Check this out:

Source: Remington Arms Company

New Product Announcements: Remington Introduces New Model Seven Ultra Mag
and the New Remington Short Action Ultra Magnum Ammunition.

Remington is introducing the Model Seven! Now packing the punch of an
Ultra Mag! Ready for the hunting season, Remington's Model Seven will now
soon be available in 300 Remington SA Ultra Mag and 7mm Remington SA Ultra
Mag. Completing the package, Remington is also announcing the arrival of
two short action Ultra mag cartridges to compliment the Model Seven.
These new, beltless cartridges deliver both exceptional power and
accuracy. Now hunters get the same downrange velocity and energy they are
used to getting from a long action belted magnum and the light,
fast-handling ease of the legendary short action Model Seven.

This is an exciting time for Remington Arms Company, it's partners and
hunters throughout the country. Remington's Model Seven is the ultimate
easy-carry magnum rifle.

Remington has indicated that it will begin shipment of the Model Seven SS
in 300 Rem SA UltraMag and ammunition in September 2001.

I wonder who will win the market share, Remington with its short Ultra Mags or Winchester with catridges based on its WSM case?
BB

Hard to beat a two-year head start.

I have seen two uncomplimentary references to Rem Ultra brass. Can anybody decribe the problems? I usually buy Winchester brass, but I'm perfectly happy with my Rem .416 brass (when I can get it!)

Don

Well seems like it will be a race for the 7mm market on the short case, that's IF winchester also starts loading for their version before this season. A .338 should also be in the works.
BB

Where can I get some info. on these new Remington cartridges. Are there any articles or write ups on them out yet?

Why would Remington do such a pitiful thing? They could have just chambered their rifles in the WSM caliber.

I was talking with my gunsmith about this line of cartridges just the other day and he stated that Remington designed these cartridges several years ago, before the WSM line was developed- but was slow to bring them to market due to market conditions.
No manufacturer likes to build around someone else's cartridges if they can have something all their own. Of course, only time will tell which is successful on the market.
Personally, I really like the Model Seven rifles and hope they come out with some interesting chamberings. I'm just not in need of another 7MM or 300 Mag at the moment.- Sheister

I have to admit, I like the .300WSM idea, and I'll probably buy one some day, if it comes out in a rifle I like.

But now Remington? Chances are, these will have similar ballistics. Just seems silly to me. Every ri8fle manufacturer chamber .270 WINCHESTER, or 7mmREMINGTON magnum. Why can't they just get along...

The latest American Rifleman has a writeup on the new Remington cartridges. It says Rem was ready to introduce them but Winch. beat them to the punch.

I'm having trouble with the physics involved getting a cartridge that has approx. 15 grains less capacity to shoot at the same muzzle velocities with the same weight bullet. According to the article, that's about the diff. between the Rem Short Ultra and the .300 Win mag, but both are supposed to move a 180 grain bullet out a 24-inch tube at 2950-3000 fps. The SAAMI spec pressure for the new RP cart. is 65,000 PSI.

Either the Rem Short Ultra operates at higher pressure than the Win Mag, or the throat design is different, or something else is different. The "short and fat is more efficient than long and slender" argument has not been scientifically proven as far as I can tell.

The 7mm Rem Short Ultra has about 9 grains less capacity (water capacity, as I remember) than the 7 Rem Mag.

I wonder if there is enough market to support 2 varieties of short/fat cartridges?? If not, will we be able to to buy or form brass for our chosen cartridge 10 years from now?

If Winchester wants to kick RP's butt, they'll bring a .338 and .375 WSM to market NOW. Forget the 7mm until later; get the middle bores on the market and watch the rifles sell......

BigIron:

I don't have any figures to back this up, besides intuition, but I'll bet there are at least 5 7mm caliber rifles, and possibly closer to 10 to 1, sold for every .338 and .375 whether in the new short or older longer varieties. Of course, I am including all of the 7s. Therefore, economically speaking, either company would be crazy not to bring out the 7mm before, or at least at the same time as the larger calibers.

