, they would have there own niche market.

In some respects as much as I love the .458 Lott round I reckon the .450 Rigby would have been the better choice to have factory backing, but hey I love my lott.

19 October 2003, 00:09

Nickudu

PC,
I very much like the .450 Rigby but, for African use, the .458 Lott offers some real advantages. Risking the redundant, the use of .458 Winchester ammunition in a pinch, the smaller casehead, providing maximum firepower for a given gunweight. It produces somewhat less recoil and is less expensive to load for, promoting both experimentation and beneficial practice. It is generally easier to build or replace, not representing a high-dollar risk of loss, while traveling abroad.

But, with all this, if CZ were to offer the .450 Rigby in the usual price range, I'd likely be right behind you on the purchase line. [Wink]

19 October 2003, 01:19

Nik, as usual your making sense and those reasons you point out are why I buil;t a lott over a .450 Rigby. The mag capacity issue is a winner and it does lend itself to using 45/70 bullets a little bettr than the .450 Rigby I suppose. It's kind of like a giant 45/70 to some extent.

It just strikes me as strange while winchester has an ideal platform to build the .458 Lott on, the action size of both the Ruger RSM & CZ 550 Magnums would have lent them selves to easily fitting in the huge .450 Rigby Round. Also seeing as they both chamber rifles for my all time favourite the .416 Rigby I thought to chamber for the big brother round would have been a commercially sensible decision. I mean Hornady could have thrown backing behind the .450 Rigby just as easy as the .458 Lott [Confused]

And if Ruger and hornady had opted for that direction well who would know how popular the .450 Rigby would become.

Either way I would like to see CZ do a run of .450 Rigby's I mean it's just a manner of screwing a .458 barrel on to a .416 550 action and bingo. I will have to build a .450 Rigby one day [Cool]

Nik how cool would it be for cz or Ruger to build the Trio;

.350 Rigby
.416 Rigby
.450 Rigby

[Cool]

[ 10-18-2003, 16:22: Message edited by: PC ]

19 October 2003, 01:23

Will

Nick,

Okay, here's more redundant. You don't need a 500 gr. bullet at 2500 or 2600 fps for hunting. You can stuff 5 Lotts in the CZ magazine. It's cheap, both rifle and ammo.

Better to buy airline tickets instead of another CZ!

19 October 2003, 01:42

Nickudu

For sure.

But, oh that sweet feeding bottleneck .450 Rigby case. That mild 480 grainer @ 2,350. That ring of nostalgia in the very name. That imposing profile, alongside the straight-wallers. That .... oh forget about it! [Wink]

19 October 2003, 01:47

Nickudu

Gustavo, my friend ... were you able to download?
If not, let me know. I can always send them email.

19 October 2003, 04:39

leo-too

I can't get over how thin the muzzle was on that FN 400 series. Is'nt that just too light for a .45 caliber mag?

19 October 2003, 07:14

Atkinson

Leo,
I liked the FNs and found them about the same in the recoil department and Lotts easier to carry [Wink]

If I had a say in the whole scheme of things at the factories, I'd make them all the 458-3" and be done with it..Load them at 2300 FPS and have enough space in the case to prevent compaction, a common problem with the 458 and the Lott to a lesser degree and only with some powders.

19 October 2003, 12:31

Nickudu

FN .458 Original

19 October 2003, 13:32

bearhunt'r

[FN .458 Original]
Nickudu,
That's my BABY!!!! I'm in love!!!!!!!!
best,
bhtr

[ 10-19-2003, 04:33: Message edited by: bearhunt'r ]

20 October 2003, 07:13

Michael Robinson

Nick,

You are the man! Thanks a lot for posting that great old article. I remember it reading it when it was first published.

Little did I know at the time that one day I would own a .458 Lott and use it on dangerous game in Africa, as I did just last summer.

Thanks, again.

20 October 2003, 09:53

Nickudu

mrlexma - Did you post photos of your trip? Like to see them. What was your buffalo loading?

20 October 2003, 12:08

Michael Robinson

Nick, Here is a link to my dangerous game pictures. Dangerous Game I used my AHR custom CZ 550 Magnum on three buffalo and a hippo (and would have used it on an elephant, too, if I had found one of shootable size). I used a load consisting of BeLL brass, Woodleigh 500 gr. softs and solids, Federal 215 primers and 87 gr. of VV540. This gives me 2,300 fps out of my 24 inch barrel. I also used a Hornady factory 500 gr. soft nose, followed by a finishing Hornady 500 gr. solid, on buff no. 2, just to see how they would perform. They performed perfectly. For my lion and leopard, I used my tried and true Blaser R93 Synthetic in .375 H&H Mag. My PH fell in love with my Lott, and so did I. [ 10-20-2003, 03:14: Message edited by: mrlexma ]

20 October 2003, 13:18

Nickudu

Wow, you did great! Buff No. 3 is especially beautiful.

20 October 2003, 15:56

Michael Robinson

Thanks. No. 3s the best of the bunch, no doubt about it. The first was the biggest bull I had a clear shot at in a pretty big but tightly packed herd. He measured just over 36" with a boss just under 12. We needed lion bait, and he was big bodied and old.

No. 2 was just over 40" with a 12+ inch boss. I like the conformation of his boss, even though his horns don't dip very deep.

No. 3 was just a hair bigger than No. 2, but he is more classically deep and wider looking.

The Lott took all three of them with heart shots. I put follow up shots in the first two (multiple solids in the first, to try to keep him from getting into the river), but the first shots were fatal and the follow ups really weren't needed.

The ".458 Plus" is a super round--Mr. Lott knew his stuff.

20 October 2003, 16:25

Nickudu

The one thing you and Mr. Lott missed out on is "X" bullets. I suggest giving the 450's at about 2,400 a try, next time over. [Smile]

22 October 2003, 03:27

475Guy

Dude, I see you have re-done the article into several parts. I guess you've got a few complaints from the prebyopia challenged. I must admit to digging out my reading glasses to read it the first and the additional pictures are great and essential to the article. Thanks. [Cool]

22 October 2003, 04:07

Nickudu

The hosting site regulates photo size to some degree. If I posted them full size, they take too long to load and I'll run out of storage space, pronto. If anyone wants the original scans, send email and I'll send a zipfile. They should be larger and of better quality (I think).