HELP, double rifle choice!

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24 December 2005, 18:59

lb404

HELP, double rifle choice!

I am looking at two fine double rifles and need help in choosing.
Jeffery sidelock 450-400, 3"
Westley Richards 450-400, 3" drop lock.

Both rifles have chopper lump barrels, disk set strikers, cross bolt safety, cheek piece, and exellent bores. The Westley richards has been reconditioned to new in England and the Jeffery is in 85% of new condition but is 1/3 more money.

Any Opinions on which is a better value? Better gun?

24 December 2005, 20:13

Frank Beller

Pick the one that catches your eye ...... both will increase in value. I'd probably pick the Jeffery simply because of it's originality.

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24 December 2005, 20:19

Rusty

Leonard,
Wow, tough choice! I really do like Jeffery rifles, but I also lust for a droplock 450/400 3 inch.

By redone in England, I presume that you mean redone by Westley Richards?

Man, I'd have to look at both rifles before I could tell you.

Rusty
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24 December 2005, 20:39

new_guy

To Rusty's point - if the WR were redone by WR -then no problem on value. All of those English guns were meant to be "redone" or "freshened up" etc by the makers. That's just how they did it for thier regular maintenance of customer's guns.

The work that's been done is not as important as who did it. This whole "original condition" stigma seems to have developed (IMO) around the Colts and Winchesters in this country where they were NOT customarily sent back to the factory for "freshening up."

I like the DL and if it's been done by WR - then I say you've got no problems. If it's done by someone else, then maybe I look at the Jeffery which has had less done to it.

24 December 2005, 20:39

new_guy

quote:
Originally posted by new_guy:
To Rusty's point - if the WR were redone by WR -then no problem on value. All of those English guns were meant to be "redone" or "freshened up" etc by the makers. That's just how they did it for thier regular maintenance of customers' guns.

The work that's been done is not as important as who did it. This whole "original condition" stigma seems to have developed (IMO) around the Colts and Winchesters in this country where they were NOT customarily sent back to the factory for "freshening up."

I like the DL and if it's been done by WR - then I say you've got no problems. If it's done by someone else, then maybe I look at the Jeffery which has had less done to it.

25 December 2005, 01:40

RIP

The Westley Richards droplock without hesitation.

25 December 2005, 02:13

Mickey1

The Westley Richards, without a doubt. The Drop Lock is a beautiful weapon. The quality of the work is much more important than who did it when it comes to Brit rifles. Would anybody think a Holland and Holland was worth less because Purdey refinished the rifle?

Only in America is a piece of junk thought to be of more valuable than a redone rifle.

Also the Jeffery was not built by Jeffery but bought from a Birmingham maker. It means little that it is a Jeffery.

25 December 2005, 02:32

JPK

I responded with my thoughts on this topic in African Hunting but thought I'd second Mickey's opinion on refinished rifles. A quality refinish is just that, whoever did it.

I'm also of the opinion that a good portion of the so called "original" brit shotguns and rifles have seen a bunch of work before like reblacking... since this is just maintenance and was just the norm for the Brits.

And I have never understood the fascination for worn, untouched beaters when the same rifle with a quality refinish would be just as functional or more so and beautiful to boot.

JPK

25 December 2005, 03:32

LJS

Presuming both fit you and one doesn't have a lot better engraving than the other I would vote for the Westley Richards. Make sure they are both proofed for the max load. A lot of Jefferys are not and usually Jefferys are short barreled.

25 December 2005, 04:30

lb404

Both have 26" barrels. The sidelock is full british scroll engraving with a plain piece of wood. The Westley Richards has a kick ass piece of wood but no engraving that I can see unless it is on the cover plate for the droplock. I can afford the drop lock and in view of the fact that It may need to be shortened a bit, perhaps, a better value. The WR feels very good in the hand. The ballance is different from my English doubles and I shoot shorter barrels better anyway but this is a chance to own a great piece of history and gunmaking art. I have wanted a double rifle for 15 years and just haven't found the right one until someone else took it before me.

25 December 2005, 05:57

Pfeifer

For a student of the double-rifle... Anyone have a pict of a WR drop-lock action and what to look for on these wrt wear points, etc?
Thanks! Jeff P

25 December 2005, 07:59

500grains

You can see pics of various doubles, including WR droplock, in "Shooting the English Double Rifle" by Graeme Wright.

25 December 2005, 09:30

Pfeifer

500grains - thanks for the pointer. I have The Hammerless Double book but honestly haven't picked up in a while. I've wanted to get a copy of the Graeme Wright book for a while and this is just more incentive!

25 December 2005, 11:00

JPK

Mt bet. without looking at the rifles is that if the Jeffery has all the engraving and plain eood, well that seems the norm.

If the drop lock has really nice wood and no engraving, I think it might be a restock. That is no issue for me but for the originalist it would be.

JPK

25 December 2005, 14:28

richierich1

If you can afford them, get them both so you don't regret it later. Fine name brand doubles are good investment pieces that you can actually enjoy using...

28 December 2005, 21:44

LJS

I'm going to change my vote after looking at photos of both guns. If you can afford it, buy the Jeffery. It is cased and engraved which adds about $6K to the value. It is original which to me is worth about $5K and it is a sidelock. I think you will be able to find more Westleys at that price but I doubt if a Jeffery like that will be found as easily. I don't know the dealer who has the WR but George Caswell will deal if it is a cash transaction. I'll bet you can buy the Jeffery for about $39K.

29 December 2005, 04:33

Fungunner

The Westley hands down. The Jeffery could have been built by any of the makers as Jeffery farmed out all of the work to other makers. I must say that I am not a fan of the 450/400 rifles. If I am going to pay big money for a rifle, I want it to be one of the heavy calibers. Just my two cents.