Wow!

The only time I have seen that was 16 ga Ammo fired from a 12 ga gun.

Brittle brass case heads split on firing.

quote:

Originally posted by Bobster:
Brittle brass case heads split on firing.

Neither one of those was fired.

The shells chambered then extracted??

Larry are those Winchester AA in 28Ga??
I shoot quite a few thousand of those every year. They have had a problem for awhile. I am sure i get a few of those in every flat of shells.
Just cheap brass

quote:

Originally posted by chas257:
The shells chambered then extracted??

Actually, I put them in the gun and could not close it .

quote:

Originally posted by Chris Lozano:
Larry are those Winchester AA in 28Ga??
I shoot quite a few thousand of those every year. They have had a problem for awhile. I am sure i get a few of those in every flat of shells.
Just cheap brass

That they are. Interesting.

I’ve had a few that way as well. WW AA-HS 28 Ga.

Given what they charge for them, the QC should be better...

If this happens with only this ammo, then it is the ammo fault.

If it happens with other ammo, then it is the gun's fault.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
If this happens with only this ammo, then it is the ammo fault.

If it happens with other ammo, then it is the gun's fault.

This

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
If this happens with only this ammo, then it is the ammo fault.

If it happens with other ammo, then it is the gun's fault.

One of the issues in making a determination is just how few times this gun has been shot. I am sure it is less than 100 times. Almost all have been with the same ammo.

I am trying to understand this. The shells look ok going into the chambers but when extracted unfired the heads and/or rims are split? If this is the case, looking at the scuff marks, maybe an extractor that is under size? I have fired at least 1 flat of the new hs shells in my 28 ga. double with no problems.
C.G.B.

Here is what happened.

I put new shells in the gun. I go to close it and it won’t close. Thinking it is me, I try again. Still hasn’t closed. I open the gun and notice the shells like the ones above .

As I recall, every one is in the bottom barrel.

I have fired less than a box of Remington’s through it . I do not
recall this happening with a Remington shell.

Could be too much extractor protrusion on the bottom barrel pinching the case head.

What is causing the scratches on the brass??

I don’t know .

I am going to take it to gun shop Saturday for their opinion.

Have you tried taking the barrels off the gun, seating ejectors, and dropping shell into the chamber? They should pretty much fall in. If you have any calipers or a micrometer measure the head diameter of the shells. Maybe a bad batch of oversized shells?
C.G.B.

quote:

Originally posted by cgbach:
Have you tried taking the barrels off the gun, seating ejectors, and dropping shell into the chamber? They should pretty much fall in. If you have any calipers or a micrometer measure the head diameter of the shells. Maybe a bad batch of oversized shells?
C.G.B.

Part of me thinks it is the shells. After all, they were not shot.

On the other hand, I don't see how a shell gets wrecked like these were unless there is some issue with the gun.

I think your idea is good. I'll try it tonight.

I would not be at all surprised if is the shells and I think you may will find the heads are not brass but brass washed steel as just about every shotshell is today. The AA-HS Winchester shells today are not the old AA, virtually indestructible, compression formed ones. I think it is likely these HS shells have brass washed steel heads, the old AA were genuine brass. Check with a magnet.

Currently playing around with loading 20 gauge for my 9yo grandson to whom I gave a single shot 20G for Xmas. Was given some once fired shells, Fiocchi, Gamebore and Kent and quite a few of these shells have split heads (all are brass washed steel). Only bothering to load 20G to make up some 3/4 ounce loads at 1150fps so my grandson can get used to recoil. The factory ounce loads I gave him with the light gun kicked the snot out of him.

Confirmed. It is the ammo.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Confirmed. It is the ammo.

Steel or brass heads?

Not sure. I'll put a magnet on one.

How did you confirm it was the ammo....and what was the issue. Inquiring minds want to know.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty Rifle:
How did you confirm it was the ammo....and what was the issue. Inquiring minds want to know.

I took it to a gun shop. It was inspected by a gunsmith who does nothing but work on over & under guns. He measured various things related to the chamber. Both barrels were consistent and in accordance with manufacturers guidelines. He inspected every moving part. He dropped rounds into each chamber. There were no areas causing binding.

He also inspected some of the damaged rounds.

His conclusion was that the gun was working as designed.

Thank you. It is nice to know the rest of the story.

Now the gun has been inspected and cleared I suspect the two rounds had unnoticed splits in the high brass/steel heads and the action of closing the gun has caused the head to split open binding up in the bottom extractor hence the scuff marks on the brass. Probably the split head has seen one side drop in front of the extractor thus prevent the action closing, looking at the shells in the photo seems to indicate this might have been the case i.e. something has levered the left side of the split heads forward, most pronounced on the left hand shell in the photo.
Fortunately you have not suffered a broken extractor.

Have you inspected the rest of any unfired shells for split heads?

No. All of these shells are 150 miles from here. I am going again in a couple of weeks. I’ll definitely check them then.

To be honest, I have seen some that look like that that have never been in the gun. I pulled them out of the box, looked at them, and cussed, and threw them away.

I probably should have saved them and sent the info back to Olin. I might have gotten some new shells out of it.

I have seen this happen in a couple other brands, but as examples of one- A federal 16 ga shell and a remington 10 ga shell... but a bunch of (like 3-4) Win AA-HS 28 ga.

It has happened to me in the HS410 ammo also. Not as many as the 28 Ga but more than a few