Over the edge posts?

03 July 2003, 10:48

<GAHUNTER>

Is it just me, or have many of the posts on this forum gone off the deep end lately?

For example; Semi-Auto .50 BMGs for hunting; 500 foot-pounds of recoil rifles; etc.

I guess discussing the pros and cons of a .375 vs. a .416 is just too mundane these days. [Roll Eyes]

03 July 2003, 11:43

Canuck

Ya gotta get with the times, dude! Go XTREME or go home!!!

[Wink]

Canuck

03 July 2003, 13:00

N E 450 No2

Its one thing to GO EXTREME. [Eek!]

Its another to GO RIDICULOUS. [Roll Eyes]

03 July 2003, 13:26

Lawdog_Gary

N E 450 No2,

You're Right. Lawdog

03 July 2003, 13:34

jeffeosso

or we could point out the under rediculuous.

please explain the difference between these 4 or 5 more or less identical rounds...
404
400 hh
416 taylor
416 rem
416 rigby...

PICK ONE DAMN IT!!! and then buy another rifle and pick anouther one!!

sorry, rant off

jeffe

03 July 2003, 13:34

RIP

Look at it as levity.
Afterall, "overkill" is said to be an oxymoron by some. Others just chuckle, or tune it out.

03 July 2003, 16:39

<GAHUNTER>

Jeffe,

I have made the exact same argument before. A 400-grain bullet traveling 2400 fps is a 400-grain bullet traveling at 2400 fps, no matter what case housed the round. Who cares that one may be .010" bigger or smaller than the other-- certainly not an animal on the receiving end.

I chose the 404 for personal nostalgic reasons; not for any performance edge. Next big bore will be a .375, then a really big gun may follow (double rifle?).

Off subject, but your post touched a nerve.

Now, just what do you think of a full auto .50 BMG for warthogs, springbuck and other dangerous game? Would a 20mm firing depleted uranium be a better choice?

03 July 2003, 18:23

craigster

There's something very gratifying about a direct hit with a 5 inch 38 at 6500 [Big Grin]

yards.

04 July 2003, 04:32

rick3foxes

Now see there, Craigster - that's what the gentleman was talking about.

Everybody knows that a .38 with a 5-inch barrel ain't gonna shoot 6500 yards!

Sheesh. [Big Grin]

Rick.

[ 07-03-2003, 19:32: Message edited by: rick3foxes ]

04 July 2003, 06:42

MacD37

Horses of different colors, are what makes horse raceing fun! The ultra rediculous rounds, some like to build, are only rediculous where hunting is concerned, but very pleasing to the guy who simply likes to get the crap knocked out of him over a bench shooting at a hill side paper target, a mile away. Most of these so-called
"overkill" cartridges will never see the hunting field at all, but will simply live around a shooting ranges to "WOW" the by-standers. That fact does in no way negate their value to their owners.
These things are meant only to hunt with, in the minds of their owners, but will never be used for that purpose in reality! The value is in seeing if the builder can do it, and to have something nobody else has! I'm very glad these guys build these things, because it takes up so much of their time and money, that they will not be in the bush where I'm trying to hunt, with my 100 yr old double rifles, shooting a 400, to 600 gr bullets at the snail's pace 2150 fps. [Cool]

04 July 2003, 09:30

craigster

Just for those who might not know, a five inch thirtyeight is a navel gun that was used for many years (WWII, Korea, Vietnam) on US naval vessels, mainly destroyers. The 5 inch 38 is the naval caliber designation. The barrel length is 38 times longer than the bore diameter. Do the math and that comes out to almost 16 feet. And trust me, they are quite capable of direct hits at 6500 yds (and beyond). I've seen them in action more than a few times.

04 July 2003, 10:31

WyoJoe

quote:
Originally posted by craigster:
Just for those who might not know, a five inch thirtyeight is a navel gun that was used for many years (WWII, Korea, Vietnam) on US naval vessels, mainly destroyers. The 5 inch 38 is the naval caliber designation. The barrel length is 38 times longer than the bore diameter. Do the math and that comes out to almost 16 feet. And trust me, they are quite capable of direct hits at 6500 yds (and beyond). I've seen them in action more than a few times.

