I have looked everywhere I can think of, but can't find what the usual barrel length was on a Mauser Type A Rifles in 404 Jeffery. Is it referred to as an E type (for english) sometimes?

What were common barrel lengths on the 404 Jeffery's that were used so much in Africa? I would imagine they varied some between different makers, but what length was popular?

Especially the British rifles that were built on M98 action
and Mauser barrel. Like the Lothar Walther # 5130 contour barrel, which is supposed to be a direct copy of a Type E Mauser in 404 Jeffery.

Has anyone built a 404 Jeffery on a M98 action and used the LW # 5130 barrel?
If so what did it end up weighing without scope or rings?

From what I have been able to find the original Type A (E?) 404 Jeffery's weighed about 8.5 lbs.

What did some of the other 404 Jeffery's made by Vickers, Westly Richards, Cogswell & Harrison used by the African Game Departments tend to weigh?

Did they tend to be this light also?

Allen

On a page from a reproduction catalog of Jeffery, "Season 1912-1913" we see: "24-inch Steel Barrel"

The .404 Jeffery (1905) is the grandfather of all bolt action DGR's,
just like the 450 NE 3" (1898) is the grandfather of the Nitro Express double rifle.

8.5 pounds dry weight is perfect,
just like my 404 Jeffery Ugly Rifle:
M70 Classic Winchester, Brown Precision fiberglass stock, McGowen 24" barrel, 0.700" muzzle diameter, 1:10" twist.
I had to add lots of epoxy and hidden crossbolts to get it up to 8.5 pounds.


Look how similar the stock shapes are, in the grip and action area, between the original Jeffery's Mauser and my ugly rifle.
I prefer the lesser drop at comb (for scope use yet still able to use a peep) and fuller forend tip on mine.

quote:

Originally posted by AllenBosely:
What did some of the other 404 Jeffery's made by Vickers, Westly Richards, Cogswell & Harrison used by the African Game Departments tend to weigh?
Allen

Plenty of them are still in use by game departments today. Here's a well worn specimen carried by our game scout in Tanzania.



I'm having a 404 built on a Std M98 and the LW barrel you're considering. With a steel integral box/bottom metal unit, I think it will be difficult to get a finished rifle weighing less than 9 lbs.

Dear ForrestB:

Seeing an old classic rifle like that still in action is just plain cool.

Sincerely,

Chris Bemis

Thanks Rip,

On an 8.5 ld 404 Jeffery with open sight there wouldn't be anything (scope & rings) to add some weight.

I don't know if I would enjoy shooting an 8lb 404 a whole lot.

If one was to build an open sight only 404 Jeffery on a M98 action and used the LW #5130 barrel I think it would only weigh about 8.5 lbs. from what I gather.

I really like the #5130 contour, but dang it is light!

9.25 - 9.5 lbs would be a nice unloaded weight but since it would be an open sight only.
Can about 3/4 to 1 lb be added to the rifle and not mess up the balance?
How would a good way to add the weight and keep the it nicely balanced?

Allen

9.5 lbs is about what my Ugly 404 weighs with scope, rings and carry strap. Add 4 cartridges and it is barely under 10 pounds and a joy to carry and shoot.

It would be easy to add a mixture of epoxy and lead shot to the butt and forearm to perfectly balance at 9.5 lbs.
Or a mercury recoil reducer in the butt and the lead-epoxy in the forearm, under the barrel channel.
No problem.

I think you would soon fall in love with the recoil of 400-grainers at 2200 fps like the original,
in an 8.5-pound rifle.

Jeffery got everything right the first time around with the 404 Jeffery.

All other bolt action DGR's came after the 404 Jeffery and are poor imitators or blustery one-uppers.

My ugly rifle likes the
400-grainers at 2400 fps.
380-grainers at 2525 fps.
340-grainers at 2700 fps.
320-grainers at 2800 fps.

Ah Ok,
I was worried with that beautiful #5130 barrel it would be difficult to git it up to 9 lb or a bit and still keep it well balanced.

That sounds good.

Forrest, thats so nice to see a 404 Jeffery STILL in the field
where it belongs!

Allen

I am pretty sure that Heym makes an original contour barrel for the 404. You can ask new_guy here, he'll know for sure.

I have a LW 404 barrel, Recknagel bottom metal a sights waiting for an action.
I would like it to weigh around 9lbs with the barrel at 24".
I'm pretty sure the Heym 404's weigh over 10lbs.

Oz, you may be right. Now that you mention it, I do think it is Lothar Walther that makes the original contour...

Does yours have the integral sight bases? It's all coming back to me now.

My barrel has no sights and is of medium weight.
My supplier had a very light one but just tried to fined it on Walther's Web sight but can only find the one.

My custom made rifle weighs 10 LBS. It is a pleasere to shoot at 2125 with a 400 grain Woodleigh. My barrel is 26 inches long.

My M70 w/ 23" #5 weighs in just over 10# scoped & it has an 8oz merc. reducer in the butt. It's ok to carry, 9# is about right for all day carry, but a nice shooter though.

This early (1909) 404 has a 25" barrel, weighs 8 lbs, steel buttplate

This is interesting. These rifles came regulated with their own ammo and I doubt that the colonials that used them were going to the range and burning up ammo. If I had to carry somehting like this around for practicality and protection, I doubt whether the 2 or 3 rounds I fired a month would bother me that much.

On the other hand (or maybe it's the same hand), there's no way I'd shoot that thing off of a bench 20 or 30 times looking for a good load.

quote:

Originally posted by ForrestB:
..Plenty of them are still in use by game departments today. Here's a well worn specimen carried by our game scout in Tanzania.

Next in Tanzania please be a kind fellow, and spend the few bucks to gift him a decent pad for that 404j....

I looked at the 416 Ruger at their site and they say it 7 3/4lbs.

I think this is what you are looking for An original Type A 404 Mauser.

reddy375, thats really nice!

I didn't realize at first that it's a 404 Jeffery to boot.

How about some of the specs?

Allen

quote:

Originally posted by fla3006:
This early (1909) 404 has a 25" barrel, weighs 8 lbs, steel buttplate

Forrest,
Very interesting.
That must be the earliest format of the 404 Jeffery. My catalog is from "Season 1912-1913" which info I have added above.

Here is another variation found in Speed's Mauser book, pg. 229:

"Illustration and description of the .404 Jeffery Square Bridge Magnum Mauser rifle, from the catalogue of Mahomedally Noorbhoy of Bombay."

This one is not shown in the 1912-13 Jeffery catalog, but is called the "1912 Model" here, "24-inch Steel Barrel, Standard"
and
"Weight of Rifle about 8-1/2 lbs"
even for for the Magnum Mauser:



Jon Speed's book has some nice pictures and details, including both standard Mauser and "Single" Square Bridge Magnum Mausers.

Ron, I showed it to Jon Speed. He's not totally sure what it is. The serial numbers (Oberndorf & British) correspond to 1909-1910. As you know, development of the 404 began around 1905 but production was not until around 1910. Marked Eley 404 Nitro Express on top of barrel, not marked Jeffery anywhere, lots of British & German proofs, looks like an early Jeff or possibly one of the British retailers. I wish it could talk, has seen alot of use.