The Accurate Reloading Forums
World record Himalayan Ibex (Modern Day)
25 December 2015, 17:42
MAHDanish -- Holy Cow! Huge Congrats to you and Justin! He had a terrific hunt to say the least! Thanks for sharing the incredible trophies Justin took while in Pakistan. Fantastic!!!!
25 December 2015, 18:09
KathiOutstanding, congratulations to you both.
Kathi
kathi@wildtravel.net
708-425-3552
"The world is a book, and those who do not travel read only one page."
28 December 2015, 22:19
bwanamrmLooked to be a fantastic shikar! Congrats to all.
On the plains of hesitation lie the bleached bones of ten thousand, who on the dawn of victory lay down their weary heads resting, and there resting, died.
If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
Or walk with Kings - nor lose the common touch...
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son!
- Rudyard Kipling
Life grows grim without senseless indulgence.
29 December 2015, 00:28
SkiBumplus3Thanks for sharing. Pictures don't load on my computer!
ski+3
29 December 2015, 02:25
DocbillWhat is the fox type animal the hunter is hold? Is it the same as what is stretched out on the ground.
Thanks, the ibex is great looking and the hunting must have been an adventure.
29 December 2015, 04:22
ManuelMSimply outstanding, but that should be no surprise coming from you sir, Congratulations to all involved and thank you for sharing!
31 December 2015, 02:11
A.DahlgrenVery nice Danish!
We have AR member that shot a 48" in KVO a few days earlier
31 December 2015, 23:40
Pir_DanishThanks Anton,
Yes I know about the 48 incher and I have seen the official game department measurements of it but the bases of Justin's ibex are thickest ever to be entered in SCI which is what gives him 2 inches more then the 48 incher. Ofcource we have to wait and watch when the records are entered but the scores are not important. Both the hunters are gentlemen Shikaris and they had one hell of an adventure hunting the beautiful Himalayas of Pakistan like you did :-)
02 January 2016, 09:31
boarkillerHoly balls what a pig that boar
" Until the day breaks and the nights shadows flee away " Big ivory for my pillow and 2.5% of Neanderthal DNA flowing thru my veins.
When I'm ready to go, pack a bag of gunpowder up my ass and strike a fire to my pecker, until I squeal like a boar.
Yours truly , Milan The Boarkiller - World according to Milan
PS I have big boar on my floor...but it ain't dead, just scared to move...
Man should be happy and in good humor until the day he dies...
Only fools hope to live forever
“ Hávamál”
03 January 2016, 03:55
p dog shooterquote:
there is one ibex in SCI record book that is longer but that was shot more than 50 years ago when the game quality and quantity
Vey nice Ibex
but when does modern day records start 5 years ago 20, 30.
03 January 2016, 04:26
NakihunterCongratulations on an amazing shikar! Thanks for sharing
"When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick."
03 January 2016, 15:49
Pir_Danishquote:
Originally posted by p dog shooter:
quote:
there is one ibex in SCI record book that is longer but that was shot more than 50 years ago when the game quality and quantity
Vey nice Ibex
but when does modern day records start 5 years ago 20, 30.
The last ibex shot that was bigger then this was back in 1964. We cannot compare the game quality and population from those days. :-)
05 January 2016, 18:34
DesertRamWow! What a hunt!
_____________________
A successful man is one who earns more money than his wife can spend.
13 February 2016, 23:17
Pir_DanishThanks Desert Ram.
14 February 2016, 01:50
Vince HazenUnfortunately you have set some very difficult standards for our hunt this year. Cannot wait.
16 February 2016, 21:36
Steve416quote:
Originally posted by Kathi:
Outstanding, congratulations to you both.
Just caught up with this.
+1
19 February 2016, 13:05
EsskayDanish mian,
Absolutely amazing.
Warm regards
Saeed
26 February 2016, 00:30
MARK H. YOUNGWell done!
MARK H. YOUNG
MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES
7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110
Office 702-848-1693
Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED
E-mail markttc@msn.com
Website: myexclusiveadventures.com
Skype: markhyhunter
Check us out on
https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 01 March 2016, 06:35
Ellis PrairieJust curious how it happens that one hunter on one hunt kills a number one animal and three number two.
17 March 2016, 09:46
SliderExcellent
05 April 2016, 11:19
gryphon1quote:
Originally posted by Ellis Prairie:
Just curious how it happens that one hunter on one hunt kills a number one animal and three number two.
I imagine that the hog deer was taken with artificial light.