We had the 5" 54's on my destroyer. Recoil was fierce. Try to sleep during a 150 round rapid fire exercise sometime. Did you ever do gunnery qualifications off of Vieques, Puerto Rico?

04 July 2003, 11:36

<500 A2>

Would taking my 500 A2 elk hunting this fall classify as "over the edge"?

On a serious note, I am really thinking about doing this. Why, I guess I don't really know. I suppose I am just interested in seeing how much more effective the 500 A2 is than a 375 H&H.

Lucs

04 July 2003, 12:19

craigster

WyoJoe,
Never made it to the Carribean. The South China Sea only not on a boat. I was in the Corps and we had at times assistance from the tin cans patrolling offshore. Those boys could shoot. Once they dialed in, you might just as well kiss your ass adios or get the hell out of Dodge real freakin' quick.

04 July 2003, 12:28

N E 450 No2

500 A2
I think using your 500 for elk is a good idea, I use my doubles for all sorts of game from coyotes to bear.
What load and bullet would you use?

04 July 2003, 16:38

Grandpasez

Hunting with A-SG is just using a hopped up
50 cal buffalo gun, which many oldtimers and
new guys also, used on elk and bear.I will never
make the dough to get to Africa, but we will have our fun atomizing 55 gal barrels of water with
my 700 HE when built.This hobby isn't only the hunt, but the research, developement,and trying it
out.Even if off the wall.Ed.

04 July 2003, 18:08

Urodoji

quote:
Originally posted by MacD37:
The ultra rediculous rounds, some like to build, are only rediculous where hunting is concerned, but very pleasing to the guy who simply likes to get the crap knocked out of him over a bench shooting at a hill side paper target, a mile away.

I'm glad the average .50 BMG rifle has so little recoil. I've let 9 year old girls shoot mine, and they come away smiling every time.

04 July 2003, 22:43

Karl

The 50BMG wildcats to me are like a dragster where a hunting bigbore is a race car.

'Over the edge' is the amount of new posters lately defying the laws of physics.

[ 07-04-2003, 14:59: Message edited by: Karl ]

05 July 2003, 02:22

<500 A2>

NE 450,

I am thinking I would use the same load I did for buffalo. That being a 570 gr Woodleigh soft point and 123 gr of IMR4350.

Lucs

05 July 2003, 04:30

Mickey1

quote:
Originally posted by Karl:
The 50BMG wildcats to me are like a dragster where a hunting bigbore is a race car.

Karl

Shouldn't a hunting rifle be more like the family sedan? Starts every time, reliable. Not the fastest thing, not the prettiest around but always finishes.
[Smile]

05 July 2003, 17:49

Grandpasez

My family sedan is an Oldsmo-boat, with a hopped up rocket engine.Won't touch front wheel drive junk.Works like my wildcat cartridges.Big and
fast if needed.Ed.

07 July 2003, 07:21

Sabot

A some point Big Bores are really about numbers and not hunting, which is fine. I am interested in the numbers because they are at the edge of the envelope, and that is where the science is.

30 or 40 years ago the numbers were all about velocity, now its diameter, energy, and knock down. At the extreme, the application of these numbers to hunting is really humor.

The most impressive "portable" gun I have ever worked on is the 120MM Main Tank Gun launching 14 pound 80MM darts at 5600 fps using sabots. Accuracy is 0.5 meters at 4000 meters, and its a smoothbore. BC is over 2 and SD 1.4. Ammo is caseless, and light enough for a man to run with. The shock wave will take down birds out to 150M, so its pretty flexible in the hunting department.

07 July 2003, 07:56

Socrates

Saeed sort of set the precedent here with his videos of people firing the 577 T-rex, and various other heavy caliber guns.

It's the nature of wildcating to come up with what others think are absurd rounds.
500 S&W, 500 Linebaugh, 475 Linebaugh, 454 Casull,
458 Lott, most of the Remington Ultra Mags, all examples of what used to be wildcats that are now mainstream cartridges.

I think a large bit has to do with having game
not die when it should. Ray has posted about a cape buffalo taking 14 shots from 470 Nitro etc.,
and Seyfried had one take 6 shots from a 45/454 grade revolver, and die at his feet.