I would have to agree w/ Gat. Most people in the states hunt deer & who wouldn't want a short action, efficient 7mm "mini-mag" to hunt with? I think they should beat Win. to the stores w/ a 7mm & a .338SA mag. When Rem. gets their M7 out in 7mmSA mag, I'll step up & buy one in a synthetic stock. Would be a great high country rifle w/ enough punch to take elk in a pinch. If we were going to stick w/ the old tried & true, we would all still be shooting .30-30 & .45-70's. I see nothing wrong w/ trying something new.

Hello

<<The 7mm Rem Short Ultra has about 9 grains less capacity (water capacity, as I remember) than the 7 Rem Mag.<<

Sounds a lot like the 284 Winchester in principle. Sure made a hell of a 6mm!

Tom

I think winchester and remington copied lazeroni arms, he has had the short magnums long before they thought of them.

Frank,

In reality, they copied Rick Jamieson. He developed these cartridges many years ago and started this whole Short Magnum journey.

Bill

Took a look at the ballistics today:

300 Rem SA Ultra, 180 Partition 2960 fps

7mm Rem SA, 160 Partition 2960 fps

I think these cartridges are really sexy and I would love to shoot them, but I can't see much advantage over the standard length action 7 Mag and 300 Mag, except this: neither Winchester nor Remington make a standard length action. They both see the interest in compact rifles (a few years ago everybody had to have a quasi-tactical "sendero" rifle) and they need something hot to put into it, something better than a 7mm-08 or the commercially kaputt 284 Win (which flourishes as a basis for wildcatting but has leprosy in its original form). I've got a new M77 in 7 mm Mag and as much as I'd love a Model 7 chambered for a 7mm RSUM I think I'll pass. Too similar. Maybe shorter, maybe lighter, maybe not around in five years... I'm gonna let the dust settle first.

Maybe I am a dinosaur, but I fail to see much reason to sell what I got and go out and get a Short mag. I got a 30-06, and a 300 win mag and a 375 H&H and now a 416 Rigby. I don't mind a long action. They say the action weighs less. My 375 weighs about 7 1/2 - 8 pounds scoped and loaded. I don't want a lighter rifle. Cycle time? If I do my part on the first shot I won't have to worry about cycle time. If one needs an excuse to go out and buy another gun OK. This is as good an excuse as " I just want one and got the money". Other than that??????????? "D"

I'm having trouble with the physics involved getting a cartridge that has approx. 15 grains less capacity to shoot at the same muzzle velocities with the same weight bullet.

the case holds less but it achieves the same ballistic because the shorter wider powder colume alows the powder to burn more efficiently in less time.

I think it is all done with Fairy dust.

Please tell me that there hasn't been a time while climbing up the steep mountains like we have here in Idaho that we all haven't wished that we were packing something that weighed 7 pounds with a decent scope and packed the punch of a 300 WinMag or a 7mm Mag. Mmmm, sounds like a Model 7 in one of the new short magnums. I'm 6'2" and 260 lbs and work out 3-4 times a week and I'll be one of the first to get one on these little hummers!!!

I think from now on You can count me in as an oldtimer.

See no reason to replace the �06. 180 grs at 2700. 2850 in Norma, 2950 in "Semi Magnum" loading.

I like this discussions. After them I still like my �06 more.

Good Shooting!

Even to those who load expensive new chamberings! H

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Hello,
I am just not too excited about all these new rounds for two reasons. One, they are new. Looking through PO Ackleys book, you can find a number of then-new super-duper rounds that ran for a couple of years and then were dropped. Now those rifles are orphans. Case in point-222 Remington Magnum. I don't think I can name a single manufacturer who chambers 222 Rem Mag today. Wonderful round that did not stand the test of time.

As for the action length thing, I have hunted with short, standard, and Magnum, and although the short action is lighter, the extra weight of the others is for me, offset by my anticipation and excitement of doing what I was born to do. I do not "feel" that extra weight.

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Safety & Ethics,Accuracy, Velocity, Energy
Joe M