It seems that just about every photo of hog deer stags coming out of Pakistan seems to be taken.."after dark"
Posts: 87 | Location: Victoria Australia | Registered: 07 September 2002
15 April 2016, 17:25
Pir_Danishquote:
Originally posted by gryphon1:
quote:
Originally posted by Ellis Prairie:
Just curious how it happens that one hunter on one hunt kills a number one animal and three number two.
I imagine that the hog deer was taken with artificial light.
It seems that just about every photo of hog deer stags coming out of Pakistan seems to be taken.."after dark"
Yes thats right, almost all the Hog deers shot in its indigenous range of pakistan are shot at night with the spot light, the Hog Deers in this country are super nocturnal and their habitat is really thick thorny forest/bush on the banks of river indus, plus there is hardly any habitat left for this species due to deforestation and human population problem. these guys almost always come out at night to feed in the surrounding agricultural lands, at daytime the farm hands are out and about working the fields which is why the deers don't show up. we don't have enough forest areas on the river banks where the hog deers live.
16 April 2016, 00:07
gryphon1Where is the hunting in that?
That's not hunting at all taking Hog Deer in artificial light from the back of a jeep.
Posts: 87 | Location: Victoria Australia | Registered: 07 September 2002
26 April 2016, 10:41
Pir_Danishi assume you have never hunted outside Australia specially in Africa or Asia, hunting the Hog Deer in its natural habitat is way different then hunting them in Australia, England or texas, and they are very much nocturnal in India and Pkistan. people hunt leopards and lions at night with lamps in Zimbabwe because that is the only time those animals would come out. you can come to Pakistan if you like and try to shoot them during the day :-)
26 April 2016, 11:31
gryphon1Pir the deer are the same here,nocturnal if pushed hard and they are only allowed to be hunted during daylight hours.There are of course those that cheat here and use a spotlight and they are considered game thieves.
It is irrelevant as to where and what I have hunted as I like the rest of the AR world am entitled to have a say and an opinion.
But just in case you need to know I have hunted elsewhere. Sweden,Moose, Ireland Sika,and New Zealand,Tahr and Chamois with game taken,there would be more but without buckets of money life is tough!
Regarding the big cats being taken at night,that is not hunting it is shooting and nothing more.
Turning a light on when a cat is on a bait is nothing but target shooting,sorry but there is no other way of expressing it.
Most of us are in it for the hunting and true hunting is a real joy.
True hunters don't need their name up in lights and they don't need to take game in a light either.
There you go its my opinion...oh yes I did take a Hog Deer stag, certainly not a monster but he was taken in daylight!
But I`m up for the Pepsi challenge of taking a 'hoggy" in daylight...I`m a hunter!
Posts: 87 | Location: Victoria Australia | Registered: 07 September 2002
27 April 2016, 03:13
Pir_DanishI'm certain you are a hunter my friend but like i correctly predicted you have not hunted in Africa or Asia.. and ofcource everyone has a right of expressing their opinion. as they say different strokes for different folks..
according to the standards you have set of who is a true hunter or simply a shooter a lot of folks who have hunted big cats on bait are not hunters. who have hunted in Zimbabwe for leopards waiting all night in the blind are not hunters, who have used dogs to corner a Bongo in the rainforests are not hunters, who use trail cameras to determine if an animal is worth sitting in the blind are not hunters, who use feeders to shoot deer are not hunters. who use dogs to tree a mountain lion are not hunters, who hunt any introduced species is not a hunter, who hunt the nocturnal species of the world at night with a lamp because they simply do not come out in the night.
i mean where does the list end? there are some people who argue that using scopes on rifles is not fair, hell some say that using a rifle is not hunting and a true hunter should hunt with a bow and arrow.
you gave your opinion, my opinion is that I'm not so quick to brand people as 'unethical' hunters while having zero knowledge about the country, its hunting traditions, its habitat, animal populations, logistics, and many other factors. you have no idea about how small Pakistan is and has a population of 200 million which you cannot compare to australia and the vast wild areas you guys have there. in Pakistan all plains game species have to co-exist with humans sharing the agricultural lands and also dealing with the poaching problems. animals like the Hog deer has survived by adapting a very nocturnal behaviour.
so there you go,, my opinion is that a true hunter should get out of the shell and try to gain knowledge of hunting in other countries of the world without branding anyone and without assuming that the world should follow the same hunting techniques that they might think are unethical or ethical.
27 April 2016, 05:19
txsouthpawDanish, your reply was very succinct and I totally agree with you! Your hunt reports and comments are always concise and appreciated.
27 April 2016, 06:23
dogcatWEll said Pir.
Lets go hunt!