I strongly suspect such experiences make people want to design 577 T-rex's, etc.

Frankly the best reason in the world for huge rounds are lion, and elephant...

Plus, many of us have used mil caliber cartridges, like 105mm tank cannon, and A-2 Browning 50's, and, we all have wondered how well such a round would work on game..(not the 105mm)

s

s

[ 07-06-2003, 22:58: Message edited by: Socrates ]

09 July 2003, 07:23

<JOHAN>

quote:
Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
Its one thing to GO EXTREME.
Its another to GO RIDICULOUS.

NE
you are a very funny fellow. [Smile]

I guess that the go extreme is to own only doubles and the go RIDICULOUS is infact buy owning a overcomplicated, overengineered, dinky toy. I belive the make is BLA, bla bla model R 93 [Big Grin]

NOW, I would feel damn ridiculous hunting with a semi auto rifle regardless of caliber. For Mr." over ill" semi automatic rifles seems to be the latest kick. Man got to know his limitations [Big Grin]

Sabot, have you eve thought of useing a Carl Gustav recoilless rocket launcher for DG hunting. Penetration should be fine [Razz]

/ JOHAN

[ 07-08-2003, 22:28: Message edited by: JOHAN ]

09 July 2003, 07:41

N E 450 No2

500 A2
No reason why that load will not work great on elk.

JOHAN
With all the trouble forum members are having with factory rifles, and all the problems they have with rifles their "gunsmith's" work on, being able to get a rifle "out of the box" that has a good trigger, feeds, ejects, and extracts, is accurate, and you do not have to worry about the scope mounting holes being drilled off center,
etc. I think more of them should try a Blaser R-93 out. While nothing is perfect, I know of several Blasers that are being used with no problems, and excellent satisfaction.
It is the only rifle I know I could recommend to someone and not have to worry about them having any problems.

09 July 2003, 09:09

<JOHAN>

quote:
Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
It is the only rifle I know I could recommend to someone and not have to worry about them having any problems.

NE 450 No2
Say, I hope you haven't sold your doubles [Wink]

I thought that doubles was the rifles that would be the best in your book [Roll Eyes]

I guess there will be Monday in most factories regardless were they are located.

/ JOHAN

09 July 2003, 09:33

N E 450 No2

JOHAN I think double rifles are the very best for dangerous game, and I like them the best for any big game at 200 yards and under. However their high cost keeps many people from buying them.
If they buy a Blaser they will get a rifle with no problems. [Big Grin]

09 July 2003, 09:38

Michael Robinson

JOHAN (and NE),

I have two Blaser R93s in my toybox, and they are fun to play with. [Razz]

I may be immature, but my Blasers have never failed to function, are MOA accurate in all calibers (I have five different barrels) and have the bar-none best 2.5 lb. single stage triggers on earth.

I wish all of my toys were this glorified! [Big Grin]

10 July 2003, 09:10

<JOHAN>

mrlexma and NE

You to must have stocks in SIG by the way you two talk. Blaser is the worst POS in my world. Some people never seems to grow up or been taught mannors, I have heard that some these loonies uses this blaser [Big Grin]

THERE IS NOTHING LIKE AND GOOD OLD MAUSER; OLD AND RELIABLE [Big Grin]

/ JOHAN

10 July 2003, 11:26

Trapdoor

quote:
Originally posted by craigster:
There's something very gratifying about a direct hit with a 5 inch 38 at 6500 yards.

As a former FO for indirect artillery and mortars, nothing beats Steel on Steel! [Cool]

10 July 2003, 11:50

DickPal

So I guess my 45-70 is a little small for red squirrels!

10 July 2003, 17:30

Grandpasez

Depends on how many hormones your red squirrels
take.If ya like 45-70, hunt everything with it,
and load lite bullets, slower velocity, for smaller critters.It is a way to keep in practice,
for the big things.Ed.

12 July 2003, 05:29

Rick Koehler

quote:
THERE IS NOTHING LIKE AND GOOD OLD MAUSER; OLD AND RELIABLE

Johan, you sound a lot like a friend of mine. His favorite saying is "I like new technology, especially when it gets OLD!" I believe you and Joe would get along well.

Rick