27 April 2016, 06:42
gryphon1quote:
like i correctly predicted you have not hunted in Africa or Asia.
So what! That doesn't qualify one for being a hunter..it means nothing at all..have a look at the Inuit or the many Aboriginal tribes..they probably haven't been there either,yet don't even dare question their ability.
Anyone can go to Africa and be catered for,whether fat,crippled,unfit, a poor rifle shot or whatever and come back with game.There is a niche for everyone.
I see whats on offer in magazines and internet sites for those less inclined to hunt but want the wall hanger anyway,all are catered for.
How does a bloke go to Sth Africa for one of the packages of 10 animals in a week and come home loaded...hmmm perhaps I should do so and you might think different of me.
Good hunters in any field will take game on any continent..... if the rest of the people that couldn't track an elephant through snow with bleeding feet can shoot all of these wonderful trophies then a good fit hunter will do so far more easily.
These pages are full of trophies people and helicopter shot Tahr and yes there are many on here that do hunt as in the meaning of the word and I take my hat off to them.
Show me a good Tahr hunter from NZ and he will show YOU how to hunt!
Don't even think that if you dropped him off in Asia or Africa that he wouldn't get the goose!
I come from a group that finds a set of tracks in bush country and follow them in anticipation of taking the animal that left them..it is part and parcel of hunting in Victoria.
It is indeed hunting and while it is so much easier to switch a spotlight on an unsuspecting animal it will never be considered hunting!Shooting yes,hunting no.
Would Karamojo Bell be so highly regarded if he had shot his 1500 elephants in a spotlight or those fellows that shot a 1000 Cape Buffalo?
Should we spotlight Polar Bear?
There are those that shoot 'trophy animals' in small ten acre pens (4.5 hectares)
I don't agree with it yet it is only MY opinion,worthless too as I havent 'hunted in Africa or Asia" ha ha.
Posts: 87 | Location: Victoria Australia | Registered: 07 September 2002
28 April 2016, 11:09
NakihunterFirst of all, let me clarify some cultural matters.
The name of the gentleman is Danish Ali - Pronounced "Dun-ish".
The prefix "Pir" is not his name. It is a local term of addressing a person or family of position / status etc.
Danish bhai, well said.
People do not understand what it is like to hunt in the subcontinent. In the late 70s & early 80s I hunted in India and never used a rifle. I did not have one, ammo was not easy to get and the villages were too close to the forest & scrub. Wood gatherers, cow herders & goat herders would be in the bush at unexpected times. Wood poachers are sometimes encountered at night.
Yes I shot a lot of squirrels and birds with hand made sling shots! It was definitely Hunting!
In the 1950s my dad shot 2 tigers with a 12 bore double gun using LG & slug. At night from a machan with a torch. On one occasion the tiger was well hit and started roaring in pain and rage and the machan was shaking. Dad had to hold on for his safety. Both tigers were cattle killer. It was definitely HUNTING.
Dad also shot 2 leopards with a rifle - 10.75X68 - open sights and at night with a torch. Both were stock killers. On both occasions he was seated on the ground among rocks and shot the 7.5 foot tom leopards at less than 20 meters. That was definitely HUNTING.
Dad also sat up for a leopard over a cow killed - at night. It was open country and so he decided to sit in a huge bamboo "basket" that is used locally to keep sheep & goats at night. The leopard walked up to the "basked", sniffed around, less than 6 inches from dad! Then it gave a growl and disappeared.
That was definitely HUNTING in my books. Never fails to make my spine tingle even 55 years after I first heard that story.
Yes the experienced Kiwi hunters are very good. They read sign, know animal habitat, navigate the bush & mountains well, carry out the animal on their backs. I have learned a lot from them and done a bit of it too.
But you do not see as much game here in the open like you do in some other areas of the world. Tracks are not disturbed and messed up. You do not see other humans around for miles and for weeks like you do in other parts of the world. It is much easier to track game here in NZ than in India. You do not have to worry about cow and goat tracks in most areas!
Finally my reading of Danish from his posts in the last few years is that he is not outfitting for the money. Hi father is a minister in the Pakistan government and is well connected. From the various photos I gather that his family connections run deep in tradition. Westerners would struggle to understand the implications of all that. Most would not have even a tiny clue .....
I just thank Danish for sharing his unique experiences and let us show him some simple courtesy.
BTW I do not know Danish personally & have no other agenda here.
"When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick."
28 April 2016, 12:40
gryphon1Spotlighting game animals some mentioned above by others that are part of the Big Five isn't on with me or many others at all..Geezuz! What next a rhino in the spotlight...because its dangerous game,come on!
Bull TAHR SHOOTING FROM A HELICOPTER!
Yet there are plenty of people that are ready to do it and pose with their 'trophy' and think nothing of it.
I do remember how Bald Eagles (YES) were being shot out of light planes in a magazine article in the `60`s..the Gov rightfully banned that but you can bet that those that did it thought of it as sport and not wrong!
I remember a huge polar bear taken in the movie High Wild and Free..the animal couldn't run another step after being chased for god knows how many miles with a snowmobile (or light plane) It is shot as its trying to take enough air in to run some more.
Yeah nothing wrong with that either eh!
Posts: 87 | Location: Victoria Australia | Registered: 07 September 2002
28 April 2016, 18:44
Pir_Danishquote:
Originally posted by Nakihunter:
First of all, let me clarify some cultural matters.
The name of the gentleman is Danish Ali - Pronounced "Dun-ish".
The prefix "Pir" is not his name. It is a local term of addressing a person or family of position / status etc.
Danish bhai, well said.
People do not understand what it is like to hunt in the subcontinent. In the late 70s & early 80s I hunted in India and never used a rifle. I did not have one, ammo was not easy to get and the villages were too close to the forest & scrub. Wood gatherers, cow herders & goat herders would be in the bush at unexpected times. Wood poachers are sometimes encountered at night.
Yes I shot a lot of squirrels and birds with hand made sling shots! It was definitely Hunting!
In the 1950s my dad shot 2 tigers with a 12 bore double gun using LG & slug. At night from a machan with a torch. On one occasion the tiger was well hit and started roaring in pain and rage and the machan was shaking. Dad had to hold on for his safety. Both tigers were cattle killer. It was definitely HUNTING.
Dad also shot 2 leopards with a rifle - 10.75X68 - open sights and at night with a torch. Both were stock killers. On both occasions he was seated on the ground among rocks and shot the 7.5 foot tom leopards at less than 20 meters. That was definitely HUNTING.
Dad also sat up for a leopard over a cow killed - at night. It was open country and so he decided to sit in a huge bamboo "basket" that is used locally to keep sheep & goats at night. The leopard walked up to the "basked", sniffed around, less than 6 inches from dad! Then it gave a growl and disappeared.
That was definitely HUNTING in my books. Never fails to make my spine tingle even 55 years after I first heard that story.
Yes the experienced Kiwi hunters are very good. They read sign, know animal habitat, navigate the bush & mountains well, carry out the animal on their backs. I have learned a lot from them and done a bit of it too.
But you do not see as much game here in the open like you do in some other areas of the world. Tracks are not disturbed and messed up. You do not see other humans around for miles and for weeks like you do in other parts of the world. It is much easier to track game here in NZ than in India. You do not have to worry about cow and goat tracks in most areas!
Finally my reading of Danish from his posts in the last few years is that he is not outfitting for the money. Hi father is a minister in the Pakistan government and is well connected. From the various photos I gather that his family connections run deep in tradition. Westerners would struggle to understand the implications of all that. Most would not have even a tiny clue .....
I just thank Danish for sharing his unique experiences and let us show him some simple courtesy.
BTW I do not know Danish personally & have no other agenda here.
I couldn't have explained it better sir. i have learnt a lot from kiwi hunters and have had a few hunt with me. it is useless in my opinion to argue with someone who has already made up his mind and passed judgement as to what is hunting and what isn't. :-)
@gryphon1: i respect your opinion although i disagree due to the above mentioned reasons. Best Regards, Danish
29 April 2016, 04:38
NakihunterDanish you do show your class my friend.
Gryph mate. Stop being a stroppy Aussie PIA just a bit. On this one you are not going to get any support from people who know the local circumstances.
You are doing little credit for yourself when comparing cat hunting with grazing herbivores. You might as well equate it to rabbit shooting or roo shooting. You are waaaayyyyy off with helicopters, bald eagles and stuff.
Firstly cats are apex predators. I doubt if you have seen an angry big cat. Even an American cougar is a pussycat compared to a leopard. Then step up to a lion & even more to a tiger. That tiger experience my dad talked about - he claimed it was the most frightening experience of his 45 year career in the bush. Far more scary than elephant charges at 20 meters stopping just short at 3 meters!!!
Just the atmosphere in those jungles is so different - it has a strange character to it that I do not feel in NZ. There is jus so much more life around - birds, small game, insects, frogs, bats, just everything. A lot more night sounds that keep your nerves on edge.
One HUGE factor you cannot understand is the twilight zone there is very short. At 5 pm you have shooting light & at 5.30 it is dark & at 5.45 it is as dark as 9 pm or 3 am! Dad shot one tiger when there was some light but it was dark by the time he got down from the machan! You cannot even imagine - let alone understand - this factor.
Spot lighting deer in the subcontinent is not the same as in Oz or NZ. In the subcontinent the deer live right among hundreds of thousands of people. Villages may be 3 to 10 km apart and each may have anything from 500 to 30,000 people. Trucks, cars, bikes, people etc. move around all day long. Many are inside the forest / scrub. These animals are not dumb. They are super wary & even under spotlight they just do not stand & look. Wild boar in those places are almost impossible to shoot under spotlight as their eyes do not seem to reflect as much as other animals. Trust me - I have tried it a heck of a lot. Yes, some people do shoot them at night. But no one tells you how many times they come away empty handed.
When these animals live around villages it is their normal habitat now in 2016! Very different to 19030s or 50s when the old books were written.
Cattle killers and big cats living around villages & fully familiar with human activity are impossible to even see in the day time.
Same goes for deer.
One day when Melbourne has a population of 10 million & the whole of Victoria has 200 million people, you will only hunt sambar at night. Even in their natural habitat they feed mostly at night!
Just think about it.
"When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick."
29 April 2016, 05:52
gryphon1NO naki mate,YOU stop being an Indian PIA just a bit.
Spotlighting cats is not fuggin hunting..period!
You can argue from the top of the tower all day and all night long but it will get you no where.
Spotlighting one of the most sought after deer species in the world is not hunting..period!
Chopper shooting Tahr is not hunting..period!
Spotlighting trophy game animals of the world is not hunting..period!
Especially with emphasis on the BIG FIVE!
Holy fuggin hell those much venerated old boys would die in their grave if they heard of someone shooting the big five in artificial light!
How would we think of Karamojo if he had spotlighted his 1500?
If you knew as much as you profess to you would acknowledge that and stop trying to defend it!
Quote
You are doing little credit for yourself when comparing cat hunting with grazing herbivores.EQ
Oh come on we are talking about hunting not shooting no matter what your personal thoughts are and what the particular animal is.
If I shot one of the Sambar stags around here in the spotlight you would of course any other time dismiss it as "spotlighted"
btw you don't need to tell me about sambar ffs..I live with sambar.. I stepped out the other night and at 79 yards from my door in the moonlight (full) was a stag feeding in the paddock three morns ago.Four other mature sambar were just down from him 103 yards from my door. Five others were feeding behind the sheds I walked up to them in the moonlight just to have a look.
Yesterday morning in remnant moonlight 1/2 hour before legit shooting time a stag walked across me heading to his wallow,I could have shot him with my donk! But didn't as I have respect for my quarry.
I see sambar just about every day although at pre dawn and in the moonlight as most wont step out of the bush in daylight and believe me they are already basically nocturnal here.
Its a real heads up for Swarovski bino`s btw.
--
Posts: 87 | Location: Victoria Australia | Registered: 07 September 2002
29 April 2016, 09:25
NakihunterHave you read Jim Corbet??
How many tigers & leopards did he shoot at night with a torch? How many more did he shoot from elephant back and / or with beaters?
Now don't tell me he did not hunt them.
And don't tell me that my dad did not hunt those cats in similar conditions just about 15 years after Corbet.
You are a bloody lucky sod & not a bad sort for an Aussie PIA!
Sambar at the door step - bloody show off!
"When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick."
29 April 2016, 09:34
gryphon1SIR James to me is JC.
Of course I have read(own) the lot.
He actually didn't shoot too many with a torch at all and if he did that torch would be lucky to illuminate any further than his feet,a far cry from today's 'set the world on fire torches'
Hunting tigers with beaters..fair game,not spotlighting.
Did Karamojo shoot his 1500 with a torch?
Posts: 87 | Location: Victoria Australia | Registered: 07 September 2002
29 April 2016, 09:58
NakihunterHold on - don't step into it again.
The torches of that era were big 5 cell Winchesters. My dad had one. He shot most if not all his cats with that. I think I have seen photos of Corbet with one. Some British Eveready torches were probably around but I never say any really old ones in 5 cell model. You also found some Winchester head lights with a 5 cell battery box - but extremely rare.
These 5 cell torches had a good shooting range of about 100 meters or so with a rifle. The batteries ran out pretty quickly. I remember using them for spotlighting hares - 7 pm to 4 am of intermittent use & being able to just about get by with 40 meters shot gun range.
"When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick."
12 October 2016, 23:50
Pir_Danishfor some reason the pictures disappeared from my posts, i am updating them. Regards.
